Refinishing a 8x10 Deardorff

[peter_hoang1]

hello i was wondering if anyone has any tips about refinishing a old

deardorff? what type of satin or finish do i buy? how do i remove the old

finish? are their any percautions i should know? when i remove the metal

parts, how should i fill the holes up so when i screw them back in they will

be tight? sorry for all the questions. thanks again for your help.

[capocheny]

Peter,

 

I don't know about the exact type of finish the original Dorffs had on them but I have seen

both varnish and oil finishes. An oil finish is probably the easiest since scratches can be

sanded out and a new coat of oil applied.

 

Take pictures of the camera parts as you remove them and, that way, you'll have points of

reference for the parts.

 

Lastly, when one of the screws came loose on my Dorff... a wood finisher suggested filling

the hole with brown glue (wood glue such as Elmer's brand glue.) As soon as you fill the

holes... screw the screw back in and you're good to go!

 

You can also buy new parts from Barry Cochran and, eventually, he's planning on re-

plating the various parts on the Dorff. But, for the time being, he isn't doing that. And, I'm

sure he'll have some great suggestions on refinishing the camera too.

 

Good luck... hopefully, once you've finished, you'll post some images! :)

 

Cheers

[jon_wilson]

I used Homer Formby's solution with very fine steel wool and lambs wool to "refinish" my V8 this summer. I replaced the leather handle and installed rivot/receiver screws under the top of the rear standard to reinstall the handle brackets with allen wrench head screws. I replaced the bellows with appropriate glue and small staples. I replaced the gg with Satin Snow GG from Dave Parker. It turned out fine...IMO. Not a pristine restoration, but I kept it and sold my other 2 V8s. I have the personal satisfaction of knowing I did a good job and if it gets scratched....it will add character to it and not break my heart. I did not get the hardware replated...that would be really nice. Best wishes on your adventure. Jon

[thirteenthumbs]

Peter,<br>A common carpenters repair tip is to cut a piece of dowel rod the diamater and length of the hole that is striped, coat it with wood glue, insert it into the hole and restart the screw hole when the glue has cured. For wooden cameras round tooth picks work fine for the small screws holes and Elmer's Carpenters Wood Glue comes in small bottles, works fine and cleans up with water when wet.<p>I have had good results with Jasco brand finish removers for varnish and paint. The 15 minute water soluble one is a good bet.<br>You may find some useful information at <a href=http://www.historiccamera.com/>Historic Camreas</a><br>Charles

[ts_photo]

One good way to remove and level an old finish is by careful scraping. You can hold a single edged razor blade perpendicular to the surface and run it back and forth, evenly leveling the old finish. I wouldn't strip it unless the current surface is in such bad condition you couldn't use it as a base for next coat.

 

If you are worried about incompatibilities, then try your next finish in a small amount in a hidden area. You can use shellac to separate two types of finish as long as you don't put an inflexible finish over a relatively flexible one.

 

Good quality spar urethane should work well as the final finish. I like to apply many such products by rubbing on with a clean square of towel, wait 3 to 10 minutes (test to find the right timing) and then smooth it down with a clean cloth or piece of towel. This will give a satin finish, but it can have a fair amount of luster.

 

For the holes, if you can find a conical shaped drill bit then you can make real nice and tight fills by just putting and end of the dowel into a pencil sharpener. Then cut off the pointy end, glue it in with yellow or brown wood glue, and cut off the excess with a no-set saw and finish with a razor sharp chisel. (Plane or spokeshave would be overkill on this scale.)

 

When you remove parts, in addition to photos, you should label the part and where it fits and also put orientation marks on part and location. You can use a sharpie pen on the back of most parts and under where most parts fit for invisible marks.

 

Nearly every thing I've said is restoration advice for function, but not for historic condition. If you think that your camera has or will soon have some kind of extraordinary value as an antique or historical object (ask 4 experts...) then seek the advice of antique restoration specialists. Don't use the camera as a camera -- it becomes something to store in exacting conditions. Chances are you will want to keep it in original or current condition for maximum value, rather than changing it unless its condition is deteriorating.

 

/..

[User_503771]

I've refinished quite a number of old cameras, including a few Deardorffs. In most cases, I use denatured alcohol (also known as lacquer thinner, I think) to take off the old finish, often without disturbing the stain beneath. I've used steel wool as the "carrier" for the thinner. If you work slowly and delicately, you can take off as much or as little of the old finish as you like.

 

It might be better to consider using the denatured alcohol and a soft cloth, like an old T-shirt (lint free), to simply clean the surface to prepare it for more finish of your choosing. The advice above looks good, as to which finishes you might use and why.

 

Hope this helps.

[frank r]

Slight correction: Denatured alcohol and laquer thinner are two different solvents. One is an alcohol and the other is a blend of petrochemicals.

 

The alcohol will dissolve shellac. Lacquer thinner will dissolve lacquer and some enamels.

[michael_briggs2]

"when i remove the metal parts, how should i fill the holes up so when i screw them back in

they will be tight?" If the screw holes are in good condition, you don't need to do anything

special -- just carefully screw the screws back in when you are done. Try not to fill up the

screw holes with lots of finish -- a small amount of finish won't hurt -- you can cover the

holes with tape or dab out excess finish. The tips about filling the holes with wood dowels

etc. are good for repairing a screw hole which has stripped threads, or have otherwise

become too large, and no longer holds the screw well. You don't need to go to this effort if

the screw hole is still holding the screw.

