Focusing problems for Basketball

[ken_holiday]

I am shooting high school basketball with a 20D and 24-70 2.8 L and 70-200 2.8

L lenses without a flash. Not all but quite a few are out of focus. Can

someone offer some advise on what focusing modes are best to use for fast

action basketball. I usually shoot at 1600 ISO because of poor lighting in

H.S. gyms. I usually get about 250th at f/2.8. So I'm pretty sure that it's

not movement, but focusing problems. Thanks

[phule]

Posting a sample would be beneficial.

[dave_hoffmann]

For sports, you need to use AI-Servo

[ken_holiday]

Here's a recent photo.

[phule]

Ken,

 

I'm not sure what you're trying to show with posting a thunbmail but no discernible information can be gathered from it.

[phule]

make that "thumbnail"

[mark u]

1/250th really is on the margin at best for freezing basketball action. You may find it useful to look at theses threads in the Sports forum:

 

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00J6eS&tag=

 

you'll find an example of significant motion blur at 1/320th in this thread:

 

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00IOr5&tag=

 

Since the much slower focussing 50mm f/1.8 is commonly used to produce sharp basketball shots, I think you are simply running up against the fact that f/2.8 is too slow an aperture for high school gyms at 1600 ISO. Of course, if you were shooting the Harlem Globetrotters under TV lights, you could probably get away with f/4.

[PuppyDigs]

Look around for a used EF 200 1.8L USM. It's the ultimate HS basketball optic. The EF 135

2.0L USM is also a good one.

[ken_holiday]

Sorry for the small photo. Here's a bigger one.

[mark u]

There's definitely significant motion blur in that shot, although it also appears back focussed (look at the sharpness of the gym floor). Get yourself a 50mm f/1.8 or f/1.4 and an 85mm f/1.8 (I think the 200mm f/1.8 is really too long for basketball even on a full frame body, pace Puppy Face ;), and read up on the tips about using AI Servo focus linked in the first thread I cited above. Recognise that neither you or the camera will get it right 100% of the time, but combining good technique with lenses that allow the necessary fast shutter speed will get you a good ratio of sharp shots.

[michael_ziegler2]

Have you set the IS to pan mode on the 70-200? Looks to me that that is a good part of the problem, Certainly you must use AI Servo in combination with the pan.

[davyjo]

I've had good results with the 28-135mm IS wide open @ f/3.5, on my 30D, AI Servo mode, center focusing, very good in the well lit gyms but need to add flash in the darker ones. Proccessing the images can do amazing things. Some of my best shots would probably have been trashed if I had looked at them on the camera before downloading them. With my Sigma 20mm f/1.8 the pictures are much clearer and brighter but you have to be right under the basket.

By the way, the kids don't even notice the flash.

[William Michael]

Mr Holiday:

 

Forgive if this has been stated, I just read the question only, and did not look at any samples posted, but>

 

1/250 sec is not fast enough ot freeze Basketball.

 

Hands arms and feet [and some whole body movement in flight] movement require at least 1/400 [sometimes 1/500] to freeze motion at high school grade games.

 

I am not saying you do not have a focus problem, just that you cannot rule out motion blur.

 

Regards WW

[jim_simon3]

I shot my first in door basketball game with a 1D mkII and a 100mm f2 a few weeks ago. I set the shutter speed at 250 and the ISO at 1600. I also used the safety shift. I move the focus to the * button. (For free throws, I focus on the net, then let go and wait for the miss and action.) I consider the lens to be fast focusing in decent light. It often slowed down and sometimes refused to focus on static pre-free throw "portraits" which might be caused by the servo and lack of movement. The AI-servo also has issues as it is trying to figure out a pattern to straight-line movement and there may not be one, so it defaults out of guessing where the player is going to be to try to re-focus. This takes time or causes misses. So I think the AI part of servo doesn't really work with basketball where is works somewhat better with football. Canon says that focus slows in poor light and certainly this is poor light.

 

I dismissed using the 50 1.8 as I guessed that it was too slow to focus. From the other posts I may be wrong. By the way the majority of the shots were at f2 and f2.2. As you pointed out it wasn't hard to see where the problem was focus and where movement in most photos, but in some it turned out to be movement on later looking where it first appeared to be focus. The depth of field on the close shots is thin. Unlike other sports I did shoot RAW as I didn't want to fuss with the white balance and I didn't know what sharpening would do to the 1600 ISO. Using RSP I found a good enough white balance, sharpening and curve and just applied to univerally to all the files. It is instantaneous. Then I converted to JPG and left the room. The files don't look great at 100%, but print 8X10 quite well.

[carlo 1967]

In my experience (third league italian baskeball) I can't freeze the action with shutter speed lower than 1/800, to be safe you have to stay with 1/1000. I prefer to pre-focus on a spot and wait for the right moment (last year I shot eight games of the same team so I learned how the various plays are intended to develop). As long as I pre-focus I shoot with 85mm f/1.2 wide open and set 800 ASA (on a Canon 5D). If you have the pass to stay just outside the playground (1-2 meters outside the ground) you don't need longer lens. Try also some shots with wide angles (I use 24-30 mm range) staying as low as you can, the players appears more tall and the shot is quite dramatic. I suppose that 85mm f/1.8 will be fine, in sports you really need lenses that are sharp only in the centre because, usually, you frame with the subject in the centre of the picture.

Another lesson that I learned shooting basket is always seek the right exposure before the game (ask someone to go in the middle of the court with 18% grey card), set the exposure in manual mode and stick with that for all the game. This is usefull 'cause shirts colors and the light sources may interfere with the lightmeter of your Canon during game (I lost some good shots 'cause in the frame there were light sources).

HI,

Carlo

[marknagel]

Your shot was at 51mm, I'd recommend the 50/1.4 and 85/1.8. Both are tack sharp at f/2.0 which would give you twice as fast shutter speed.

 

Mark