managing and manipulating light in larger formats

[brent_mcsharry1]

Thanks in advance for any opinions posted.

 

like many of these posts I begin with the cliche "I am a 35mm photographer who

is interested in the quality offered by larger formats"... ie absolute novice

in LF - sorry if the following Question is silly.

 

I like lanscapes and nature photography. I like to hike for days into the

wilderness. I do some 'architectural photography' in the form of old weather

beaten huts in the wilderness. I am drawn to the 6x17 format, either in the

form of the new horseman (the professional with shift + a ground glass back

and darkslide), or a 5x7 with the canham back. I am still trying to figure out

how useful tilt will be - it might help give the scene enough DOF at wider

apertures to avoid the 'milky' flowing water I am not a fan of (each to their

own). Bulk & weight are of course the draw-backs to the view camera and 6x17

back. I prefer wide angle lenses.

 

I am wondering (as a complete novice in the area of LF), how these cameras

will go with a flash - ie do they have a hotshoe, or is there a way to set a

cable release to fire a flash and shutter simultaneously ( i realise i will

have to manually set flash power, but prefer this anyway).

 

I was also wondering about peoples experience with ND grads in LF & panoramic -

can one stop the lens down while viewing the scene, in order to be able to

line up the grad and the horizon as one does in 35mm, or are there limitations

to either the shutter or ground glass focusing that prevent this being done

acurately in LF?

 

also - does anyone have experience with reflectors that are not bulky and

relatively light weight, so that they can be stuffed into a backpack with

other camera (and camping) gear.

 

if anyone believes other cameras would be better suited to flash and ND grads

while giving HIGH quality images, please let me know to.

 

Thanks again

[Monophoto]

Large format cameras rarely have hotshoes, but LF shutters frequently have synch contacts that can be used to trigger flash.

 

That said, strobe may not be a practical option for a portable LF setup. The reason is that to achieve the technical quality that LF is noted for one must often use a small aperture. And in the world of LF, small is much smaller than in 35mm - I typically use f32, and f45 is not unheard of. And when the aperture is that small, you need either a very long exposure or a very bright strobe. LF is used with strobes in studios, but a small portable (eg, Vivitar 283) won't do much.

 

Most LF work is done by composing on the ground glass. So its very easy to use graduated filters. Naturally, if you are using a small aperture, it may be hard to see an image on the ground glass, especially if the lighting is dim.

 

As to stuffable reflectors - there is something out there called a "space blanket". One side is covered with a metalized fabric (intended to reflect heat) that can also be used as a light reflector.

[michael_briggs2]

Modern shutters of LF lenses have a PC connector to provide flash synch. You need a cable from this connector to your flash, and some way to support your flash. Many flahes have this same style connector. There are also cables that adapt the PC to a hot shoe. The more typical usage is with studio flashes with stands, but you could rig up some way of supporting a portable flash. As Louie says, a powerful flash would be needed because of the typical taking apertures of LF photography. For 4x5 work, I typically use f16 to f32. There are some LF cameras with a cold shoe that could hold a flash (e.g., some Linhof models).

 

I think the typical gain in real-life use of tilts to gain depth of field is that you can use a aperture that is approximately one or sometimes two stops wider. It depends on how well the subject can be approximated as a plane. It isn't a miracle technique that will allow you to take photos of subjects with great ranges of object depths at f8 with a 300 mm lens.

 

You could try avoid "white water" by using a faster film -- your 6x17 cm films will not need much enlargement to make big prints.

 

It might be a good idea for you to rent a camera and try it out for a week to see what you can do with it.

[michael_briggs2]

Older shutters sometimes have other style flash connectors, such as the bi-post. You will see this style on the shutters used on Kodak LF lenses, which were discontinued in the 1960s. But generally you have to go back even farther in time to find a shutter that lacks flash synch.

[brent_mcsharry1]

Thankyou for your responses - very useful and very much appreciated.

