Would you take D70 or F100?

[ilkka_nissila]

Sorry Shun, I'll just clarify my position a bit.

 

Focusing ease on the D50/70/100 depends a lot on under what conditions you use the camera, what lenses you use, especially which apertures. At one time I had a focus hit rate of less than 30% on people shots with the D70. I use mostly fast primes and usually around f/2.8-f/5.6.

 

The focusing accuracy of the D70 improved considerably with the introduction of firmware 2.0 and the Katz Eye screen. However, I get a much better hit ratio with the D200. Film bodies like the F100 is easier still, I'd estimate that I have about 1-2% of people photos slightly out of focus with film, while the percentage could be around 5-15% with the D200 and much higher with the D70. I bought the D200 specifically because it has a very good AF system on relatively still subjects and an excellent viewfinder. The image quality improvement of course is significant also. I would not agree with a 3/4 assessment of the D50 vs. the D200. I would say it's 25% of the camera for 30% of the price. Not a good deal if you have the money for a D200. The D200 has probably a record quality vs. price in any SLR.

[Rick Waller]

" A Nikkormat FTN, used properly will produce high quality photos than a 6 megapixel D-70. That's not a red herring, it's a fact".

 

Uh...it's a fact because you say it is? My friend, I am sure what you meant to say was that "in my opinion, film yields better images".

 

(Unless of course you would care to cite the source for your "fact").

 

As you might imagine, I disagree 100% with your "fact", but of course that is just MY opinion - not a fact.

 

And my opinion is based on 35 years shooting with my backup 4 megapixel D2h as well as my super megapixel D2x, my F100, my F5, my F2, and my Nikkormat (my first Nikon).

[RaymondC]

Thanks for all the help.

To me, its not about the weight or the hassle of film or the hassle of digital. I can spend a month all I care in post processing, I do not have a scanner right now so I prob just view the slides and scan them later when I get the scanner at a later date.

 

I am a bit worried with slide film and without grad filters how will I fare? With any digital I can blend 2 images up on the computer but taking 2 snaps on film and then scan and blend is a lot more issues.

 

I can't take 2 bodies. Just can't. So its either film I already have film but need to locate some Provia 400s. With digital I will be taking my 1.2kg laptop.

 

I guess if I had the 12-24mm lens that may be the better deal but I do not as I do not have to do mid rewind film, I have a wide lens and I can blend 2 images easily. But getting this lens in New Zealand is expensive and if I import it, it will attract intl postage and import tax. So the thing to me now is I have no issue with the F100 but how would you fare if you have no grad filters?

 

 

Raymond

[ShunCheung]

Ray, for the type of shooting you describe, a major plus for digital is that when you walk inside a museum, you can simply boost your ISO to 400 or 800 for the interior shots. And the minute you walk outside, you can go back to ISO 100, or in the case of the D70, its minimum ISO 200.

 

To do the equivalent with film, you are talking about a minimum of two bodies to load a slow film and a fast film.

 

As long as the viewfinder for the D70 is acceptable to you and you don't have any problems with digital post-processing, you might as well go digital as most people have.

[kmcgrew]

Ray:

<p>

<i>

ergonomics and AF speed [are unimportant]

<p>

[no]exernal [sic] flash unit...[t]able tripod...I am going lightweight. [My] widest lens...is 18-35. Pictures [mainly of] building, inside museums, landscapes sunset/sunrise with the ancient structure or buildings.

<p>

...film will be using Velvia 50, Provia 100 and Provia 400 pushed when I am inside, or RAW files with the D70. <p>

 

<b>What are your thoughts?</i></b><p><p>

 

First, pardon my editing, but I wanted to summarize your constraints down. Forgive me if I missed something.

<p>

My thoughts are varied because you have not listed any kind of budget for new gear or the timeframe when you will travel. They are also colored by my preferences, which I'll state up front:

<p>

<ul>

<li>

My preferred medium is still film. For travel photography I shoot primarily slides (Fujichrome) using either 35mm or 645. Then I scan the images.

