Can you build a Large format camera around a 35mm Lens?

[ben maddox]

I'm wanting to build a 4x5 camera, but my problem is I've got tons of

Nikon 35mm lenses but not much money to spend on the project. I've

got all the hardwood I could ever need all the tools, pretty much

everything. I just don't have anyway of knowing if it will work or

not. I know it would be hard but is there any way at all to build a

4x5 or any other large format camera that will work with my current

selection of lenses?

 

-Ben M.

[troyammons]

Not enough coverage.

 

g-Claron lenses are sharp and not that expensive.

[dan_fromm2]

Yeah, sure, if you like circular images ~ 43 mm in diameter surrounded by a lot of unexposed film. But you'll need a shutter.

 

You could build a macro 4x5 camera for use at magnifications around 3:1 up around a reversed 55/2.8 MicroNikkor. But you'll still need a shutter.

[richard_cochran]

<cite>I just don't have anyway of knowing if it will work or not.</cite>

<p>

Sure you do. Go indoors, near a window. Point your lens at the window. Get a 4x5 piece of white cardboard and place it behind your lens. The white cardboard will simulate your film. You should be able to adjust things so that you see an image of the window projected by the lens onto the cardboard. It may be helpful to use some dark cloth or similar to shade the cardboard from stray light.

<p>

I suspect you'll notice that, no matter what you do, you can't get the image from the lens to fill up the whole 4x5 piece of cardboard, at least not if the lens is making an image of something near infinity. That's the coverage issue that's already been mentioned.

<p>

Another issue is that Nikon lenses are all designed to be used so that the lens mount is pretty darn close to the film plane (again, at least that's true when focused at or near infinity). It may be hard to design a useful 4x5 camera with the right distance from lens to film plane.

<p>

Both of the above issues improve somewhat if you're willing to give up infinity focus and restrict your photography to extreme close-ups.

<p>

Finally, what are you planning to do about a shutter?

<p>

For a cheap 4x5 camera, try a pinhole camera. Or you may be able to improve slightly on the pinhole by using a single element magnifying glass lens in conjunction with a slightly larger pinhole. Or you may be able to find an old beat-up lens/shutter from an old large format camera.

[neal_chaves1]

Actually, Nikon did exactly this with the "Speed Magny" backs for the Nikon F. This enabled you to shoot on 4X5 film. The device used a mirror to fold the image for a more compact device, but it could be made like view camera. What is required is a 50mm enlarging lens that projects the aerial image from the 35mm camera lens onto the 4X5 ground glass. This was not suitable for all focal lengths. Consult some old Nikon literature. It could be made like a recessed lensboard, with the enlarging lens on the inside and the camera lens mounted flat on th outside, but life's too short to mess with stuff like this.

[ben maddox]

I had already thought on the shutter issue but really hadn't come up with any ideas. I kinda thought the coverage would be off. I guess that I had hoped someone had made some type of wide angle converter to get the film coverage right. Guess it was a stupid question out of desperation. Crazy idea I guess.

[ranong]

i think the idea for a pinhole is a great idea. it is easy, will cover no problem has great DOF and most of all is fun. after that if you still want to try a lens you can pick up some really cheap stuff off the bay. i have bought a few older lenses just for their shutters and i paid more for the shipping than the lenses.

one last idea is you could try building your own glass. if you are into building the thing just add one more dimession and make your own lens too. here si a link that may help you. http://www.f295.org/DIYforum/cgi-bin/forum/Blah.pl?

enjoy.

 

eddie

[mag_miksch]

Ben, sell some of your tons of Nikon 35mm lenses and buy a LF lens in a shutter, the older ones are really cheap on that auction site. Maybe you also will have the need to buy a bellows, or how will you manufactor that^^

[steve_hamley]

Ben,

 

Why desperation? If you want to try 4x5, you can certainly get a press camera and lens for $250 in decent shape. That's the way many of us, including me, started out.

 

Steve

[john_layton]

Years ago, I reverse-mounted a 55mm 3.5 Micro-Nikkor to a piece of Masonite, drilled a

hole its rear lenscap, removed the cells from a Graphex shutter, and mounted this shutter

into the rear cap. I filed the masonite to fit my crown graphic, and took some wonderful

extreme closeups on 4X5 with this setup. Did a writeup for the old Pop Photo about this

but they didn't run it. Lots of fun with this though. Those were the days!

[davidv1]

You can get a reasonable lens, with shutter, for under $50 that will cover 4x5. You'll have to look around a bit. I got a 5x7 Rapid Rectilinear and a Voigtlander 135 for $40 each. They're not great, but they do work, and were a steal at the price.

 

$100 should get you a 90mm Optar or a 135 Ektar. $250 would get you a Crown Graphic, complete with lens.

 

Pinholes are cool, and practically free.

