Mail Away or Buy a Scanner?

[frank r]

I shoot film only occasionally as a hobby. I have been messing around with 4x5

and 6x9 in B+W lately. I do not develop or print myself and I do not want to

start. My local professional lab has stopped printing 4x5 entirely and there is

no other local lab that does it either. They will develop it but not print it.

Also they can develop my 6x9 film but only print at 6x7 due to their enlarger

carriers.

 

With the current situation I cannot see how my 4x5 shots came out; I am left

with just a negative. With my 6x9 shots printed at 6x7 they get cropped. I

had one shot where the composition looked great on the negative but looked

cramped on the print.

 

It seems I have three choices:

 

I can mail away my film to get it developed and printed. Do you have any

suggestions since I have never done this before?

 

I can buy a scanner, scan the negatives and send them to the lab to be printed

professionally. What is the latest word on affordable scanners? I remember

recent posts about some new models coming out soon; any updates? My local lab

charges $20 per 4x5 scan which is a lot just to see if my shots came out.

 

I can give up on film entirely and just convert my color digital pictures to

B+W.

 

I want the option of doing film but it seems my choices are being taken away.

[pramodh]

I am in a similar situation. I would suggest buying a good flatbed scanner. $20 per scan is ridiculous and you will easily cover the cost of the scanner. Plus you get all the power of the digital darkroom.

[mikem77]

I bought a cheap Epson 4990 flatbed scanner for $350. This is good for proofing and smaller prints (8x10, 11x14, maybe 16x20). I scan color film and upload to www.mpix.com for prints. Pretty economical I think.

 

If you really have a winner and want a print of the finest quality, then send out that negative to a pro lab to have it professionally drum-scanned and printed. I'm still waiting for that winner :-)

 

I'm surprised that your local lab won't make prints. Nowadays, labs will drum-scan the film and make the print digitally.

[w_t1]

"I do not develop or print myself and I do not want to start. I want the option of doing film but it seems my choices are being taken away."

 

I know you don't want to hear it, but I can't imagine shooting 4x5 and then not having total control of everything from exposure to printing, wheter it's darkroom or scanning. You are correct, our choices are being taken away, but I think anyone that wants to stay in film will have to do their own from start to finish. I'm OK with that.

[perry_arnett1]

Pay for developing and/or scanning the negs or TP's to CD, then do either the scanning or proofing and printing at home.

 

Microsoft Picture It 7.0, Nikon View 6.0, Picture Window Pro 4.0, and I suppose other software suites will convert negs and transparencies to positives with one click of the mouse! (after having been scanned to digital form). That will allow you to proof your images at home with no cropping, etc. at little cost.

 

Then, a decent printer (Epson R1800?) will allow you to make some prints up to 13" x 40". And if you go the Cibichrome and Cone Paper and Ink route, you can do it all at home at your leisure and at your own budget. SEE all the images on computer, and print only those you choose to on paper.

 

Don't give up on film just yet; there are still some things to see (and moods to create) that digital does not yet offer.

 

I just had Wal-mart scan to CD some 45 year old 35mm slides (from 1961) that are better than anything I've shot yet with digital! Amazingly richer in content, detail, sharpness, color accuracy, etc. No color fading, just as real, rich and full of "aha" as the day they were shot.

 

I still use digital for some things (macro especially), but film surely has a certain appeal that is tough to let go of.

 

Wal-mart will scan 100 35mm slides to CD for $2.88!

 

Perry

[manjo]

I shoot 4x5 slides, and use the epson 4990 to scan, and costco to print, good thing abt costco is that they have their printer profiles online, so you can download them. It costs me less than $2 to print 8x10 of relatively ok quality.

[pramodh]

Manoj what do you mean by relativly ok quality? I am planning a similar set up

[Ed_Ingold]

A medium format film scanner (e.g., Nikon LS-9000) will give you the same quality and control you would get from a conventional darkroom, at about the same initial cost. You would also be able to make much larger prints, at home or through a lab, than practical with a wet process.

 

Large format is somewhat problematic. Large format film scanners are very expensive. The cheapest is one of the Imacon scanners, at over $12,000. Flatbed scanners are much cheaper, but of questionable quality. To my eye (been there, done that), an 11x14 inch print from a flatbed 4x5 scan is about the limit, and is obviously inferior to the same print from a 6x4.5cm scan on a Nikon LS-8000/9000, even to the untrained eye. The 645 scan from fine-grained film can be printed at 20x24 inches (a 12x enlargement) or more, with acceptible sharpness and grain.

 

If your expecations are modest, it makes economic sense to scan 4x5 on a flatbed, medium format and 35mm on a Nikon scanner, and send only the best 4x5 images out for drum scanning.

[ben conover]

Here's what I plan to do.

 

Send the film off to be developed and scanned. Then Choose which ones you like to print, and send the negs back for large prints.

 

Cheers.

[john_stafford2]

These people have been the best production (and custom) printers I've known for a long time.

 

http://www.gammaphoto.com/svct_bw_film.html

 

The prices are reasonable, too.