</li>

<p>

<li>

If you are traveling to less-modernized parts of Eastern Europe you may want to consider a Polaroid camera and film. In several parts of Asia, especially China, I've found an instant camera works wonders. After all, part of traveling for me is getting personal. I want to take away memories, stories, images, and things but I also want to leave some of these, too. Taking an instant photo of villagers, letting them watch it develop, and leaving them with it is a great way to leave a bit of yourself behind.

</li>

<p>

<li>

Don't get me wrong--digital is great and for <i><b>snapshots</b></i> it is my preferred medium. For the photographs I want to <b>endure</b>, film is and will be my preferred medium for the foreseeable future.

</li>

<p>

<li>

But then, I also shoot medium and large format, so that gives you perspective on my position.

</li>

</ul>

<p>

If the trip next week I'd take the F100 hands down. Here's why:

<p>

<ul>

<li>

Even with film, an 18mm lens is going to be kind of tight for the spacious interior shots <b>I would like</b> to bring back from a trip like that. As someone else pointed out, when mounted on a D70 your lens is effectively a 27mm-52mm. For a similar trip I would take <b>both</b> my 14mm and my 20mm, but then I wouldn't be traveling as light as you.</li>

<p>

<li>

Using film and a solid tripod you can shoot really long exposures, compensating if necessary for reciprocity failure, and not have to worry about 'noise' like you would with digital. Longer exposures with digital are, IMHO, a crapshoot, and when I want to shoot craps I'll go to the casino without my camera.</li>

</ul>

<p>

I would also encourage you to take basic warming, cooling, and conversion filters so you can compensate when using daylight film under tungsten or flourescent. Don't discount the latter: one of my favorite series of shots when I visit a foreign country is to walk their malls, markets (indoor and out) and, in Asia, the "wet markets" and take lots of photographs. For some of these a flourescent filter is a necessity. You'll be glad you brought back photos which aren't green!

<p>

 

I would encourage you to look at two alternatives to the table-top tripod, too:

<p>

<ul>

<li>

First is the Manfrotto 682B Self Standing Monopod (<a href="http://www.manfrotto.com/Jahia/cache/offonce/pid/2372?livid=103|113&idx=115">http://www.manfrotto.com/Jahia/cache/offonce/pid/2372?livid=103|113&idx=115</a>), which is not only a tripod but has three retractable legs. I recommend <b>not</b> using this fully extended outside during windy conditions, because it will sway. Under calm or indoor conditions it is the perfect product. I used this on an extended trip throughout China and Japan in 2002 and it was a lifesaver, because some places would not permit tripods. Little did they know...</li>

<p>

<li>

The other product I would suggest looking at is the Kirk STRAP POD (<a href="http://www.kirkphoto.com/accessories.html#strappod"> www.kirkphoto.com/accessories.html#strappod</a>) for those shots where you don't want to haul out the tripod or monopod but need support for a long hand-held exposure. This has been on my want list for a couple of years; I use a home-made version using chain, which is both heavy and rough to handle.

</li>

</ul>

<p>

If the trip were in six months and I could spend $3,000 on equipment before leaving, I <b><i>might</b></i>:

<p>

<ul>

<li>

Buy a D200, because it has much a higher digital resolution than the

D70;

</li>

<p>

<li>

buy a digital 12mm-30mm wide angle lens;

</li>

<p>

<li>

buys lots of storage and backup storage for my images.

</li>

</ul>

<p>

But even then, I'm enough of a film bigot try all that stuff out locally and see how I liked the images, how much backup storage I needed and how I could arrange to upload my images to eliminate the need to carry a PC. I try to leave my PC behind when I travel on pleasure and I make it a point to turn it off one day a week, but then I'm a full-time networking instructor, consultant, and occasional technical author, so I'm broad abeam and flat a finger.

