External flash: sigma or canon?

[martijn_houtman]

<p>

Thinking about buying an external flash for my 30D. Using it to get accustomed to flash photography, I

will eventually use it for indoor shoots. I've been looking on the forums here and elsewhere, and I think

that my choice is now boiled down to two flashes: the Canon 430EX and the Sigma EF 530 DG ST. They

both fit my budget, yet there seem to be some differences.

</p>

 

<p>

A list of things I am not sure about how it works:

 

<ol>

<li>

Manual mode: I want it to have full manual mode, because this way I can fiddle around and gain full

control so I can learn and experiment more.

</li>

<li>

Tripod mounting: is it easily possible to mount an external camera flash to a tripod? Do I need a

hotshoe mount unit which sits between the tripod and camera flash?

</li>

<li>

Cord or wireless sync: I know the Canon can only be a slave. It appears the Sigma can be a master as

well, but does this mean it can only be a master for other Sigma slaves? And how about non-wireless

sync: they both seem to lack a PC connector, so does it mean I have to buy a rather expensive hotshoe

extension chord?

</li>

<li>

Softbox: I also want to do some basic portrait photography and would like to play around with

softboxes and other diffusers. What are my options for an external flash like these?

</li>

<li>

Power: I don't really think I will notice the difference in power that much, although I read that when

using diffusers, the power difference becomes rather noticable. Is this true?

</li>

</ol>

 

<p>

I would also like your general opinions on Canon vs. Sigma, even though they depend on usage. Thanks

in regards!

</p>

[anson_ko]

Get canon. Me and my friend were doing a casual model shooting with a friend. After 2 hours continous shooting with flash, his sigma flash overheated. The flash back was hot and after it cooled, it wouldn't fire again (replaced the battery). My 580 kept going. It could be a bad sigma copy. Just my experience on sigma flash. I have three canon 580EX flash and they all working.

[bueh]

The Canon covers all AF sensors with its AF assist light, the Sigma only the central spot. For me this is pretty important and since it applies to all third-party strobes, I will only get Canon gear.

[mark u]

Bueh frequently recommends a 380EX as a cheap option - which only covers the centre point with AF assist.

 

The Sigma 530 models are too new to have much track record as yet. They seem to be modest upgrades of the 500 predecessors. However, if you are going to consider a Sigma, I think you should look at the DG Super, which has a lot more functionality - including manual power down to 1/128th.

 

Both Sigma and Canon come with a cold shoe stand - I think in both cases this can be mounted on a tripod bush.

 

The Sigma should be capable of acting as master to Canon Speedlites as well as other Sigmas. Reliability of optical master/slave control has limitations compared with using radio triggering. An off shoe cord is highly recommended if you intend to use the flash either for macro work or on a bracket for e.g. wedding work. Of course, as soon as you mount a flash away from the camera hotshoe, the utility of AF point illumination rapidly falls to zero regardless of the supposed AF point coverage.

 

If you really want to start using larger softboxes etc. then maybe you should consider adding more powerful studio strobes - I'd suggest you do some research in the Lighting Forum about the art of studio lighting in the Lighting Themes, and then considering what equipment you may need to achieve what you aim for. Aim to keep things simpler to begin with, both for your budget and so you learn how to use light to good effect.

 

You can fry most shoe mount strobes by shooting them continuously - the new 580EX II is supposed to be an exception, but it tries to prevent burnout by simply shutting down altogether when it considers it is being overused. If you intend to indulge in high volume continuous shooting then you should as a minimum have pairs of flashes that you swap between every few minutes - or you should again be considering studio strobes (though these too can have some limitations on continuous use).

 

You may find these notes on the earlier Sigma 500 compared with a Canon 550EX useful:

 

http://photonotes.org/reviews/sigma-ef-500-super/

[steve_dunn2]

<p>I can't add anything to most of this, but can at least partially answer the question about tripod mounting. Canon flash units which function as wireless slaves (including the 430EX) ship with a plastic foot to help you use the flash when it's off the camera. This foot has a shoe on top (with no contacts) so you can mount the flash in it. It has a large enough base that you can set it on a flat surface and the flash won't fall over. And there's a standard tripod mount in the bottom, so you can mount the flash on a tripod. As I don't have a master, I haven't played with this, so I have no idea how durable the threads are.</p>

 

<p>I can't speak to whether the Sigma includes a similar device. I'm sure there are third-party tripod-mountable shoes available, as this is not an uncommon sort of thing to want to do, and it's a relatively small and uncomplicated device so it shouldn't be expensive, either.</p>

[w_t1]

Ive also used the heavier rubber bands to hold external flashes to light stands, tripods etc.

[jimstrutz]

I'm pretty sure the Sigma has the table top shoe mount that Steve referred to. I know the 500 Super did. It has a tripod screw hole in the bottom so mounting it is no problem.

