Which one; G-1325 or G-1348?

[beeman458]

I've looked through the archives and haven't come up with an answer

to my question. A lot of testimony but no answers.

 

My pithy story.

 

Wanting to upgrade my field legs. Currently using a Bogen/Manfrotto

3221WN with an 488RC0 ballhead for my field legs. The biggest lense

I currently use is a Sigma 100-300mm f/4.0 attached to a 10D w/BG-

ED3. I'll probably never, unless dropped on my head.... again, get a

600mm f/4.0L IS.

 

The ballhead of choice will be either an AS B-1 or a RRS BH-55 LR

with a Kirk L-Bracket. For legs, I'm looking at either the G-1348 or

the G-1325 with a G-1321 leveling base.

 

What am I wanting?

 

I'm wanting the height of the G-1348, with the three leg

configuration of the G-1325 but I want the snap lock design of the

3221WN... all in a carbon fiber construction:)

 

I'm not a pretty picture kind of guy, most is handheld but it's time

to upgrade the leggy legs. I shoot in the rain, wet fields, rocky

streams and on the streets.

 

Would you folks be so kind as to give me some insight to the question

of which set of legs to get as I'm drawn to both at the same time and

it would be silly (very expensive) to purchase both sets of legs

cause I couldn't decide:)

 

I'll look forward to the insight of your replies. Thanks!

[Ed_Ingold]

You need to ask yourself some questions. What's most important to you - cost, height, compactness when folded, strength, convenience? It's your nickel, I can only suggest what you already seem to know.

 

In the Gitzo 13 series tripods, there is little difference in stiffness between 3-section and 4-section legs. The tubes fit so closely that there is little wobble even before the collars are tightened, especially in the CF models. The smallest section of the 1348 is the same diameter as the smallest section in a 3-section G-1227.

 

The G-1348 closes to 24 inches, compared to 26 inches for the 1325 (both sans head). That may make the difference between fitting a suitcase or not. However, if you partially disassemble the legs, even a 1325 will fit a 24 inch suitcase OK. Assume you will have to check or ship your tripod if you travel by air (it's a coin toss at present).

 

Height? Well, 58 inches is probably tall enough, considering that you top it with a 4" head and a 6" camera. It's easier to stoop a little than to shorten the legs or look for something to stand on. If you want TALL, get a G-1504 - 96 inches in its stocking feet. I use mine for roadside shooting to top the weeds (with a 6' stepladder). At 65 inches (without column), the G-1348 may be just the ticket for you.

 

With four sections, it takes a little longer to set up and strike the tripod. I've used both kinds, and so far it's OK either way with me. The 4-step sections are a little shorter, so if I leave one section collapsed, a G-1346 tripod is about the right height for me. With a 3-section G-1340, I always have to slip one of the sections.

 

If you want clips rather than collars, stick with the 3021 - Gitzo tripods have screw collars. Of course the Bogen is shorter and twice as heavy as the corresponding Gitzo, and the clamps snag weeds and need adjusting about once a month or so (don't leave home without the little wrench).

 

The Gitzo collars are secure, self-adjusting, and have never jammed for me. Gitzo legs are 3 times as thick as Bogen legs, so the split-tube and clamp system probably wouldn't work. I've had both kinds, and prefer the Gitzo approach. YMMV.

 

The G-1321 leveling head is very convenient as long as you don't need a columns for extra height. It's also easy to swap heads between tripods with the lever-action tightening screw.

[beeman458]

Thanks for the summation efforts.

 

I can't decide. I guess it's one of those "Less Filling!" "More Taste!" debates. I've brought the spec sheets from B&H up and compared the two tripod's specs, side-by-side and the main points are the number of legs and height difference.

 

I like the height of the 1348 but I also like the three section configuration of the 1325 and I don't need the height of the 1504 as I already have the Bogen/Manfrotto 5238; it tops out at 106" and will carry forty-four pounds but weights in at eighteen pounds as opposed to the 1504 which weights in at twelve pounds.

 

Decisions. Decisions:) "Great taste!" "Less filling!" Hmmmmm!

[beeman458]

Aaaaaah, that's a Bogen/Manfrotto 3258. D'oh!

[Ed_Ingold]

Make a list of the needs and attributes you're considering, and rank them. Attend a seminar on decision making.

 

Point of fact, either tripod would work for you. That's why it's so hard to decide. Nothing is "ideal" for every job, but in this case, there's not enough difference to matter. If you don't mind the cost, go with the 1348. Unlike the aluminum jobs, you actually get more height.

