Mamiya 7ii Polarizer problems - - Appreciate guidance

[ted_adamczyk2]

In using both, the polarizer sold for the Mamiya 7ii camera, as well as the BK

Glass Polarizer, results are always too dark and over saturated with the 43 mm

and 150 mm lens at 2 stops allowance. Open to any and all ideas as to how to

resolve this.

 

Thanks,

 

Ted

[stuart_richardson]

This is probably the last thing you want to hear, but do you really need the polarizer? The

mamiya glass is very contrasty and gives quite saturated color already. Part of the problem

with the 43mm might just be the nature of the lens. As a non-retrofocus super wide angle it

has noticeable vignetting in the corners, combine this with a polarizer and you will probably

have some very dark and saturated skies. Also, polarizers don't always work evenly with

super wide angles because such large swaths of sky don't necessarily polarize at the same

settings. All that said, hopefully someone with more experience using polarizers on the M7II

will come to the rescue.

[justinblack]

How are you metering with the polarizer?

[david_henderson]

I've never come across a polariser for which two stops allowance wasn't enough, though of course blue skies and reflections can be expected to darken more than that since thats what you use a polariser to do. I find a polariser useful with a Mamiya 7 because it is difficult to use grads in a controlled fashion and a polariser can darken the sky relative to foreground.

 

So if the issue here is underexposure rather than simply disliking the effect of the polariser it looks like a camera or a routine issue rather than a polariser issue.

 

There are a number of possible causes but if you are using the metering in manual, try this one first as its free. I suspect that you are working in manual mode, taking a reading without the filter, setting those values on the camera and then applying your two stop compensation. The problem with this is that the compensation dial on the your camera works on the metering not on the camera directly in manual mode. In other words you can twiddle the exposure compensation dial to your hearts content and the actual exposure won't change a bit.

 

However if you operate in auto mode the meter sets the exposure so altering the meter reading via a compensation adjustment alters what the camera does. In manual mode it does nothing except what you put on the speed/aperture dials.

 

So either you can put the compensation on before you meter and set shutter/aperture values accordingly; or set the compensation by altering aperture or shutter speed- which I prefer because I have a tendency to leave compensations in place after I've done.

 

If this isn't your problem then I'd be inclined to try metering with various levels of compensation in manual and auto modes just to be sure that the compensation dial is in fact exerting the right degree of influence on the meter- so for example setting two stops compensation results in a two stop difference in meter reading.

 

My betting is on the "routine" issue mentioned first and if not then a fault on the compensation dial/linkage.

[stuart_richardson]

Just a basic thought -- you know that the Mamiya 7II is not a TTL metering camera right? The

meter is above and to the left of the lens (if you are looking at the camera straight on). If you

put the polarizer on the lens, you need to compensate for it with the exp comp dial,

otherwise the results really will be way too dark.

[ted_adamczyk2]

Excellent responses. I generally compensate by altering aperture or shutter speed as David Henderson indicated above because at 70 I do have the tendency to forget and leave compensation in place after I am done. I am wondering if Stuart's recommendation to always use the "comp" dial on the M7ii is a better procedure. Do you folks just use the dial or adjust by altering shutter speed, etc.? I never had any problems with my RZ67, but that of course is a TTL.

[david_henderson]

It depends whether you're working in manual or auto. If in manual the technique you're using should result in correct exposure when polarising. If you're working in auto the camera will automatically negate any increase of aperture you make by selecting a slower speed and you will be two stops underexposed.

 

If you are working in manual, taking a reading and then actually setting two stops more exposure on the camera then you should be getting correct exposure irrespective of whether you're using aperture, shutter speed or setting a compensation before you meter.

 

Are your exposures without a polariser satisfactory on this camera- the metering isn't easy to master.

[ted_adamczyk2]

Exposures are excellent without the polarizer, whether in manual or auto.

[bob_cook]

Maybe you are simply "over-polarizing" the scenes. You can alter the effects of a polarizer by how much you rotate the filter. I've used a polarizer with a Mamiya 7, but not the one sold specifically for it. I mark the polarizer where it sits at 12 o'clock on the lens, remove it, hold it to my eye and rotate to the effect I want, and then put it back on the lens and make the exposure. I use the same technique on my Xpan with great success.

[rconey]

I apologize if this is mentioned above. Bracket exposures heavily to get the best exposure. I don't fine the meter in the camera to be that accurate on landscapes, and my zone system guestimates are just approximate. Bracket generously, and I usually get a good exposure. Also, a suggestion from a Galen Rowell book has served me well. The best way to get duplicate shots is take multiple shots at the time of image capture.

 

Some films don't polarize well. The Kodak VS slide film is very difficult in regards to the sky. You get a muddy dark blue. Velvia is good.

 

The polarizer for the camera is fine once you get used to it. I read on a post here that when it is "up" the meter reads through it and you can set exposure that way. I have never tried to verify that.

[ted_adamczyk2]

I fully appreciate your great responses. Generally, I shoot in manual mode, use the camera meter as a simple check, but rely on my Sekonic L558 for true metering. Also generally use Velvia 50 (when you can get it anymore in the states) or 100 ASA for landscape work.

 

I bracket to get a satisfactory shot, but not an exceptional one, with the polarizer. And also waste a good bit of film in doing so. My basic problem, as mentioned above by a number of you, is over-polarization.

 

Perhaps it boils down to learning to use the Mamiya filtering sequence better, however, I just do not trust the camera meter all that much when it comes to polarizer use.

 

All suggestions based upon your experience are very welcomed. Again, I thank you.

 

Ted

[frankfitz]

I have used the 150/80/65mm lens using a Polariser combined with an 81a or 81b filter. I use a hand held meter and set the film speed to 12 for 100 speed film or 6 for 50 speed film. This gives 2 stops for the polariser and I let the 81 underexpose the film (Velvia) which help with saturation. The camera is then used at full manual setting.

 

The above can also be used with a spot meter and a grey card or you can use your cameras meter to measure from a grey card!

 

I am sure that you will eventually enjoy using the 7. I had a lot of wasted film at first with my first body but now I would not be without a Mamiya 7.

[rugby photographer]

I use the Mamiya polarizer regularly for landscape shots. First off, because the polarizer can rise up from the lens for you to turn the filter and see and adjust the amount of polarization needed, the light meter reads through the polarizer, so it shouldn?t be too hard too make the appropriate light reading.

 

THat should eliminate most issues. OTherwise, as others have said, wide angle lens? do have light falloff issues. So when you are shooting when the sun is not overhead or in a position to give even light, you will get falloff, with or without a filter. You can correct falloff with a center filter. The 43mm lens does not show vignetting with the polarizer, due to the larger outside ring size. I?ve even attached a grad ND filter to the Polarizer with no vignetting. Use slim models.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Chris Labozzetta

[leo_grillo]

Meter: My in-camera meter is accacurate and I use it with the Mamiya factory polarizer.

But there is a whole stop difference using the in-camera meter from where you call it

CENTER. Hold the camera up to a ceiling light bulb and use the RF to find the bulb's hot

spot. Test your meter, moving the camera in a grid pattern across the bulb, to find where

to hold the RF for the brightest meter reading. Mine is half the area of the RF center box,

and to the bottom and half way to the right. Metering off the optical center is AT LEAST a

whole stop off. This is easier than the English it takes to explain it properly: Just wave your

camea at a light and watch the meter!

[mikestacey]

Can't say I've ever had the need for a polariser with this camera. The glass is so good it just doesn't need one.