lens ramblings - the pursuit of magic : old versus new

[squareframe]

and before the darts start flying, last weekend I rented a Hasselblad

Xpan and evaluated the Mamiya M7. beautiful cameras both, but f4

lenses fall short. once you identify what you want to accomplish

photographically, the equipment needed starts to call out to you, and

it is just a matter of listening.

[tony_rowlett2]

In reference to Jeff's comment (paraphrase) asking Daniel why he

automatically assumes it's DAH's Leica (brand) and not the fact that

DAH probably shoots 14000 pictures in a day, let me just offer my

own ramblings, not really much to do with the orginal question, but

so what. There are a lot of successful photographers who use a Leica

M camera. There are also a lot of successful photographers who use

other

cameras from other manufacturers. Perhaps both groups shoot many,

many times more frames of film in a week than I will in my life, I

don't know. One thing I am as sure of as I am of a bump on the head

after being hit with a coffee cup being thrown accross the room, is

that, as Daniel eluded to, DAH's comfort and "oneness" with his camera

isn't merely "oneness" with just another tool that he has gotten

comfortable with. Most people who don't use a Leica M camera on a

regular basis will argue with me on this point: No other camera

becomes an extension of the human eye and mind like a Leica M. This

is due not so much to its original design, but rather to what the

M has been discovered to be by all those who are truly successful with

it. It's not really the lens optics, but they are certainly of high

quality, and they have always offered good performance and imaging

character for their time. It's not that they're overbuilt (90% of an

M is the shutter mechanism, filling the interior like a grand piano in

a doctor's examination room). In simple terms, I think what

Daniel was talking about with DAH and his Leica it's the camera's

usability. And I don't think a Leica M's usability becomes

easily apparant to most who pick it up and use it for a few months or

years.

<p>

I submit that the fact that a large number of successful reportage,

street, art, candid, and even fashion photographers who don't use a

Leica M, or who have never used a Leica M, is the basis for maybe 40

times the amount of "writtin on-line fuss," (over what is discussed

about other camera brands). I submit that those who are successful

with a Leica M camera know something that those who aren't successful

with the M don't know. I think it's this: To that group of

successful M photographs, no other camera -- ineed no other

<i>tool</i> is as transparant as a Leica M. No other camera can so

quickly become a part of the photographer. No other camera has more

of a potential to work as a photographer's assistant than a Leica M.

It is only a tool (Yes, Jeff, it's only a tool!! :-) but as has been

said before, it is more "only" a camera than any other camera. They

called 7-Up the "un-cola." The Leica M is the "un-camera."

[msitaraman]

[pfft, pfft-sound of poison arrows]

 

<p>

 

Why did you take the Hasselblad, Daniel? It reminds me of a friend of

mine, a professional photographer, who saw my then brand new Rollei

6003, briefly took leave of his senses, borrowed it on the spot and

went out street-shooting in NYC. I caught up with him minutes later

and found a large mean guy with an even larger and meaner dog

ttempting to feed my friend the Rolleiflex piece by piece.

 

<p>

 

Being courageous, I immediately saved my camera from the bad man.

 

<p>

 

Which leads me to a question. With all due respect to the greats

(DAH, et. al) what is it they can teach that is independent from the

equipment they routinely use? Can David Alan Harvey or Steve McCurry

(a Nikon user) teach you what to do with an 8x10 field camera in the

Streets of Santo Domingo? Or are their insights and wisdom [somewhat]

circumscribed by the types of equipment they know? Can a Carl Weese

teach you how to shoot in clubland in London?

 

<p>

 

Artistic or scientific talent and teaching talent (and I hear all of

these guys are very, very good) are different things, as any college

professor will tell you.

 

<p>

 

Maybe you would have profited from a course with Phil Borges, Dan. He

uses a Hasselblad in the field to make his pictures. Are you

acquainted with his portraits?

 

<p>

 

And welcome to Leicaland-you've been nibbling around here a while.

Which leads me to yet another question. I've been a big city dweller

all my life.

 

<p>

 

I've never really used Leica M in a pastoral or rural setting-which I

gather is where you live But Leica M=people photography. True or

false? [pfft, pfft not intended].

 

<p>

 

Rob, I am woefully ignorant, having approached photography through

the medium of camera advertisements, but there is a technical term in

Western painting for what you describe. Tableaux, perhaps?

Renaissance paintings of these huge scenes of various people

labouring at various tasks come to mind...

 

<p>

 

Two great pictures, by the way. Love them both.

 

<p>

 

Dan, thanks for a great thread. Breathes some life back into the

forum after a patchy spell. Look, its even brought Tony back into the

fray. And thats always good.

[msitaraman]

I mean Daniel, of course. Apologies.

[squareframe]

I went to Mexico to meet up with my hero Keith Carter, to taste

Mexico, and refine my Hasselblad Flexbody technique, of which Keith

is the master. the others were there leading workshops of their own,

and it wasn't until my initial attempts at street photography that I

began to understand what Leica was all about. yes, I keep flitting

along the outskirts of Leicaland, but those Hasselblad hounds are

always hungry and expensive to feed.

[nesrani]

Mani, yes it's specifically Breughel's Icarus Falling that I see as

the apex of that style. I'd love to do a book about Bombay (again!)

in that style. The idea has been tugging at me for quite a while.

[msitaraman]

Icarus Falling:

 

<p>

 

<img src="http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/bruegel/icarus.jpg">

 

<p>

 

 

 

<p>

 

Thanks for the clarification Rob. Hope this works and is

illustrative...

[nesrani]

Now _that_ is a nice picture!

[nesrani]

And it has a kind of _glow_ too...

[squareframe]

yea I say, tis a great picture if only the edges were sharper.

[giles_poilu]

And it didn't exhibit nasty wide-angle distortion...

[msitaraman]

He really should have tried Reala and a different printer, colours

are totally off-might have been wise to spring for a Lightjet

print...Surprisingly, the paper seems quite archival. Oh and a little

fill-flash might have helped the shadow details.

[steve_wiley]

Daniel, You mention watching the effortless way in which DAH broke

from conversation to take a picture. This is really an issue of his

highly developed intuition, not his camera type or the era in which

his lens was made. The photographs you admire were made by artists

who are able to anticipate a moment. A Leica won't make great street

photos for you just like a Steinway won't compose beautiful music for

you.

[squareframe]

I very much understand this. I was reacting to how much a 28-70mm

f2.8 autofocus lens weighs, how slow it is, the beating you take

toting it across your body, and how imposing such a monstrosity

looks. it is one thing to sit in the lounge and compare notes about

each others 28-70mm or 70-200mm zoom (nice) and a completely

different reality when you see your compadres on the streets with a

TTL flash attached and looking exhausted. the Leica (M/R) looks

really good once you see such a sight and note the reaction of their

subjects.

 

<p>

 

> A Leica won't make great street photos for you just like a Steinway

won't compose beautiful music for you.

 

<p>

 

please read this thread once again --

[steve_wiley]

Daniel, I've been on vacation (Mexico) so I couldn't respond

quickly. It seems to me that your desire to switch to a Leica is

informed more by nostalgia than by practical needs. I know or

know of numerous great street photographers who shoot with

everything from Canons to Mamiya RZ67's.