Nikon MF lenses

[bourboncowboy]

I typically try to not expose my ignorance in public - or on a

public forum - but I've got a question that will reveal just how

little I know about Nikon MF camera lenses. I've recently purchased

a Nikon F3, MD-4, and 50mm 1.8 AiS lens. I'm considering lenses of

different focal lengths to accompany this lens. However, since I

know so little about these lenses, I thought I'd ask the following

question (please try not to laugh while answering):

What's the difference between Ai and AiS lenses? What about AiS E

lenses?

 

After you quit giggling, any information or links to such

information would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your

help.

 

Mark

[michaelging]

maybe this will help,Mark, this is a great web site

 

http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/emfgfg20/eserieslenses/index.htm

 

http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/nikonfmount/ais_lars.htm

[michaelging]

There are 2 links here,only one shows the word link

[lex_jenkins]

For all practical purposes with the F3 there is no difference between the AI and AI-S Nikkors (or third party equivalents). The one real difference that exists has no effect on metering with the F3.

 

Some folks claim that at least certain AI-S lenses were built to a lesser standard. This may be true of a few lenses but I don't see any evidence of shortcuts in the AI-S lenses I own and have handled. One of the complaints is that certain AI-S lenses used fewer screws to secure the lens mount ring to the lens barrel. I haven't seen these lenses and doubt it would matter much on the smaller, lighter primes. There's absolutely no difference in construction quality between my 105/2.5 AI and 85/2 AI-S Nikkors. They are virtually identical in construction and design, to the extent that the 85/2 is surprisingly heavy for such a compact lens, noticeably heavier than the comparably sized 50/2 AI Nikkor.

[david_h._hartman]

AI Nikkor lenses generally have a longer focus throw and are a

bit stiffer in their focus feel. The longer throw means the

distance scale has more graduations and there are more DOF

markers. This is desirable when determining DOF and for hyper

focal distance focusing. The longer focus throw may aid in

precise focus. The AI lenses are sometimes physically fatter

than the AIS lenses of the same focal length and maximum

aperture, e.g. the 35/1.4, 50/1.4, 105/2.5 and so on.<br>

<br>

AIS Nikkors have a shorter focus throw and the feel is smoother and

lighter. This is good for rapid focusing. Some AIS Nikkor have 9

aperture blades where the AI model has only 7, e.g. 35/1.4. The 9

blade aperture gives a rounder out of focus highlight.<br>

<br>

I tend to prefer AIS for lenses 50mm and longer and lenses that Ill

use for candid photos of people, e.g. 28/2.0, 50/1.4, 85/2.0, 105/2.5,

135/2.8. AI lenses are fine for landscape where the longer

distance scale and more numerous DOF makes it my preference, e.g.

24/2.8, 35/2.0.<br>

<br>

The 28/2.8 AIS Nikkor has CRC (close range correction) and is a

significantly better lens than the 28/2.8 AI which does not have

CRC. The 28/2.8 AIS focuses to just 0.2m and is very sharp close

up. The 50/1.8 AI and AIS (early) have an aluminum lens barrel

where as the 50/1.8 AIS (late) has a plastic mount. Some 50/1.8

AIS (late) have a rubberized focus grip and some have a plastic

one.<br>

<br>

AI lenses generally sell for less so if you dont have a

preference for the AIS in a particular lens the AI is often the

better value.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

There are only a few cameras that actually made use of the S

feature in an AIS Nikkor unless a CPU is added. They are the

Nikon FA, F-301, F-501 and F4(s). The action of the aperture

coupling lever on AIS Nikkors is linear whereas it is non-linear

on AI Nikkors. If a CPU is going to be added I recommend more

research (meaning I'm copping out). I pretty sure I understand

the issues but don't want to put my foot in my mouth or double

check my answers for this right now. I certainly do not want to

post misinformation.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

Here is a link to help identify various Nikkor lenses...<br>

<br>

<a href="http://www.photosynthesis.co.nz/nikon/serialno.html"

target="_new"><u>Roland Vink's Nikon Lens Serial Numbers</u></a><br>

<br>

Regards,<br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.

[lilly_w]

Generally the AI vs. AIS versions of a given lens will make no difference in terms of IMAGING, but there are exceptions. Most optical configurations (# of elements / # of groups) are identical between the AI and AIS versions. Some exceptions are 28/2.8 (AIS is classic!), 35/2.8 PC, 35/2.8 (AI 6/6 and 5/5 while AIS is 5/5) 180/2.8 (no disrespect to the AI but the AIS is off the scale!). You will note a difference in HANDLING as previously noted. As for the E Series, I steer clear due to their build quality as I regretfully have to rely on the rigidity of steel at times�don�t care for the plastic, although some perform quite well in terms of imaging. If memory serves you recently inquired about and acquired the F3. Enjoying it? Your great grandchildren will like it too.