[w_t1]

What is the file size of the Walmart scans? At less than 3 cents a piece they must have put them on a barge to China! Seriously, no way I could make money at that price with my Nikon ls4000 film scanner..

 

Frank, if you have a digital camera you can take a pic of the negative on the light box, and inverse them in software like others mentioned. It's good enough to see what it's like on the screen, i do it with 4x5, and ill do a whole 20-sheet 35mm slide set in the pages that way also. Fast and easy

[frank r]

Thanks for all the responses. Any advice on the new flatbed scanners I heard were coming out soon?

[perry_arnett1]

The Wal-mart 35mm slide scanned files run from ~1.0 to ~2.4 MB, JPG's. One hour turn around if they are not busy. Get there early just after they open in the morning! Do a little shopping, and pick them up before you check out.

 

They do not develop slide film, but WILL scan them to CD.

 

Perry

[perry_arnett1]

I misspoke:

 

Wal-mart will scan existing 35mm slides to a CD for $0.28 each and will put up to 100 on one CD.

 

They will develop 35mm negs for $1.76 per roll, and will burn up to 100 negs to a CD for $2.82.

 

Hope this clears things up.

 

Perry

[capocheny]

Frank,

 

Buy a scanner and learn how to operate it properly. Also, pick up the software package,

Photoshop, because you'll end up needing it to maximize the potential of scanning and

manipulating your images.

 

It's not all that difficult of a learning curve... yes, it'll take a bit of time and effort but if you

do your homework, you'll be fine!

 

I have an Epson 3200 that I've been using for the past couple of years. I'll most likely be

upgrading to either the 4990 or V700 in the very near future. But, for the dollar value, it's

a great scanner. And, FWIW, you're in a great position at the moment if you're a buyer.

They're almost being given away on the bay! So, it's a really inexpensive and economical

way to get your feet wet and see whether it suits your working style or not!

 

IMHO, I think once you've tried it and look at the end results... you'll be glad you went this

route! :)

 

Cheers

[manjo]

"relatively ok quality"

 

I mean they are not 100%. Sometimes there are color shifts, although my PS processing (adj to their printer) etc are the same. 80% of the time I get what I wish for. You get what you pay for. Pro shops costs a couple of dollers more.

[jcolwell]

Buy a scanner.

[vinny_walsh]

I posted some test results from a 4x5 slide a month or so ago between a tango drum scan,

my imacon flextight, and my epson 3200. I wouldn't go with an epson 3200 unless you

don't care about sharpness and detail. If you want the most out of 4x5 then get a good

scanner.

 

 

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00GuPD

[Troll]

4th option: Polaroid. If you're not going to make large prints, why are you shooting 4x5?

[c_p_goerz]

I have an Agfa Duoscan T1200 that can take up to 8x10 negs/chromes and have always

been happy with it. I've seen them on Ebay for $50, they do need a SCSI connection but

you can buy a Belkin adaptor on Ebay too for about $20.

[ronald_moravec1]

Buy a flatbed scanner and learn to use it. Most come with a basic photoshop you can use to edit/improve the files just like in a darkroom. The file is then sent over the net with a file transfer program to a lab that will print them or you can download to a memory stick or cd rw and take it to a printer. They do not care what size the original neg was as all they need is the file.

 

Developing film in a tray is easy one sheet at a time. You will need to learn eventually. You need 3 8x10 trays and a dark space. There are also closed tanks for those without dark space.

[tedharris]

"What is the latest word on affordable scanners? I remember recent posts about some new

models coming out soon; any updates?"

 

Epson has two new scanners now in the stores the V700 and V750 and Microtek should have

a new model out sometime in the next six months. As far as the two new Epsons are

concerned you can see my review in the new issue of "View Camera" bu tthe bottom line is

they don't offer much if any gain for LF photographers.

 

You might also be interested in one of our scanning workshops. See my email.

[emil_ems1]

Frank,

 

It seems to me that you are restricting yourself too much in your choice set.

 

Permit me to propose a third option which I employed some decades ago when I could not afford to buy an enlarger for my 4x5 inch and 6x9 cm negatives.

 

What I did was to buy a contract printing frame for 8x10 paper. On that frame I put 4 4x5 negatives (or correspondingly more 6x9 negatives). In my bathroom, which has no windows, I put an enlargement paper sheet on the frame as well and put the light on for some seconds (counting them out loud). Thereafter I put the sheet into an old Cibachrome development drum. From then on, standard procedure for daylight paper development in the bathroom, with light on. Could not be simpler.

 

This method, besides being very cheap, also shows whether you are applying good metering practices. Your negatives should, with standard exposure and development time, all print fine with both highligt and shadow detail clearly visible. Otherwise you over- or underexpose your negatives.

 

Just my cheap thoughts on the subject. Cheers!!!

 

Emil

[doc_w]

If developing and printing black and white is a hassle for you, then scanning and printing will be too, trust me. I STRONGLY suggest that simply get a high end digital SLR and have a local shop make your prints.