Optical Quality of 45mm APO-Grandagon

[larry_menzin]

I am looking to find a solution for wide-angle landscape photography with shift

capability. This solution requires compatibility with Hasselblad-mount digital

backs. My current camera is a 555ELD with a 1.4x PC-Mutar. Using the 40mm

Distagon, I can get up to 15mm shift, but the effective focal length is 56mm.

Add the digital back crop factor, and the end result is 94mm, making the

shifted 40mm Distagon a normal lens. The 40mm Distagon has certain optical

compromises (retrofocus wide angle). Ideally, the 50mm Distagon is better, but

adding the Mutar turns it into a 70mm lens and 105mm with the crop factor. I

can get around the crop factor to a certain degree by stitching 2 or 3 images

together. I rented the Flexbody last weekend and was disappointed with the

results for wide-angle shift. Although the digital crop factor allows shifting

for the 40mm and 50mm lenses, the results appeared soft in the top of the

frame. These lenses just do not have the appropriate image circle without the

PC Mutar.

 

My question is: how good is the 45mm APO-Grandagon used on the Arcbody (and

other cameras)? How does it compare with the SWC? It seems that either the

Arcbody or a small (2x3) view camera could be a solution. When the Hasselblad

mount is taken into account, along with small size and weight for backpack

travel, it seems that every solution is very expensive and hard to find used.

Compact Linhof, Ebony, Arca Swiss, etc. cameras seem to be in the 3-5k area for

the body alone. Add the Hasselblad adapter and lens, and it gets in the 5-7k

area. A used Arcbody can be found for $3-4k with the 45mm lens.

 

Has anyone run into this problem and found a solution?

[j_rgen_loob]

Larry

 

I have come to this point of decision some weeks ago as well .

I find , that a FLEXBODY is no solution at all , as the HASSELBLAD ZEISS lenses have an

image circle , which does only allow a minimum of shift operation . On the other hand ,

the shift only operates into one way .

The ARCBOBY can only shift into one direction as well , and is limited for RODENSTOCK

APO GRANDAGON lenses of 35mm , 45mm and 75mm (unless you don't get a special

make for other focal length) .

So i decided to use my ARCASWISS 6x9 with a HASSELBLAD back attached and the APO-

GRANDAGON 45mm . (no focus mount needed either , and i can use all my LF lenses as

well) . This is just great gear . Shifts and tilts for front and back in horizontal and vertical

direction . The shift amount for the APO-GRANDAGON 5,6/45mm is about 25mm , might

even be 28mm , and of course more if you use a digital back , with a sensor size , smaller

than the HASSELBLAD negative . But , the crop factor of course , has also to be taken in

consideration , if you are going to use a digital back , ( I don't know , if you then would

need a digi version of a lens) . In the moment i just still work the analog way . For film

transport of the HASSELBLAD magazine, i have found a good and practical solution . If you

are interested , come back and i will explain in detail .

[larry_menzin]

Jurgen,

 

Is your Arca-Swiss 6x9 the FC version? What is the size and weight? Does Arca swiss have a sliding back, or do you need to mount and remove the back every time you take a shot? I am reluctant to keep mounting and removing an expensive digital back in the field. It is just a matter of time before it gets dropped.

[j_rgen_loob]

Larry

 

I work with the 6x9 F-Metric + the ORBIX feature . There is a sliding back available , but i do

not know , if it is for the 6x9 version or for the 4x5 inch version . Let me check this as i know

the people at ARCASWISS . It will take some time because there is a holiday tomorrow .

[j_rgen_loob]

Larry

 

Please contact Martin Vogt under the following E-MAIL Address :

arca-swiss@wanadoo.fr

 

Martin is familiar with all details . He will be able to give you all required information .

[mark_tomalty]

Larry

 

As I'm in the final stages of deciding on a digital back I had the opportunity to use

a P25 for the last 3-4 days on some rental V gear as well as with my ArcBody with

45 and 75 lenses.

 

The resulting files with the 45 were excellent and free of any optical aberrations and

as sharp and detailed as onbe could desire.

I only used modest shift and tilt so can't comment on how it would perform with more

severe corrections. The Arc/45 combo is excellent for near/far compositions as it only

requires a very slight tilt to get focus from a couple of feet to infinity a stop or two down.

 

Tonight the local Phase rep made available a P45 that I was able to use briefly with my

ArcBody and 45mm to shoot a city skyline (exposures from 30 to 90 seconds were

completely noiseless even when pulling back significantly on Phase default settings for

the back in CaptureOne).

There has been loads of threads throughout the web claiming that most lenses,including

non digital large format optics would fare miserably on the newer generation 35 and

39 Mp sensors.

I consider myself a pretty discriminating digital 'editor' as the result of having to submit

digital files to very critical stock photo agencies and can say with conviction that tonights

files were the sharpest,most detailed digital files I have yet worked with.

I look forward to a more significant test session with the P45 this coming weekend and

will fill you in on how the ArcBody/45mm performs in a variety of landscape situations.

 

A small view camera will give you far more versatility than the ArcBody but you can't

beat the size and portability of the Arc

 

Mark

[larry_menzin]

Mark, it's good to hear your report. I am only using a 16MP digital back (until my lottery ticket comes in) so my sensor is unlikely to outresolve the lenses. It's interesting to hear that the newest digitars are not required with the P45.

 

The ArcBody (available used for about $3500) seems like a reasonable compromise if it has great optical quality. The 40mm CFE IF lens will cost even more and it has no movements. The later SWC cameras will cost about the same and they have no movements either (although they are a bit wider). Is the 75mm lens usable for tabletop applications or is it too short?

[einst_stein]

A well-known LF distributer advice me that it needs very fine gear to focus right if using MF digital back such as p25. Large scanning back should be fine.

 

And he said Arca Swiss f-line 2x3 is not fine enough, and worse with 4x5. Ebony sv23 also not recommened. Not sure if it has anything to do with his business interest, but he advise to look more into Silvestri and Hasselblad. Not for the movement, but for the focus accuracy.

 

Make sense to anyone works with Arca Swiss or Ebony?