 

Something else for your list. You can easily put a column in either tripod. Replace the normal A/S clamp on the B1 or BH-55 with an RRS Panning Clamp. You wouldn't need the G-1321 then, and have as much height as you need (or not need). This also opens up the possiblity of a G-1227, which is more than adequate for the toppings you have, and a lot easier to carry.

 

Worried whether to get a lever-action clamp or a screw knob? I have both, and it too is a toss. In a tight fit (e.g., a Stroboframe), the lever clamp is the only thing that works. On top of a tripod, a knob works just as well. If you get dirt or sand in a lever clamp, it won't close properly and you can't easily disassemble it for cleaning.

[vandit]

For your stated lenses, why go for the 13xx series? Get a 12xx series and save some money. Also, get Acratech and save some weight as well.

 

If you are like me, and prefer handheld, you'll find that a heavy tripod is a serious disincentive to change. Get something as light as you can. My 1227 happily supports my 100-400, so should be able to handle all your lenses without too many problems.

 

I just got a 500/4 and am most likely going to get a 13xx legset cos I need it, but I still prefer to use the 1227 where I can.

 

Vandit

[beeman458]

"Attend a seminar on decision making."

 

That's funny. Why? How long am I suppose to agonize over which seminar to choose and how will I going to know which one is right for me? I just can't make a decision. :)

[beeman458]

Edward.<p>

 

"If you don't mind the cost, go with the 1348."<p>

 

It tain't the cost, it's the number of legs Vs height. From others which I have read, the scale shifts in favor of the 1325 due to the three leg configuration.<p>

 

"You can easily put a column in either tripod. Replace the normal A/S clamp on the B1 or BH-55 with an RRS Panning Clamp. You wouldn't need the G-1321 then, and have as much height as you need (or not need)."<p>

 

The above get's into a mess in that the Panning Clamp isn't self-leveling yet with a Bogen/Manfrotto <a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=203536&is=REG">3502</a> (Ball Camera Leveller) in the middle, with a BH-55 on top, I'm good to go with a standard graphite column for added height and convenience.<p>

 

"I have both, and it too is a toss."<p>

 

I've read about the dirt issues a couple of times. I figured I'd go with the lever release for convenience and worry about the dirt issues later as dust/sand has never been a problem for me. "Knock on wood."<p>

 

Thanks for your thoughts.<p>

 

Vandit wrote:<p>

 

"For your stated lenses, why go for the 13xx series?"<p>

 

I'm use to heavy gear cause being "blue collar" I'm use to carrying heavy stuff, all day long:) I won't notice four or five pounds. In construction, you never get gear that at the most, you use eighty percent of it's capability. Equipment lasts longer that way and it never get's stressed as to capacity.<p>

 

The purpose of this exercise is to get rid of the dreaded "lense droop" that has beset me of late. As it is, I'm quite happy with the 3221WN set of legs that I currently have. Thought I'd use this as an excuse to step up the quality of my legs. Maybe I just need to put a BH-55 on top of the legs I currently have with a 3502 in the middle and be done with it:) Sometimes we have a way of getting carried away in our zeal.<p>

 

By-the-by Vandit... Wow! Photo safaris. As a rule I rarely travel more than twenty miles for my images and you're doing the world. Too cool!<p>

 

Thanks for your thoughts on the matter.<p>

[Ed_Ingold]

Decision making seminars are often offered by employers, and can be interesting and worth while. It's part of consensus-building that you need on engineering projects, for example. I wan't poking fun at you at all. I see many questions on Photo.Net that could be better answered by a method than a suggested choice.

 

One tool is to construct a matrix of your needs and wants, and to rank or prioritize them. Then rank how your possible choices meet those needs. It can be as analytical or as loose as you wish, but it forces you to break a complex problem into pieces easier to grasp.

 

Your needs could be described as follows: Extended Height (more is better), Folded Length (less is better), Weight (less is better, sometimes), Stiffness (more is better), Cost (less is better), Load Capacity (a wash in this case), setup time (less is better), collars vs. clamps, etc.

 

Which is more important, extended height or folded length? etc. The ranking depends on how you intend to use the tripod - hiking, from a car, in a studio? Can't say? Then rank the intended uses.

 

I don't know if the magazine "Consumer Reports" still exists, but they would construct just such a matrix and rank the products they tested accordingly. Even if their priorities were not mine, at least the parameters were defined.