[doc_w]

This may sound stupid, but I swear I am serious. I do this because I do not make any money from photography. If you have enough time to build a view camera, including all kinds of experimentation to save money, then you have enough time to get a part-time job to pay for decent equipment. I teach guitar one night a week and it gives me a bit of extra dough to put toward decent equipment. If you really are a DIY guy, it is better to have some experience in the field, with decent equipment, rather than building something about which you know almost nothing. You will spend a lot of time screwing around trying to make a silk purse out of sow's ear.

[._._z]

It'll work if you don't mind circular images, like <u><A href =

http://www.artnet.com/artwork/41596/aaron-rose-milky-way-xi.html>

this one by Aaron Rose</a></u>.

[ben maddox]

Don, not to be rude... Did I ever say I knew nothing about large format photography? People have made crazier things work in the past. I did not and still do not find my question stupid. Some people would rather build something then to buy it. In fact, could it be that a person would gain a better understanding of their camera if they had built it with some trial and error? Sorry but getting another job might work for you but it's just not an option for me. I do thank you for the suggestions, but please understand that what works for one person might not for the next.

 

-Ben M.

[ben maddox]

Looking back at my earlier post I said "Guess it was a stupid question out of desperation." only because of the less then friendly greeting I had received. While I am very thankful for all the answers I have gotten. It seems to me that many people have a very static way of thinking in which any idea our of the ordinary must mean that it's author is ignorant. Thanks for all the help! Sorry I seem so defensive! Bad habit I guess...

 

-Ben M.

[kai_griffin]

Hi Ben, you could consider picking up a beaten-up old disfuctional bellows-type camera (of the pre-war variety; ie voiglander or zeiss), and canibalising the lens from that to use in the camera you build (assuming the lens looks reasonably OK), ideally with at least the shutter still working. Some of them are as cheap as nails, simply because the bellows are trashed or the camera is missing major bits & pieces... or are for a wierd no-longer marketed film dimension.

[ben conover]

Ben, I bought a B&J 4x5 press camera with normal lens shipped from America to Ireland all for $200. It works very well.

 

If you want to make a view camera from ebony with the fittings from another camera just for the fun of doing it fine, but I think any old press camera will do.

 

Remember the time it takes to make things!

 

Cheers.

[cfd]

I tried the 35mm lens thing, extracting lens elements etc; and had no luck. Frustration lead me down the road least traveled. I eventually found a Kodak No. 3 Autographic Model C for $7.00 (the whole camera) in a thrift store. I was going to restore it, and in the process of cleaning the lens I discovered this . . . if you unscrew the rear elements and remove them, the iris and front lens elements that remain easily cover 8"x10", without vignetting. This makes for a simple cheap starter lens w/shutter. There are many styles of the Kodak Autographic cameras. The one I chose (that works) has the US numbers on the shutter instead of the familiar f/stops numbers. ie; Shutter setting like 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128. Configured as above it will require 300mm (12 inches) to focus at infinity. I believe the lens is referred to as a Rapid Rectilinear lens. Both front and back elements are basically the same. Other Kodak Autographic lenses may also work; ie; the 170mm Anastigmat, but I personally haven't tested those yet. Anyway, some food for thought. I'm cheap, what else can I say. :-)

[jtuck]

The build is easy if you can get a cheap enlarger, my first LF was made from a beseler 23c and a few garden stakes from local HW store, didn't even need to go to the "depot".

 

Next, get on the bay and get an enlarger lens, mess with it at f22-f32, (not on sunny days, you need a shutter) use it at night and on cloudy days, (reciprocicity and exposure, full minute exposures indoors is common for me with window light (B/W); just guess out the timing with your watch matched to your light meter (like 100+ years ago, minus the light meter of course.)

if only then you are mystified by the quality of the photos, go ahead and spend the dollars for a lens with shutter and a better camera.

[doc_w]

Ben, you say:

 

"Don, not to be rude... Did I ever say I knew nothing about large format photography?"

 

Well, to be frank, if you are trying to make a large format camera with that kind of lens, then no, you don't know much about large format photography. You asked a question, and you got lots of good answers which, it seems, you don't like. So you go for it. Disregard our static thinking. Make a large format camera out of a lens designed for a 35mm camera. We await your results with bated breath.

[ole_tjugen]

It's not <i>quite</i> impossible to make a LF lens from 35mm lenses, only very difficult. Old telescopes would be better, then you could at least reinvent the Rapid Rectilinear. Long tele lenses would be the most likely source of lens elements, and then only the front group.

 

But since old RR's sell for peanuts, it would be far easier to sell one Nikon lens and buy a RR for the money. And a bag of peanuts for the change...

[dan_fromm2]

Ole, I think you're awfully close to advocating extracting what will turn out to be very expensive lemons from free lemonade.

 

Cheers,

 

Dan