 

As for flash power, I am usually using it to illuminate about 1.5 to 2 stops under the exposure set on the camera, only for the closest subjects in frame. I was hoping it might have enough power for this (even if I had to use strobing flash on a longer exposure) - use of flash may well be a thing I give up on in panoramic or large format, but nice to know I can experiment.

 

as for use of linear ND grads, I use them on my 35mm camera by selecting the smallest aperture on the lens, pressing the DOF preview button and rotating the filter until i can see the line of graduation. I then line this line up with the horizon. I was basically wondering if I had the ability to stop the lens down while viewing the ground glass in view cameras in order to be able to continue working this way.

[allan_f.]

Brent,

 

This is a bit different than the typical large format answer, but have you considered a 6x7cm or 6x9cm camera? Mamiya rangefinder cameras are often used for travel and landscape photography. They are much more portable for multi-day backpack trips that large format and feel much more like a large 35mm camera. They will be harder to use with gradient filters since you are not viewing through the camera lens.

 

Consider scanning 2 medium format images and combine into a single panorama if you want the wide format of 6x17. This will work better with static landscape scenes, even wind in the trees may be a problem when assembling a panorama.

 

I enjoy shooting both large format (lately 4x5) and medium format images. Shooting large format is much slower and more contemplative. Medium format does not give as much control (swings, tilt, and shifts are missing from most cameras), or as large an original image (for lower enlargement ratios at any print size) but the cameras are much faster to operate. The total equipment weight you need to carry for large format is often around 20 pounds unless you select the very lightest equipment and give up some stability in the camera and tripod.

 

If you are interested in learning about large format photography try to find someone local to you that shoots LF. It's possible to learn from reading but easier to learn form another photographer by seeing and doing. Try day hikes with a large format camera before considering longer backpacking trips. Large format landscape is a whole new world compared to 35mm. It will be easier to separate large format photography from backpacking until you are comfortable with the equipment and new ways of working. Combining LF photography with backpacking requires weight tradeoffs for both camera and camping equipment to keep the total weight and size reasonable.

 

Good luck with your new adventure.

 

Allan

[daniel_borzynski1]

As has already been pointed out, DOF is going to be your worst enemy. I have been finding that I run 2-3 stops slower with LF than with 35 mm.

 

A question for you: what film were you planning to shoot with LF? If you are a die-hard Velvia 50, then we have a problem. Now if are willing to experiment a bit, I would suggest trying a print film. Here is my logic: Up to 400 speed film, there are some fairly high quality films out there (NPS, wedding films). There is a fair amount of latitude in the print films, so a 1 stop underexposure won't kill the negative. It should be completely recoverable in the printing process, whether you go digital or traditional. The wide latitude will also allow you to shoot later in the morning, or afternoon, when conditions will be brighter, without the contrast issues you get with slide film. Also, negatives are completely scannable, both at home and with a drum scan, if you know what you are doing. It will be more work than with slide film, though. Don't misunderstand me, here - this will be a bit of a compromise.

 

There is also the Hasselblad XPan, but you lose the movements and film size that seems to appeal to you in your post.

[brent_mcsharry1]

Thanks for your response:

 

In response to the question about film, traditionally I have used velvia 50 or 100. I have used provia 400f with some success, and I have read in forums that astia (a film I love for portraits) may be a good film for nature photography, but using the saturation controlls in photoshop to create the vivid colors for which velvia is famous - the advantage being that astia has lower contrast for shadow detail, and a bye product would be better skin tones if people were in the shot.

 

I am not sure about the grain of the pro wedding films. Past experience has shown me that i have to use levels in photoshop to narrow the contrast to get pleasing nature images with NPH. If the grain was near equivalent, this wouldn't be a problem, but if I am hiking with 6x17 gear, I want to be able to be able to blow up to 60 inches without disernable grain, hence the desire to move to larger formats in the first place (and pay the weight compromise). Do you know how these films will work at this kind of enlargement?