[michael_bach2]

Together with the F3 the 50mm 1,8 I will get the 35mm 1,4 and the 85mm 1,4

and you dont have to think more about gear and lenses but can focus on

making photos.

 

www.micbach.dk.........."Photography workshops in Spain"

[kelly_flanigan1]

AI lenses came out for an easier way to index the lens to a camera's meter in the mid to later 1970's. AIS came out later with some linear features, usefull on some cameras, an not others. The E series was a answer to a 2nd teir lower cost Nikkor variant, like the Minolta Rokkor Celtic line and others.<BR><BR>In the AI era of trhe 1970's the OLYMPUS OM-1 was a HUGE influence on camera design. Thru the just prior to AI to AI to AIS era a HUGE drop in computing costs of optical design happened. Also there was a downsizing, lets make a lighter smaller lens push, lets add built in rubber focus grips, lets add a built in lens hood push. <BR><BR>Some lenses were redsigned optically, some are same as from pre AI 1970, like the 105mm F2.5.<BR><BR>Unless a specific lens is mentioned, there is too much noise about theses lens transitions,<BR><BR>With the 50mm F1.4 ; it was changed optically just before AI came out in 1976, it focused closer too. Thus some folks will say the switch point was AI, since most all the 7/6 newer lenses are AI. <BR><BR>With the 105mm F2.5 folks are royally confused. The Guass variant came out in 1970, mulitcoating was added about 1973. The 1973 variant I like sometimes is only 65 dollars with a Nikkormat body, like the Ebay one I bought last year. Because internet folks push "AI and AIS are better", many of these earlier lenses are a super bargain. With the 105mm F2.5 AIS, the lens was redesigned for a built in lens hood, thus the helix layout was changed, it also has less screws holding the rear flange on. <BR><BR>In the roughly AIS era and later, some lenses and maybe all later got an enhanced multicoating. <BR><BR>Some newer lens designs such as the 105mm F1.8 are only available in AIS since they were born in the AIS era. <BR><BR>With the 50mm lenses that are made in huge volumes, less screws, more glues and less mass have been an on going trend. <BR><BR>With an old Nikkormat FTn, one can use a pre AI, AI or AIS lens. The later 1970's cameras dont use the fork/prong, and have the Ai indexing feature. <BR><BR>Somewhere in the AI to AIS era and later, nikon and others probably messed with different greases. I have had more stiffer Nikkors in the 1980's and later AIS models, then any of my 1960's lenses. <BR><BR>It is wise to seek out info on one lens, say a 105mm, 50mm, 35mm, then dwell on broad AI versus AIS talk. with some lenses, actual optical design changes happened, with many NO changed happened. With a few lenses, us old timers feel the new lenses are less robust, with others there is no change. <BR><BR>The number of diaphrame blades changed in many lens designs too. Some lens got lower inertia stopdown mechanisms, better for the faster motor drive firing rates. <BR><BR>Some of the 1960's lenses had a higher mass steel hardened stopdown lever, some later stuff has a lower mass aluminum lever that works better with a motor drive, but gets chewed up with usage.<BR><BR>There are many little design changes on the 50mm F2 an 50mm F1.8 famous lenses in the optical area, probably about 6 or 8 at least is what I once heard. These are great lenses, often overlooked by many folks.

[al_tan]

Hi Mark

 

"Lenses to accompany your 50/1.8?" Ok, I'll be wicked and suggest the 50/1.2 Ais and Micro-Nikkor 55/.28. Wait a minute, maybe also the Noct 58/1.2. ; )

 

Depending on what type of photography you do, you may find that a 24 or 28mm and a 105 or 135mm would be perfect on either side of the 50mm you now have.

 

Cheers

Al

[johnw63]

David,

 

The Nikon FG also made use of the "S" feature in AI-S lenses.

[Ed_Ingold]

"I'll be wicked and suggest the 50/1.2 Ais and Micro-Nikkor 55/.28. Wait a minute, maybe also the Noct 58/1.2."

 

Three "normal" lenses in one kit? That's quite a recommendation - a little obsessive, perhaps. Can you leave the house without checking three time whether the oven is off?

[vivek iyer]

Get a 50-135mm f/3.5 AIS zoom (hard to find)- super sharp, and a 25-50 f/4 AIS. You are set.

