Please help a newbie with a Rebel XTi...

[derrickdehaan]

I am new to photography and just crossed over from a point and shoot. Wow, is

there a lot to learn! I like landscapes, portraits, and other general

photography, but my main purchase for this camera and setup was for my

hobby....marble collecting. Therefore, I take close-ups and lots of them. I

have the Rebel XTi, Sigma 17-70 2.8-4.5 DC "macro" lens, and the Canon MT-24EX

flash. I have the software that came with the camera as well as Photoshop

Elements 6. I shoot with a tripod using aperture priority and wireless remote,

but am not having much luck. Since the surface of the marbles are smooth and

reflective, I can see a "reflection" of what I am assuming is the lens. The MT-

24ex flash is a new purchase, and I thought that it would get rid of this

problem. I shoot from 8 to 10 inches away from the subject. Any help would be

appreciated. Great site!

 

Derrick

[clgriffin]

You might want to post an example of your image to better find an answer.

 

Spherical reflective surfaces are going to reflect something, even in a light box. But you might try a light box and see if that spreads the light enough, along with a polarizer to eliminate as much reflection as possible.

[derrickdehaan]

Thanks Charles, I had planned on posting a picture, but am away from the house at the moment. I will get one up. I will also add that I was in a home-made light box and had a U/V filter on. The lens was out at 70mm. I know my post is rather worthless without pictures, so I will get one up. Thanks again.

[tommyinca]

My 2 cents, A marbles is a 180+ degree fisheye lens looking right back at you. You won't able to hide yourselves. I would try cover everything else but the lens and light source opening with black cloths. The MT-24EX type symetrical lighting can only eliminate reflection from flat surfaces, not a fisheye surface reflection.

[james_gu]

I have idea that might help, but don't know how well it will work for you. If anyone sees a flaw or improvement that can be made, post away, and let's make a better solution for Derrick.

 

The idea involves a home made light box (with white, light cloth) and wireless flash. Stretch the light box in an elongated way, and shoot from farther away with a longer lens. This way, the reflection of your lens would be much smaller, and perhaps negligible. See schematic below.

 

Would this be an option?<div></div>

[tommyinca]

The reflection of white cloth won't be smaller.

[james_gu]

Point taken, the white cloth is going to show up no matter what, but at least it's more uniform.

 

An alternative solution would be...since the marbles are so reflective, why not make good use of this property and create some interesting reflection shots? For example, colourful marbles side-lit at dawn, on an aged stone pedestal, in a foggy forest....

[bobatkins]

Specular reflections are polarized. You could play around with a polarizing filter on the camera and one on the flash to see if you could minimize the unwanted reflections.

[derrickdehaan]

Great ideas folks. This is some very interesting info. I never stepped back and thought about these approaches. I would like to point out that these photos are used for identification purposes so the marble has to have great detail and be large enough to crop and still have a nice size.

 

The longer light box idea....hmmm. I have tried using a longer lens, but its a pain. Its a low buck Tamron 75-300 4-5.6, if I remember correctly. The filter rotates when zoomed. (please forgive my uneducated terminology)

 

I could get a cord for the hotshoe and since the 2 flash heads are removable, I could position them over a light box. Or...

 

Buying photo equipment requires me to rely on the internet. I live in a super small town, so visiting a shop and talking, looking, or trying before buying is not an option.

 

Thanks,

 

Derrick

[derrickdehaan]

here's a photo taken without the MT-24ex, but the same problem is there.

[steve torelli]

Why not just eliminate the flash altogether and shoot in natural light, even indoors with a more diffused light or a sunny room ? Use of a polarizer would help with any glare and reflections.

 

Also a true macro lens would make your life easier, the word "macro" on a zoom lens just indicates a more close focusing ability, your lens won't give you 1:1 macro like a Canon 100mm 2.8, for example. Good luck.

[bob_osullivan]

Derrick:

 

Thanks for posting such and excellent question. I get so tired of the "which lens should I buy questions"

 

Anyway, you have stumbled upon one of the most vexing photographic roblems. And it is one without a complete solution. But you can minimize this problem with some planning.

 

First, a marble being sperical, will always reflect you and your camera lens direcly in it's middle no matter where you position yourself.

 

Also, depending on the material (stone vs glass)it may be yeilding either direct refelction, polarized direct reflection and even a bit of diffuse reflection. You can google all those terms to learn more.

 

If you are getting a lot of polarized reflection you can minimize that with a polarizer. But for the same reason Polarizers don't work on metal, you may find this does not work.

 

There are two very practical ways to deal with this.

 

1) make the offending reflection as small as possible by using a long lens.

 

2) hide yourself, all background elements and the camera iteslf. The simplest way to do this is to hang a white sheet with a hole cut out only as big as the lens. The resulting reflection should be just a white background with a small black cirle. It should be barely noticable. Alternately you could also use a black sheet. IT depends on the colors and surface of the marbles.

 

I have encountered similar challenges shooting cabinet door knobs of highly polished steal. I'll try to dig up an example and post it later.

[derrickdehaan]

Steve, I realize that my lens is not a true Macro and will upgrade when $$$$$ allows. I have had decent luck without flash, but I cannot get much of the interior "action". Perhaps some light from underneath or behind the marble.

 

I greatly appreciate all the info and ideas. I will go back and do some trial and error.

 

Its funny, I wanted to ask this question long ago but felt rather intimidated by the knowledge on this site. What a great bunch of folks!

 

Cheers,

 

Derrick

[bob_osullivan]

It just occured to me, if you have a few buck to throw at this problem you can buy a ready made dome tent or something like this.

 

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/347666-REG/Cloud_Dome_CD159012_Cloud_Dome_90mm.html

 

Don't waste money on better flashes though. No matter how you light a sperical object, your camera will always reflect dead center on it. It's physics and cannot change. Good luck.

 

I'm going to buy some marbles tomrrow and experiment with this myself. I'm sure somethign like this will come up for me again in a product shoot. If I come up with anything more helpful I'll add it to this post.

[bob_osullivan]

More stuff to check out.

 

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/shop/1410/Shooting_Tents_Domes_Tents_Domes_Blinds.html

[derrickdehaan]

Thanks for the links Bob. And if you do try photographing marbles, I'd love to hear about and/or see your results. The dome may be a great idea. Unfortuneatly, funds are pretty tight as we are in the middle of a new house purchase.

 

And as a side note, I must say that not only have I been bitten by the photography bug (I pack my camera everywhere with me), the photography world as a whole has been a great bunch of people that seem eager to share their knowledge!

 

Derrick

[james_gu]

how about <a href="http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.5224">this one</a>. It's much cheaper.

[trebor_navilluso]

Derrick:

 

Welcome to the community. The main problem in your sample shot was just that the flash was harsh and pointing directly at the marble. Try using only reflected/bounced flash of whit walls or through tent as previously mentioned. Also a white poser board placed very close to the side of the marble will give a nice white highlight on that side, and a black card placed at the side will have the opposite effect. Experiment with this based on the coloring and texture of the finish.

[rogerleekam]

Have you tried bounce flash? As you probably know it's the simplest technique for light diffusion. Just aim the light at a light floor or ceiling and it should minimize, if not eliminate, the hard reflections.