50 summilux or 75

[stephen_jones4]

I've read what Erwin has to say - does anyone else have

experience of how the 50 and 75 summiluxes compare in terms

of wide open performance?

[albert_smith]

Steve,

 

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Go through the recent threads for a series of (on-going) test by Mike

Dixon and his newly acquired 75mm Summilux. He has a lot of

experience with the 50mm Summilux (albeit and older vintage) and is

doing some comparison and contrasting of these two optics.

 

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They are under the heading of "75mm 'Lux adventures", and a chapter

number. His latest is featuring the 75mm lens and the 50mm DR

Summicron, but earlier chapters have some shots with the 90mm

Summicron and 50mm 'lux.

[george_b1]

Steve -

IMHO, there are two discrete variables to consider. One is your ability to focus accurately, and the second is your ability to remain

rock-steady while depressing the shutter button. With any M series .72 body, you're at the ragged edge of being in focus with the

75 Lux at 1.4. The 50 Lux provides more latitude due to the DOF. If you're hand-holding and "quick-snapping" your photos, the 75

Lux is more demanding than the 50 Lux. It's a heavier lens, and, unless you are in the prime of life - - with no tremors - - you can

get the miniscule "jiggles" that keep you from producing a rock-sharp slide or neg. Unfortunately, I know both of these variables

from experience. I loved that 75 Lux - - provided I had someplace to steady my body or to use a mini tripod or a bean bag. It's truly

a magnificent lens, but it demands *very* careful focussing and a *very* steady shooter to get the results of which it's capable. We

now have the 50, and the 75 was sold to a good friend. Just my two cents.

[eliot]

Steve. The 75/1.4 Slux is a newer optical design than the 50/1.4

Slux (1979 vs 1961), so it ought to be better wide open. But

consider the differences in angle of view. Leica points out that 75

mm has a view (31 degrees diagonal) very close to that of the 90 mm

lens (27 degrees), and much more narrow than the 50 mm lens (45

degrees). It is also considerably larger and bulkier than the 50

mm. So I would take these factors into account in deciding which one

is best for you.

[kristian dowling]

I have NO experience with either lens. But think of this.

 

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Erwin Puts suggests that the VC Nocton 50mm f/1.5 is a better lens

than the Summilux. So if I was to say "how does the 75mm Lux compare

to the Nocton?" I'd probably be shot on this forum.

 

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And James would probably be the first! :)

 

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Conclusion, the 75 Lux is probably a better lens optically, but if

you read what Elliot said, his comments (prespective, angle of view)

should be at least 50% of the decision. And if you buy the 50mm,

you'll be tempted to buy the 90mm later (if you want a

portrait/longer lens). Whereas the 75mm could do both!? An excellent

choice as a "tweener". Great for low light too!

[jackflesher]

Well, I was faced with a similar dilemma; I still have the 50

Summilux, and I no longer have a 75 Summilux. But, this is just what

worked for me...

 

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Cheers,

[eliot]

The story that has made the rounds regarding why 75 mm is that Leica

wanted to make a superfast 90/1.4 lens (the desired focal length) but

settled for 75 mm because the 90/1.4 would be too big and block even

more of the VF. Thus the 75 is supposedly a compromise to reduce the

degree to which the lens (especially with hood extended) blocks the

view.

 

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I'm not sure this story is totally correct, since Leica did in the

early SM era produce a close relative of the 75 mm focal length (ie.,

the 73 mm Hektor, which was a bit slower at F/1.9, but superfast for

its day (early 1930s)). Thus there is a history of having produced a

similar focal length in the past.

[matthew_pulzer]

Steve, what you really want is a 35/1.4. Trust me I'm right on this.

 

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Matt

[james_.1]

Yes, in part you are correct in that what he really wants is the 35

lux. But, in addition, he wants the 75 lux. Hehehe. Seriously,

it's a good combo. ; )

[ray_moth]

Steve,

 

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I'd be interested to see what Erwin has to say about the 50 'lux but

I've never found anything on the web. Where did you see it? Perhaps I

should buy his book!

[Rob F.]

Eliot:

 

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Along the same lines, they also made an 85mm f/1.5 Summarex in

threaded mount. Not many were made, though.

[budc]

Ray,

 

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You SHOULD buy Erwin's book. Not only does he cover just about every

lens Leitz/Leica ever made but he also discusses a lot of really good

Info on lens design, etc.

 

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BTW, Erwin mentioned in a recent newsletter that he's working on

another book. I suspect it has to do more with cameras than lenses.

[eliot]

Bob. The 85/1.5 Summarex is a fascinating story, It's the only lens

that was newly designed and introduced by Leitz during WWII. Some 90

units in black paint finish were produced in 1943 and sent to Berlin

(presumably for distribution to the military, there is no definitive

info on their ultimate distribution). The official commercial

introduction of this lens wasn't until 1949, when the lens was

produced in a somewhat different mount (now coated) in a chrome

finish. It is a very big lens with a very large hood that adds to

its already impressive bulk.

[kristian dowling]

James,

 

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Haven't you reccommended the 35/75 combo somewhere else

once, twice or more. I agree that the 35/75 combo is the best

two lens combo available in the M or any other system. Geese, I

am stuck with the 35/50/90 and it's also fantastic.....once I start

using my Nocton.....once I can get a M adapter to mount the

damn thing! Good luck whatever your decision.

[jacques_balthazar1]

Very different beasts Steve. The 50 is much more of an all rounder

than the 75. OTOH, the 75 is a fantastic optic in more senses than

one. The extra reach, the perspective compression effect and the

honey smooth bokeh are signatures of the 75. When you add perfectly

useable f1.4 capability, quasi flare free performance AND the fact

that it allows to shoot 70 cm from subject, giving it de facto the

highest magnification ratio of all M lenses, you realise why the 75

is absolutely unique.