 

Have fun.

[larry_menzin]

I use the G1325 legs and 1321 levelling base combination and would highly recommend it. Most of my gear is heavy medium format and I shoot routinely at 1/4 sec. with no evidence of camera movement. With a ballhead and camera, it is unlikely that the combination would be too short. With the tripod fully extended, I have to stand on my toes to look into the viewfinder (and I'm 6'3'').

[joseph_smith3]

I use the G 1325 with the G 1321 level base. My former tripod was the Bogen 3221, so I know where you are coming from. I initially had concerns about giving up the convenience of the snap locks on the Bogen. However, with the 1321 in place (on either the 1325 or 1348)you do not have to spend much time adjusting three legs to get everything level. Turning the Gitzo leg collar is a breeze. I am 5 ft 11 in and find the 1325 tall enough for me. I use it mostly with a 500mm f 4.0 lens and camera. Since I like to shoot low a lot, I often never even open the second leg estension on the 1325, let alone a third on the 1348. Go with your gut and don't look back, but get the 1321. Another tip for cf tripod users. Buy rubber caps at your hardware store and put them on over the cf ones on the ends of your tripod legs. Replacing a worn out rubber cap for 50 cents is a lot cheaper than possibly paying for a whole new cf leg extension. Joe Smith

[beeman458]

Edward.

 

"I wan't poking fun at you at all."

 

Nor did I take it that way as I was poking fun at myself:) I thought is was funny (ironic). Okay. Nobody else did:)

 

If it helps, I do problems solving on a daily basis along the lines you described. But now I have a similar set of variables where both of the differences are important; how to split one.

 

Height Vs Number of legs.

 

This is where your personal experience comes to bear as subjective, many times is just as valid as objective.

 

In this case, I've eliminated money and weight as I'm in it for the damping affect of the carbon fiber as opposed to weight and my budget will allow for the price of admission, what ever door I choose to go through. Both the 1325 and 1348 meet my construction requirements of: "At maximum forseeable usage, no more then 80% of the available specs will be used." Overall height being the exception w/add of a column.

 

So now I'm down to the empirically proven subjective or anecdotal if you will:) That's where you guy's experience comes in.

 

Sorry if I came across as offended cause I wasn't. I thought it was ironic/funny.

[beeman458]

Larry wrote:

 

"I use the G1325 legs and 1321 levelling base combination and would highly recommend it."

 

Being only 5'9", it sounds like I won't have to worry. How's the height of the 1325 when you use it on a hillside?

 

Joe wrote:

 

"Go with your gut and don't look back, but get the 1321."

 

Haven't been able to develop a gut feeling yet as I like them both.

 

Over at FredMiranda's site, the guys are writing about the hillside effect and the benefit of the additional height of the 1348. Thinking I might want to change things up a bit. Go with a 1348 w/CF, G1318, column and a Bogen/Manfrotto 3502 ball leveler (10 degrees of adjustment Vs the 15 degrees of the G1321 column.) I can easily level, via the legs, to a few degrees which should be in the specs of the ten degrees of the Bogen/Manfrotto 3502.

 

"Another tip for cf tripod users. Buy rubber caps at your hardware store and put them on over the cf ones on the ends of your tripod legs. Replacing a worn out rubber cap for 50 cents is a lot cheaper than possibly paying for a whole new cf leg extension."

 

Thanks for the extra tip. I didn't know that one would need to protect the tips of the CF legs. One would think that Gitzo had already "thunk" of that:)

[Robert_Lai]

