Best built cameras.

[don_e]

And also, steven, using them for decades sometimes.

[Andy Collins]

I'd have to agree with the Canon F-1. When you use up the film in it, you can use it as a construction tool.

[richard_oleson]

Actually, my comments were based on disassembling them - I've never owned an M3 myself. I've been inside a lot of the other cameras mentioned and they are not the same.

 

My PERSONAL favorite is the Olympus OM1, and I'll happily put it up against a Nikon F, Canon FTb, Pentax Spotmatic - maybe even a Rollei F for overall design and build quality. But against an M3.... well, no.

[kelly_flanigan1]

After infant problems are fixed many consumer items are great. Its easy to forget the Nikon F2's shutter tearing issues if you never owned a first offering; or a Pintos gas tank issue either. Or if you owned an earlier Signet 35 with the older shutter pawl that tended to hang; instead of the revised one. Some of the first mid 1970's mini Nikons FM had infant shutter issues; they jammed and were once considered to be like a Nikkorex F; total crap. Like a new first year car much of these problems are quickly solved; and later year buyers are insulted when one mentions these past issues. Today new folks to photograpy list the Nikon F2 as a well built great camera. The one I bought brand new when they first came out lived in the Garden City repair depot under warranty repairs several times until its bugs were fixed. Here I own a Nikon F I bought used in 1962 thats never had a CLA yet; but repair chaps want to add foam where there is a damper cord. Maybe in 2020 ipods in for repair will have rotator-splints added?

[vincenzo_maielli]

Rolleiflex 2.8F - Rolleicord Vb - Hasselblad 500 CM - Hasselblad 503 CX - Pentax 6x7 - Mamiya RB67 - Mamiya C220 - Mamiya C330 F - Leica M3 - Leica M4 - Leica M5 - Leica M6 - Leica M7 - Leica MP - Nikon SP - Canon 7s - Zeiss Ikon Contarex series - Leicaflex SL - Leicaflex SL2 - Nikon F Photomic FTn - Nikon F2A - Nikon F2AS - Nikon FM - Nikon FM2n - Nikon FM3A - Topcon RE Super - Topcon Super DM - Minolta SRT 101 - Minolta SRT 303 - Minolta XM/XK - Pentax Spotmatic series - Pentax KX - Pentax MX - Canon F-1 Old and New - Canon FTb QL - Canon EF - Contax RTS III.

Ciao.

[sw12dz]

Brownie Hawkeye! All Leicas, excluding the M8 Digital. Just about any Rolleiflex/Rolleicord.

[JDMvW]

I am staggered by the lists. For the most part I think collector reputation and cost have been way overemphasized. I wonder what reason almost all the professionals had for going to the Nikon RFs and then to the Nikon F?

 

Of course we know how it all went. Great reliability on the part of European-made cameras was the reason why the German and European camera industry dominates the world of photography today. (not)

 

Definition of "Leica" -- "any camera owned by a medical doctor" JMvW's Devil's Dictionary of Photography.

[richard_oleson]

JDM, I think price had something to do with the ascendancy of the Japanese industry over the German.

 

The Nikon raqngefinders and SLRs, and my own favorites the OM series, are excellent and high quality cameras. But if you disassemble them and then a Leica M3 you will see that they are built differently. This doesn't mean that they are not as reliable or rugged, but if you had to choose one as "The Best", the Leica would win.

 

I mentioned that I have never owned an M3... this is for the same reason as many others: it is too expensive for me, for what it returns in value. But this is not the same as saying that I think the Nikons, Canons, Contaxes and Olympuses that I do own are better pieces of machinery. I don't drive a BMW either, but I respect it.

[dennis_w3]

Topcon Super D, RE Super, followed by Canon F1.

[dean_williams]

Nikon F/F2. Leica IIf/IIIf. Voigtlander Vitessa. As far as fit and finish, the Vitessa has it over just about anything.

[patrick_lewis2]

Go topcon! I work for them!

 

This is way old, but I have a Kodak 3A model B-4. It is over a hundred years old, I think, and the shutter still works from one second to 1/100th, T, and B without problems. No light leaks in the bellows, either! Amazing craftsmanship.

[tony_lockerbie]

You know Gene, most of the Dianas have stood the test of time but the Holga and Dick Tracey....we'll have to wait and see!

 

The Diana will soon cost as much as an M3 anyway.

 

Tony

[waite_watson]

If 'standing the test of time' is the criterion,the the answer is the Argus C3.No other camera of it's vintage (never having seen a CLA) will still work in as great of numbers as the C3!It my be due to it's simple design rather than 'build quality' but that it has in fact withstood the 'test of time' better than it's 'better' built contemporaries is pretty obvious.

[classcamera]

Okay, as a person that takes his cameras apart and plays with them, here is what I think:

 

The absolute best made camera in the history of the world, period: Contax IIa, black dial. No other camera has the level of quality put into the parts and workmanship. Every part is a work of art. All screws are plated, the body casting are smooth, the gears are plated and polished. There is not a single Leica model that has the anywhere near the level of built quality of a Contax IIa. Like a friend once said--"Leica is the Chevy of cameras, Contax is the Rolls Royce!"

 

Next on the short list is, at da--Rolleiflex letter models pre F, and post B.

 

Any are good bets for built quality, the have the same polished plated parts like a contax, but they still have some painted metal parts that can rust, and some unplated screws. Overall they are hard to beat. I can't throw in my vote for the F models because they are so poorly engineered, in the early models, and by the time they straightened out the engineering, they started cutting corners on materials. Then they went belly up--go figure.

 

Zeiss Ikon Super Ikonta B 532/16 These are the pinnacle of folding cameras. Like the contax, the Ikon guys did not cut any corners on these cameras. Excellent design, and great workman ship.