 

Forget all the fixed focal length lenses unless you reall are looking for something for a specific application.

[ebogaerts]

"There are only a few cameras that actually made use of the S feature in an AIS Nikkor unless a CPU is added. They are the Nikon FA, F-301, F-501 and F4(s)"

 

The F4 *does not* take advantage of AIS manual glass in any way. The FA and F-301 (N2000) do, but even the FA does not actually *need* AIS glass because of it's stop-down trick in Shutter Priority and Program Mode.

 

I've seen you post this information before, David - specificially about the F4. The F4 *does* share the maximum aperture indexing sensor that the FA has, (which then supports AMP metering on the FA and Matrix Metering on the F4) but the maximum apeture indexing post exists on both genuine AI and AIS manual glass.

[david_h._hartman]

<em>The Nikon FG also made use of the "S"

feature in AI-S lenses. --John Williamson<br>

</em><br>

The FG reads the maximum aperture post found on the back of AI

and AIS Nikkors but does not detect the lens type signal notch

fond only on AIS, Series-E and AF Nikkors. I dont think the

FG qualifies. I got my list from Photography in Malaysia as I

only remember the FA and F4(s) as AIS aware cameras.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

<em>Get a 50-135mm f/3.5 AIS zoom (hard to find)- super

sharp, and a 25-50 f/4 AIS. You are set. --Vivek Iyer<br>

</em><br>

Great lenses but too slow all on there own in my

opinion. Id slide a fast lens like a 28/2.0, 35/1.4 or 50/1.8

to 1.2 in between for low light. Three lenses can be handled very

nicely in a waist pack. You can change lenses even while walking

and a waist pack is more comfortable than a bag. The 50~135/3.5

AIS and 25~50/4.0 AIS are choice zooms.<br>

<br>

Just my 2 cents,<br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.<br>

<br>

PS: I dont own the 50~135/3.5 AIS but Id like one. Id

also like a 35/1.4 AIS.

[vivek iyer]

You should get this (50-135/3.5), Dave. Totally amazing on film and digital.

 

One of the all time greats!

[vivek iyer]

If you want, you can have my 35/1.4 (A) if you pay for the shipping. It is a total dud. Yellow glass and this sucker vignettes on a FF.

[al_tan]

Three "normal" lenses in one kit? That's quite a recommendation - a little obsessive, perhaps. Can you leave the house without checking three time whether the oven is off? - Edward Ingold

 

That's why I'd said I'll be wicked. ; )

 

No, I don't check three times to see if the oven's off before I leave home but I sometimes walk back to the car to check if I've locked the car door. That's why I have three 50mm lenses in my bag. ; )

 

Cheers

Al

[Robert_Lai]

I'm with Al. I have the 50 f/1.8 AI, the 50 f/1.2 AIS, and 60 f/2.8 Micro (used to be the 55 f/2.8 Micro). They do serve different purposes.<p>The Micro has no distortion at all, but needs to be stopped down for infinity.<p>The 50mm f/1.8 is a nice compact all-around lens. It has no distortion at infinity, but it does have some barrel distortion up close.<p>The 50 f/1.2 is physically not that much bigger than the 50 f/1.8. It's smaller than the 60 Micro, and smaller than the 35 f/1.4. It has barrel distortion, but it's 7/6 stops faster than the 50 f/1.8. It's easier to focus in the dark.<p>I use these all on the F3 also. However, I don't carry them all at once. Only one at a time!<p>As others have said, there's functionally no difference between AI / AIS on an F3. All series E and AF lenses are also AIS. The 50mm f/1.8 Series E is optically the same formula as the current 50mm f/1.8 AIS (flat lens).

[ilkka_nissila]

Well, the 50mm lenses are inexpensive and so it's no big deal to own several. I have a 35/2, a 50/1.8, a 50/1.4 and 60/2.8. The 35/2 is my digital normal lens, the 50/1.8 is an outdoor 50 and the 50/1.4 is an indoor 50, while the 60 is my short macro lens (which is no good at infinity at wide apertures). If I had only one, what would I use if one is in service?

 

All the 75-150 E:s that I've seen had zoom creep (some had zoom flop instead of creep, with no friction). Vivek is lucky here, or I'm unlucky.

[vivek iyer]

75-150 f/3.5 E and the 50-135 f/3.5 AIS samples do develop zoom creeps.

 

If you can live with that, it is fine.

 

Illka, You should really get one of those 75-150 zooms. Amazing lens on a dSLR.

 

The 50-135 f/3.5 (heavier and bigger than the 75-150) is even a much better performer, optically.