 

Also, on the earlier 500, the ST model did not do wireless at all. You had to move up to the Super to get wireless. I used it to be a master to a Canon 550EX, and vice-versa, but the 550EX's controls were a lot easier to use, especially as a wireless master, so I preferred to use the Sigma as the slave. In any case, I would make sure the new 530 DG ST really is wireless capable. I suspect it isn't.

 

I would get a Canon Off Shoe Cord with either one. Unless you have an ST-E2 sitting around, the cord is a cheap way to move the flash to a bracket, or hold it in your hand, etc.

 

I used these with umbrellas, flash/umbrella mounts, and light stands with good results. You end up using ISO 400, or even 800 most of the time, but the effect for portraits was quite nice. Soft boxes eat more light, take longer to put up & take down, and cost more. The soft box effect can be nicer sometimes, but the hassles of mounting them made them harder to deal with for location shooting. I think soft boxes are better suited to studios with larger lights.

[zigzag]

If you haven't already take a look at the <a href="http://www.strobist.blogspot.com/">Strobist</a> website and particularly the Lighting 101 section. There is all sorts of info there about cheaply achieving outdoor and studio lighting effects using flashes. Even if you do elect to go the whole hog and get the 'correct' studio gear, reading the site will be a useful thing to do. <br><br>Today my el cheapo <a href="http://cgi.ebay.com.au/4-Channel-Wireless-Flash-Trigger-V2-f-Canon-580EX-430EX_W0QQitemZ160175775830QQihZ006QQcategoryZ30088QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem">Wireless remote</a> arrived from eBay. I cannot tell you too much about it yet other than it works and feels as if it worth every cent of the $29.99.

[jason_hall4]

The stobist web site the Glan mentioned will be of the most value to you. This type of lighting is what they are all about.

 

For all manual shooting you are better off with vivitar 285HV flashes. A mere $89 each and the modifications you can make are endless.

 

But what ever you do. CHECK OUT STROBIST LIGHTING 101!

 

Softboxes and on camera stobes don't mix well. They eat up a lot of power.

 

Jason

[todd_masters]

I have had the Canon <a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=130170478906&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=003" target="_blank">420EX</a>, 550EX and <a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=130170463359&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=003" target="_blank">Sigma 500</a> and have used them in many shooting situations. <br>

1. Manual mode: both have it - you will want manual <br>

2. Tripod mounting: both come with a stand with with a standard tripod screw hole on the bottom to mount on a tripod (the canon is all plastic while the sigma ups it a notch with a brass fitting)<br>

3. Cord or wireless sync: the sigma (canon version) is a copy of canon, I had the <a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=130170478906&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=003" target="_blank">sigma 500</a> instead of another 550 in various master/slave combos and with the ST-E2. I also got a $5 PC hotshoe mount when I cabled it up and you can also use the "<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/Wireless-Flash-Trigger-for-Canon-580EX-430EX-171_W0QQitemZ160176894337QQihZ006QQcategoryZ30084QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem" target="_blank">ebay wireless</a>" radio triggers for a cheap alternative as well (they work really well actually). Depending you your needs you may end up going radio wireless, but starting with ETTL infrared is a good start.<br>

4. Softbox: I used mine in a softbox, shoot through umbrella, bounce umbrella and other set ups. OK for small portraits less than 20 ft away but not enough light for bigger sets. When I needed more light I rubberbanded two flashes together in a softbox to double output.<br>

5. Power: You won't notice the power difference that much.</p>

<p>as for build quality, Canon will feel more solid but my Sigma has lasted just fine and is almost like new still. I usually try to save money on these things and spend more money on glass. Let me know if you have more specific questions as I have probably done everything with these setups and flashes (just not with the newer models). </p>

[martijn_houtman]

<p>

Wow, thank you all for your comments, this is really helpfull! I am now reading the Strobist

Lighting 101, which learns me quite a big deal.

</p>

<p>

I am still pondering about whether to go Canon or Sigma, and exactly which models. The

experiences vary too much to get to a conclusive answer, so I will read on a bit more.

</p>

<p>

On a side note: the Lighting 101 page says you'll probably need a PC connection, but it

seems both of the above flashes lack it. Too bad, because hotshoe cables are very short

and relatively expensive, while PC cables are rather cheap and they can be very long.

</p>

[jimstrutz]

You can use a PC sync cord with either if you buy a PC to hotshoe adapter for the flash's end. They're cheap, and of course, so are the PC sync cords. You will be reduced to manual flash exposure, but I don't find that a problem.

[mark u]

The disadvantages with PC connections are that the plugs and sockets get bent out of shape, reducing connection reliability and risking falling apart; wires trailing across the studio become tripwires; you lose flash functionality (OK if you are happy to work exclusively with manual power); splitters used for multiple flash setups often add to unreliability.

[samhayward]

<p>Hi all - Glad I stumbled on this page, I am similiar to Martijn and next i will be off to strobist. Before i do though. I have just returned the EF-530 DG ST to Amazon. The hotshoe connection on my Canon is terrible! it rattles like you would not believe, no confidence in the fittings at all. Guess it will have to be Canon after all :-)<br>

thanks for the above input</p>