<p>

And here's a few tips from a seasoned traveler:

<p>

<ul>

<li>

Take old clothes which have limited life, so as you travel you can throw them away. On a two week trip in addiiton to good street clothes, I may start with seven sets of underwear and a couple of ratty tee shirts planning to discard half of the underwear and the tee shirts while traveling. I don't skimp on socks and shoes, though.

</li>

<p>

<li>

Fold and then roll your clothes when you pack them. They will take less room, be more solid, and be easier to stuff inside of things like shoes so you don't waste any space.

</li>

<p>

<li>

Also, if you know you're not going to an entire country and you buy Lonely Planet or similar travel guides, just rip out the pages for the places you know you'll be and any pages for <b>likely</b> side trips. Leave the book at home and slip the pages back into the book when you return.

</li>

</ul>

<p>

Whatever you do, please let me know how the images turn out.

<p>

<i>Ciao</i>

[dpurfectlight]

Excellent travel lite tips from Kelly. Thanks for sharing.

[RaymondC]

How important do you think grad filters are?

 

I think I will be taking film becos I need a ultra wide lens. For exposure I can practise back home with slide film, for this I will be using Sensia 100.

 

I don't need to take a laptop or the charger for D70. I will be taking a Canon A510 3MP digicam as friends won't know how to use a SLR - film or digital.

 

I can do mid roll rewind by taking a film retriever and stick white stickers on each roll of film so if I do a rewind I can write down the frame number ..

 

The lens I be taking is 18-35 and a 85/1.8. No external flash and no filters, table top tripod.

[ShunCheung]

<I>I can do mid roll rewind by taking a film retriever and stick white stickers on each roll of film so if I do a rewind I can write down the frame number ..</I>

<P>

If I have the wrong type of film in a body, I might do a mid-roll rewind and put in a different type of film for a whole day. At least when I visit Europe, I would go in and outdoors frequently and require different ISO perhaps after every several frames. IMO, mid-roll rewind is simply not practical in that setting. That was why I said a minimum of two bodies.

<P>

Of course, it will be your call. But if you want to shoot film and don't want to carry two bodies, I would just compromise with ISO 400 print film. Otherwise, you will be very busy doing mid-roll rewind all day long and perhaps end up with some accidental "double exposure."

[kmcgrew]

The joy of photography for a gadget guy or gal is that there are certain tools which are perfect in specific instances, and the graduated filter is an example of that. If you have a dark foreground and a bright sky, this is your ticket. My preference would be to take a Cokin or Lee Filter System with the graduated filter, that way I could use it on multiple lens diamters. That's probably not an issue for you if you take a single lens or two lenses with the same diameter.

 

The person above has a very good point: take a second camera body. I have both an F5 and an old N2020, still I just bought a used FA. Why? Because I got spoiled with my Bronica ETRSi 6 x 4.5 camera, which permits me to have as many film types as I do backs. Now I'll be able to carry negative film (two speeds) and black and white. You can get a good used Nikon body for less than $200 (I saw a N2000 for less than $100 at www.keh.com this morning), and use an external meter or your camera's meter to meter the shot (remember to correct for any difference in speed if you're shooting different films in two cameras). When you get back you can always sell the body, even though you'll take a serious reduction in value, you'll get something back.

 

You said you will be shooting Sensia 100, I believe (I didn't capture your new question before replying, so I can't remember). I'd rather use Velvia or Provia. If you will be in extreme heat or moderate heat for weeks, that's probably not a good idea. Consider a faster film for indoors and don't forget a neutral density filter or two. If you want limited depth of field and the light is bright, your only options are a polarizing filter and/or an ND filter. And remember not to stack too many filters on the lens.

[kmcgrew]

I just re-read your question and noticed that even though you asked about a graduated filter, you indicate you will not be taking "any filters" near the end of that post.

 

The one filter every photographer must have is a polarizing filter: no amount of digital manipulation can make up for the failure to use a polarizing filter when taking the shot, irrespecitve of whether one uses film or digital media.

 

If you want rich, blue skies you need a polarizing filter.

 

If you want to remove the glare from water, you need a polarizing filter.