 

Having worked on most of the cameras that are getting recommended, gives me a bit of an advantage, since I see the inside as well as the outsides. What will leave me really impressed is fit and finish. So many cameras have nicely made parts, only to have poorly made screws (Nikon and the eqoxying of screws that are too small to make them work), or nice screws and holes that don't line up. Nikon rangefinder cameras have neither (nice screws or holes that line up), but sell for more than many leica products and Contax cameras. All Zeiss and Rollei products have good screws and all the holes line up, in fact the tolerances are so tight that they don't need thread lock in many cases, even on parts that vibrate.

 

If you want the best go Zeiss or Rollei, and you will never look back.

[patrick j dempsey]

I find it a little funny that cameras are being rated as best-built by people who had to take them apart to repair them. ;) I agree with the early Kodaks as well... like the big Polaroids I mentioned, they were built to last. That Compur shutter on a Rollei is bound to seize up if it sits for long enough. A Kodak ball-bearing shutter or even the old rotary box-camera shutters have sat on shelves for 80+ years and then fired right away when picked up. Argus C3 has a similarly dependable shutter, and the chromed face and back of the camera look like they came off of a Buick and you could probably beat a Leica into small peices with one. ;) There's a motorcycle museum up in Maggie Valley NC that has a Harley built in 1910 that has NEVER been rebuilt, and sat for decades without running. When the owner of the museum bought if off of the previous owner, he emptied the old fuel out of the tank and put fresh gas in it and it started right up. Purrs like a kitten. Show me a motorcycle or car built today that can sit in a shed for over 80 years and just start right up like it was nothing.

[LMar]

Target Hawkeye 620; Leica M-3 and M-2 (inexpensive and not so).<div></div>

[LMar]

Target Hawkeye 620.<div></div>

[classcamera]

Here is an interesting take on Patrick's Harley Story above. How many Harley's from 1910 still survive, and how many were made? I am guessing that the one mentioned is the only one in all original condition, and still runnable. So lets just guess that they made 2500 similar cycles in 1910, and of those one is all original and still running! That is .04%. Not very good by my measure, and really a poor advertisement for there quality. Also did this particular motorcycle have any oil changes, or tire changes in all those years? or was the oil allowed to dry and gum up then the gas changed, and run with sludge? My guess is that there was some sort of regular maintenance done to this motor cycle, as well as having the ignition components changed. So, when you say that the Compur Shutter in the Rolleiflex will stick without use, this is true, however as with the motorcycle, cameras no matter how good will require maintenance--an oil change so to speak. Does the fact that the parts are lubricated and require oil diminish the built quality--heck no. Nor is the quality of a Bugatti, or Rolls Royce, diminished because it has to have an occasional oil change. With Rolleis the vast number and quality of the "survivors" put the company out of business; why buy new when the old is better and cost less? Can that be said for Harley Davidson?

 

Oh getting back to the Kodak cameras and the ball bearing shutters. those are good shutters but they are not particularly accurate. The thing that hampers those cameras as "super quality" is the lens, and the overall fit and finish of the camera body. Those Rapid Rectalinear lenses are probably the lowest in contrast of any lens mass produced. I once shot some nighttime photos with one and had to give standard development so I could get enough contrast--at Night!

 

Contax IIa and Rollei still the undisputed champs.

[tony_lockerbie]

Mark, that's a very interesting take on the quality issue. Obviously a good way to check the build quality is to disassemble the unit, bare it's guts so to speak.

There is more to it though. There is that something that makes a camera seem special, and that is the tactile sense that you get when you pick it up and use it.

Leicas of all ages have it, as does the Zeiss Contarex and of course, the Rolleis. A Nikon F is obviously extremely solid and well built but doesn't quite have the feel of a Contarex. That said, if I wanted a reliable camera to take out and photograph with I would choose the Nikon every time.

 

The Contax is certainly a beautiful thing, and one of the all time classics, but I have never found one that works properly. I in fact gave up on them and bought a Kiev 4 to which I placed the 50mm Sonnar lens, it works fine, if a little like a tractor!

 

The Kiev works but doesn't have that feel.

 

Thanks for all your ideas,

 

Tony

[mark_sampson]

Linhof Technika.

[anthony_brookes5]

I have not had a happy experience with Rolleis. Both my 3.5F and 2.8F went wrong, the first with shutter speeds not working and the second with the crank mechanism. The repairer said they were both faults known to him so I was not alone.

[alan_rockwood]

How about Crown Graphic as a dark horse pick? Maybe it doesn't have the precision engineering and construction of a Leica, but they were cleverly designed and could take a beating and still keep working. By some measures that would qualify them as a contender for "best built". Besides, although you didn't include image quality in your selection criteria, most any 4x5 with just a half decent lens will outperform any 35mm camera with even the best lens available.

[classcamera]

Tony,

 

The Contax camera you want is the IIa/IIIa. That is the post war camera with the smaller body and flash connection on the back. If you really want to shoot one, give Henry Sherer a try. He is probably the foremost Contax specialist in the US, if not the world. As for problems with Rolleiflex cameras, they do require maintenance, just like your daily driver car does. When properly maintained they should give 10-15 years of service, without problems. Or put a little differently, they require a Good CLA about every 15 years. That Said so do Cannon, Pentax, Nikon, Olympus, Minolta, Graflex, Topcon, Leica, Contax, Contarex, Icarex, Petri, Kodak, and any other camera that you can name. Same with cars, boats, planes, trains, weed wackers, chain saws and any other mechanical device made. What decides built quality for me is, when maintained how rugged is the item, and how many years of service will it give. My 55 year old Contax, 52 year old Rolleiflex, and 70 year old Super Ikonta B, are all still working fine!