[big toys are better]

IF denatured alcohol will take your finish off then it is likely shellac based, something I love to use and fondly refer to as "bug sh*t" because it was traditionally derived from the excretions of a certain bug that sucks the sap of a particular plant.

 

Anyways, shellac is very nice to work with and easy to remove and restore, but not the strongest finish for outdoors. I love the look and so recommend it when appropriate.

 

Also, another alternative to fix a bad screw hole is to take some sawdust and mix it with 2-part epoxy glue. IF you put the screw into this while still hardening it will likely NEVER come out-- for better or worse, but you can let it harden and then drill out the necessary hole for the screw. Doing so with a good yellow glue will be easier to work with but not nearly as strong, and you can also use a polyurethane glue such as Gorilla Glue but that is messier since it will expand as it cures. The dowel method is fine as well and works great when the screw or lag is large but I've come to like the sawdust method in most cases where the screw is small and the damage to the base material is minor. Also, as Mr. Briggs is suggesting, your finishing material may fill your empty screw holes, and this may be just enough filler within a "stripped" hole for a screw to grab onto, but don't refinish and then try the glue methods-- your bond won't be as strong as with raw wood.

[drew bedo]

Hello Peter,

 

About ten years ago I did a minamal restoration on a Eastman View 2D. I removed the parts and scotch-taped them to sections of manilla folders in roughly their installed relationship with short notes to keep me oriented right-left and top-bottom.

 

I did not actually remove or strip off the old finish. I used Formbey's "refinisher" with 4-O steel wool. Afterwards, I used tung oil varnish and hand rubbed it in. While this is not a concourse or museum quality restoration, it was simple and I',m stiull using this camera for 8x10 shooting. Best of luck on this project...go for it.

 

Drew Bedo

www.quietlightphoto.com

[big toys are better]

One thing I forgot to mention is that I generally use the 3M style of abrasive pads instead of steel wool since any water based or alcohol based product will have water in it and lead to "rusting" of any residual steel fibers. Paint stores in particular will have different grades of those pads for a reasonable price-- around a buck or two for a fairly large piece of material. These are really nice to work with and with rare exception probably better to use that the steel wool.

[peter_hoang1]

thanks for all the help guys!

 

the camera has alot of scratches some deeper then others. what is the best way of covering those up? would your recommend using a electric sander on the camera for removing old finish?

[peter_hoang1]

aonther question: when i stain the wood, should it be oil bases or water based? after staining the wood do i need an over coat to protect it?

[frank r]

Sandpaper will simply clog up as you try to sand off a finish. Either strip everything completely with stripper and then sand or fill up the scratches with light coats of finish and then re-coat the entire camera. This only works in the right circumstances.

 

If you test the finish with alcohol and then lacquer thinner and the finish starts to dissolve you may be able to simply soften the old finish and rub away a lot of the scratches. Alcohol will dissolve shellac and lacquer thinner will dissolve lacquer. Give a light sanding to everything. When finished, top coat with a new coat of the same finish to give it a uniform look.

 

The worst case scenario is that you have to strip all the finish, sand a little and then refinish.

 

Don't overlook using spray cans of the finish. Easy to apply in light coats, dries quickly and cleans up easy.

 

Don't use an oil finish. Although easy to use, they do not build up a thick enough film to really protect the wood.

[michael_briggs2]

I wouldn't use an electric sander, it would be too easier to over sand and make a mistake

like rounding over the corners. This is a delicate project. You probably aren't going to

make the camera look new, nor probably should that be your goal -- better to make it

look in excellent condition for its age, but still showing signs of its age -- patina. I

suggest trying to do the least that will make the camera look good . Probably what you

should do is experiment in a small, inconspicuous area. Will alcohol soften the finish?

Maybe you can polish the existing finish, or refinish on top of some of the existing finish.

Or maybe you can use alcohol to remove the finish without agressive sanding. If alcohol

doesn't work, next try lacquer thinner. The 3M pads suggested by RH work well. For

repair of the finish, rather than removing it, sand by hand with sandpaper. But as Frank

says, sandpaper won't work well for removing the finish. Or for smoothing the wood after

removing the finish, sand by hand with sandpaper.

 

Both shellac and varnish, depending on the type, will add color to wood. Most stains add

little or no protection, so you should use shellac, varnish or an oil finish. (Many

commerical oil finishes are actually thin varnishes.) I get the best results with shellac or

varnish with brushing, but it takes an excellent brush and practice.

 

Maybe you should get a book on antique furniture restoration and refinishing. It might

keep you from making a mistake on your camera.

[big toys are better]

There are very fine 3M style pads that will be at least as gentle as 400 grit or finer sandpaper, and this is all hand work, don't use a sander or even a sanding block. I think this will be the best way to proceed until you see what happens with the old varnish. Try a Sherwin-Williams store-- that's where I get mine but I've seen them in most pro level paint stores. Get at least one of each coarseness.

[gary_meader]

Look up kevin Bourke's article on Photo.net about restoring a B&J 8x10. You'll get a lot of

good help there and I don't suppose the woods are all that different. I used help from his

article on my B&J and it came out quite lovely. Who knew they used nice woods?