 

If you want to strip the sheen from storefront windows and see what's on display, instead of the reflection of the people passing by, you need a polarizing filter.

 

Finally, you can always use a polarizing filter in leiu of an ND filter, although you can get pretty dark ND filters which block more light than a polarizing filter does.

 

Good luck!

[RaymondC]

Thanks.

 

I am not sure about the grads yet .. since I live in New Zealand and its expensive. One of the reason for not using digital is becos, not a wide enof lens, I have been browsing some photo books, the 12-24 DX lens is like 33% more expensive here if I import, which is the approx the same as getting it here after compared to the importing cost and taxation. I could get a cheaper Sigma or Tokina or such, but becos it is NZ it again cost more. I rather spend on something that I can appreciate than just on import tax or postage cost. This issue goes towards the grad filters too, grad filtes in here can cost like 40% more than USA or even 60% more, the Singh Ray has to be imported from USA B+H one pro store here mentioned to me, surprise surprise, that is the store I import from directly myself, haha, I mind as well do that myself and cut the middleman out. They do Hitech I think which has a tint I have read, Cokin again a tint, and Heliopan this they can get locally but its expensive comparative to NZ. One of my goals is maybe get them in person at USA or in Hong Kong when the prices are lesser and avoid the import tax and post fees.

 

I will be using Sensia 100 to practise at home for night photos and stuff to learn it and see how well the 3D matrix meter fares and to do practice with the spot meter as well.

 

On my trip I will be using Velvia 50, Provia 100 and Provia 400 pushed one stop mainly. I also have one roll of NPH and NPZ print film.

 

I will try to use just one body, I plan to stick white stickers on each roll of film before I head there and then just carry a pen and write the frame on it when I intend to do a mid roll rewind. For the Provia 400s, I intend to use them all at ISO 800, my pro lab can develop in a dipping tray, a couple of rolls at one go pushed the same is the same price. Thou I have been looking on a auction site regarding a FM2n, that would be good as a 2nd body for a different speed film.

 

 

Raymond

[lance_baker3]

Ray, you have asked the question of the month, it appears. I did not read all the replies because I have a life to live. If you put your film in a lead bag, most security staff ignore it. The ones that lift an eyebrow can usually be convinced to hand-inspect. I have had only one long agrument in 50 X-ray events. But as soon as someone uses a film cannister to sneek explosives onto a plane, we will see much more interest in our film at airports and museums just as we now have increased interest in our shoes at airports.

 

Film has better lattitude than digital. Film can see rushing waterfalls better than digital. Film has a better chance of showing natural eyes with flash than digital. If you shoot slides less than 100 ISO and have them scanned, you will have a 20mb file that can be enlarged to 35 x 52cm (14 x 20 inches) easily with no grain.

 

Digital will give you more chances to make mistakes -- or to correct your mistakes and easily changes ISO speed.

 

I travel extensively with two film cameras, one loaded with ISO 64, the other with ISO 200. But if I had to shoot action or a once in a lifetime event such as a wedding, I would use digital and keep the flash far to the side.

 

If you want to use a Liliputian size tripod, I suspect you don't relish carrying more than one camera. Your results will be compromised in some shots without a decent tripod.

[robert_marotz]

I would personally opt for a D70 for travel. The F100 is the better camera but you don't seem to need the few advantages it would possess over the D70.

 

I think my personal choice kit would be a D200 and FM3A, or in the interest of saving money, the D70 and an FM2n or FE2. If you wanna shoot film, you get some degree of portability, a bit wider angle at your widest, and the nice look of film. If you wanna be a little faster at the trigger, the D70 offers good automation and vast storage with easy deletion of "botched" pics (and even more storage if you wanna take smaller JPEG snapshots)

 

I was going to carry an FG and N90S around China, but am trimming it to just the FG. A very cheap camera, but on the upside, it's very light and still capable of getting perfectly good photographs. My travel partner will have her D70 with her though, so we will have a nice digital/analog pair between us.