B&W question

[mclain swift]

Here is a particular image that I love the tones on

http://www.photo.net/photo/5141038 What I am wondering if

these B&W tones are achievable regardless of what tones were in the color

image to start with (assuming this is a digital shot)? I am so not happy with

making B&W images. Some seem to work while others just look flat and lifeless

or look like thay have color casts to them.

[pico_digoliardi]

The picture is RGB. It has color. However, it may be duo-toned.

 

Look into converting B&W using channels.

Then look also into Duotone (and Tritone and Quadtone)

[beauh44]

Hi, I agree that the example you posted has *some* color to it; it's not quite sepia, but as the above poster suggested, perhaps a duo-tone. As for getting rid of color casts that should *not* appear you might try preparing your B&W image your usual way, then convert it to grayscale. That should toss out any and all color information. You can then *re-convert* it back to RGB and if all goes well, there should be no color cast at all. As for a "flat" look try using Curves and give it the good ol' "S" shape. When I do this I'll use an adjustment layer that's set to Luminosity blend mode. Another technique you might try is using two layers of your converted B&W image. Set the top layer to "Multiply" - this will make things very dark so you can adjust the opacity of the top layer to taste and/or mask out the darker/darkest bits. This can make things very contrasty and "punchy" - here's an example using the "Multiply" method: http://www.photo.net/photo/4844186 Good luck!

[mclain swift]

Damn, Beau, nice work you have! Thanks very much for your detailed answer. As a new

photographer I really appreciate the help. I have tried several methods of B&W conversion

but I never seem to get consistent, predictable and reliable results from shoot to shoot. Do

yuou think there one method that works all the time or is it a "season to taste" sort of thing?

[paul_sokal___dallas__tx]

M, how are you currently doing your B&W conversion? Knowing that would help us help you.

[mclain swift]

Jeez. I use everything from channel mixer, gradient map, pluggins--I have tried it all. Well, all that I can think of anyway :-) I tried last night to get the tones like that image I posted above and couldn't even come close. That is why I am wondering if the results of B&W conversion are directly related to the colors present in the original image.

[pmind]

Definitely try incorporating Duotone as part of your approach. I think you'll be happy with the possibilities. Paul

[mclain swift]

Paul, what is the best approach for duotone? I really like some of the B&W you have created.

[mclain swift]

Oops...wrong Paul :-) You don't have any B&W images.

[brianchapman]

Here's a link to a technique that explains how to copy the "tone" of an existing digital or scanned image. The procedure is a little confusing so let me know if you have any questions and I can try to help. You can use it as a base and then make slight modifications to suit your own preferences.

 

http://epaperpress.com/psphoto/

Click 'Black and White'

Click 'Copy a Tone'

 

Brian

http://www.brianchapmanphotography.com

[mclain swift]

Hi Brian,

I have tried a method like this before and it didn't work at all--disasterous if you will. I will give your method a go when I get home tonight and let you know how it goes. Thanks so much for your help.

[mclain swift]

Hey Brian,

Well I tried the copy tone technique and while I was able to duplicate the toning of the same

image no problem but when saving the curve and applying it to a different image the results

were not even close. This leads me to believe that the success of any given B&W conversion

or toning method largely depends on the colors/tones in the original color imaage, no?

[brianchapman]

Hmn...well, I would have to say that yes, the results of a particular toning 'curve' do vary by image, however, the curve doesn't really discriminate - it just maps tones. When you create a curve and you tell it to map any RGB(145,156,130) to RGB (147,153,133), you don't give it any logic to figure out if that's going to work for a particular image - it's going to map the tones in image A the same way it's going to map them in image B.

 

Depending on your conversion method, the result of the conversion may depend on the tones in the original color image. This is especially true if you're using the channel mixer to convert because then you have control over how the individual colors map to gray during the conversion and you also have control over how the relationships between the colors makes its way in to the final conversion. Some of the other methods might just take in to account luminosity, etc, others probably mix both.

 

But yes, applying the same conversion or tone curve to multiple images will definitely result in different outcomes.

 

Brian

http://www.brianchapmanphotography.com