 

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I use a 0.72 M, and can vouch for its focusing precision with 75mm

wide open even at closest distance. No FUD here.

 

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OTOH, the 75 is big/heavy in purist M terms, and does beg to be

accompanied by a wider lens for standard assignements. The 50 'lux or

the 35 'lux will be more versatile as standalone options.

 

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The 50'lux to own is the most recent one, focusing down to 70cm.

Previous generations focus down to 1m (like the Noctilux), which is a

very real limitation at that focal length. From all the experience

shared by users and testers, the 50 looks like a wonderful performer

as well. Wide open performance is usually considered as very good to

excellent at the center and more average in the periphery, which is

perfectly OK in most cases.

 

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But it is a 50mm, which many users, including myself, consider as

a "compromise" of sorts, with 'neutral' perspective effects (unless

you shoot under the nose of someone) and lacking the expression

advantages brought by wider or narrower angles of view. At the end of

the day, one has to work harder and think more with a 50mm to yield

eye catching images.

 

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Like others, I highly recommend the 35 'lux and 75 'lux as the

epitome M combo.

 

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Alternatively the 28 'cron and 50 'lux should also bring great

mileage in a more compact package....

[james_.1]

Me? Ever recommend that combo before? Nah...maybe someone else?

35-50-90 is awesome as well, I haven't much patience for switching

lenses is all. That 90 is killer though, much more modern than the

75 lux for sure! I don't know anything about comparing wide open

performance, maybe not much of a difference? Probably which focal

length is more important.

[roberto_watson_garc_a]

Hi to every one, and a joyfull wellcome to spring.

 

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May be Lutz K. once talked about his preferences for that combo (35-

75), if not escuse me Lutz.

 

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I have never try the 75´x and just got a 50´x that have try for a

week or so, but not enough to say much about it, well I can say that

is hardly larger than a latest 50/2, and that 4x5 prints at 1.4 looks

so contrasty, but not more.

 

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Something interesting and a bit out of topic here is to analize

combos reasons, I mean, why can be a useful combo of 35-75 for some

while some others would prefer a 50-35 or 28-35 or 21-135.

 

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Having the most of options is a reason, the same that brings you to

get a 24-300 zoom; also two or three focal lengths that cover your

most photographic demands, or two very diferent angles of view for

each one of your kind of photography (can be the case of 35-75 combo,

where 35 can handle fast moving street like situations and 75 a relax

landscape-portrait like photography), there is also combos that go

round a specific angle of view where extra lenses help to compres or

open a bit on a single focal length like 28-35-50, or simply specific

optics that for it´s qualities are a photographer´s choice for

example a 50-50-50-50, yes a 50/3.5, a 50/1.4, a 50/2 DR and the

lates 50/2, all are the same focal length but each lens has it´s

unique qualities.

 

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May be this topic deseves a new question.

[kristian dowling]

James, You are right! Now I have too many decsions too make.

And one of them is whether to carry the 50mm. Ah it's ok, I'll just

trade it on a Noct later on....much later on!

[james_.1]

Oooo noctilux, now you are talking about a 50 *grin*. I admit a

fascination with that lens- a nice piece. Hmn...I wonder if such a

lens will be in production forever? I am tempted to add one later

on as well for night missions. : )

[kristian dowling]

James, lets buy together and get group discount, kinda like Fat

Albert going to Mc D's for a Big Mac or two!

[kristian dowling]

Ok James, I am putting you on the spot. Over weeks we all had

to listen to your quobbles (spelt right?) over getting a 75mm Lux

that wasn't faulty.

 

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Then for the last couple of weeks you've been raving on about

the 35/75mm Lux combo. Now's the time to put your "pictures "

where your mouth is and share!

 

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I'd like to think that all the trouble was for something. Just some

motivation. "Make a post to make the most..."

[james_.1]

Hehehe...yes well with midterms coming to a close today, I will have

more time to take some photos. I will be travelling (nowhere too

scenic) on the 29th, and will take the Leica with me. Yes indeed,

after my travails in procuring a nice 75, I'd better get some more

use out of it, more than portraits of my girlfriend's mutt. *grin*

Thanks for the challenge, and perhaps you should do as well! Would

be interesting to see some of your photos as well, do you have a

webpage or folder on photo.net?

 

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Indeed, a lot of my recommendation for the combo has been not based

a whole lot on results, although I have shot with them. It's the

seemingly obvious benefits of the simple setup though. Anyway, yes

I will endeavor to post some by the beginning of April, if not

earlier, and I trust you will as well!

 

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: )

[kristian dowling]

Go here for my stuff. though not much from my 90 APO yet.

 

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http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=427015

 

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Where's your link?

[james_.1]

Excellent photos Kristian! A nice balance of subjects, travelling,

sports, women, etc. Alas, I do not have a neg/slide scanner,

although I should get one. The three I have in my photo.net folder

are scanned B&W prints, and I think you've seen those since you

commented on one of them, but I will get more! Just tonight snapped

off a few of my girlfriend's pup and her sister's pup playing (now

that's hard to do with a Leica, for me yet anyway). Let me see if I

have some nice photos from my digital camera to upload into my

photo.net folder under James Allen. Until then, thanks for sharing.

[kristian dowling]

Thanks James. Photographing my dogs is also a challenge,

and sometimes I wish i had my old F5. Miss your old EOS?

I am sort of considering selling my 90 APO and getting a F100

and my old AF 85mm f/1.4 back, or a EOS 1n with a 85mm f/1.8

or 100mm f/2. Not sure yet as I still need to give the 90 more of a

go.