Thomas,<p>I was in a similar position to you back around Christmas of 2004. My old aluminum alloy legs were clearly inadequate for my new 300mm f/4 "Christmas gift to myself". The problem is, I'd never had a Gitzo tripod before, and the local camera stores didn't carry them. So, to photo.net I went, asking for information. Finally, I went with the 1325, and a Markins M20L head. The Markins is quite light, yet can manage an almost 100lb load! Sure, you've said that money is no object. I would argue that money is always an object. Have a look at the Markins before you buy the B1 or the RRS heads. The B1 is the gold standard of ballheads, but it's heavy. RRS has always been very costly, in my opinion. The Markins has the highest load bearing capability to weight ratio of all the ballheads.<p>Why the 1325 and not the 1348? Well, there is the $125 difference which is not a big one in the long run. The main reasons for going with the 1325 was the faster setup with only 3 sections per leg, and the increased rigidity with 3 fewer joints.<p>Like Joseph Smith, I'm 5'11", and the 1325 is quite tall enough for me! I've not tried it on a hillside.<p>The Gitzo locks are very fast to operate, and secure. A quarter turn will do it. I think it's as fast to set up as my old flip lock aluminum tripod. The Gitzo locks are orders of magnitude more secure!<p>Before you go spending your hard-earned cash for the levelling base, try living without it first. I thought that the levelling base would be necessary, but it's quite easy to level the tripod. The tripod has a built in bubble level to help you with that. Most of all, the levelling base handle limits your ability to go right down to the ground for the macro or low angle shots. Since I take a fair number of macro shots, I didn't bother to get the levelling base, and saved $150 in the process.<p>Last tip: buy from Kirk or the Naturesapes.net store. The prices are the same, and the shipping is free for Gitzo tripods. Naturescapes.net will also sell Gitzo tripod repair parts for those times when you wear out your tripod. How? Have a look at the photograph on the naturescapes.net site of two men with their tripods submerged in a river, getting a water level view of a duck. Constant repetition of that sort of treatment, and the bushings eventually do wear.

[beeman458]

"Sure, you've said that money is no object. I would argue that money is always an object."

 

Just a point of clarification. I'm not saying that money's no object, just that I've set a realistic budget and have the ability to meet that budget but it will come after other obligations are first met:) A couple more weeks and I'll be able to start making phone calls.

 

"Have a look at the Markins before you buy the B1 or the RRS heads. The B1 is the gold standard of ballheads, but it's heavy. RRS has always been very costly, in my opinion. The Markins has the highest load bearing capability to weight ratio of all the ballheads."

 

I did what you suggested and the reason the RRS BH-55 won out had to do with it's low profile and vibration characteristics.

 

"Why the 1325 and not the 1348? The main reasons for going with the 1325 was the faster setup with only 3 sections per leg, and the increased rigidity with 3 fewer joints."

 

From what I've read by users here and over on Fredmiranda's site (similar question asked), most were inclined towards the 1325 as I'm inclined towards the 1325 also but the hillside factor leans me towards the 1348. I've run up against the hillside factor on many an occasion and coupled with a column with the few extra inches the 1348 has, it helps ameliorate the hillside factor.

 

"Like Joseph Smith, I'm 5'11", and the 1325 is quite tall enough for me!"

 

What. I feel like one of the shorter guys here in at 5'9":) "Hey guys!" "Down here." :)

 

"The Gitzo locks are very fast to operate, and secure."

 

I've given the Gitzo twist locks a try and you're correct, with a bit of adjustment in thinking, they're quite easy to use.

 

"Before you go spending your hard-earned cash for the leveling base, try living without it first."

 

If it helps, I've been living without one for about forty-two years of being involved in photography and it's a pain in the patootie to level these darn tripods, especially when on a hillside.

 

"I thought that the leveling base would be necessary, but it's quite easy to level the tripod."

 

Not in my case it's not:) You have no idea how much I have to fuss. First one leg and then another and then back to the first leg again. Never a dead on end solution and in the case of plumb, a degree out of plumb at five-hundred yards is a lot of inches worth of parallax error.

 

"The tripod has a built in bubble level to help you with that. Most of all, the leveling base handle limits your ability to go right down to the ground for the macro or low angle shots."

 

A point well taken, hence why I'm looking at the Bogen/Manfrotto 3502 leveling base. It has only ten degrees worth of play as opposed to the Gitzo leveling column's fifteen degrees but I can easily level the tripod to within a degree or three, so I should be good to go with ten degrees and no column to mess with but I do plan on getting a column as I believe in columns, when not doing macros:)

 

"Last tip: buy from Kirk or the Naturesapes.net store. The prices are the same, and the shipping is free for Gitzo tripods."

 

I'll check these suggestions out. Thanks for the tips.

 

"Naturescapes.net will also sell Gitzo tripod repair parts for those times when you wear out your tripod. How? Have a look at the photograph on the naturescapes.net site of two men with their tripods submerged in a river, getting a water level view of a duck. Constant repetition of that sort of treatment, and the bushings eventually do wear."

 

Thanks for the above. I'm one of those construction types who uses the same shovels, hammers, saws, electric tools and drop cords that I was using when I first got into construction..... twenty-six years ago:0 I'm not normal:) But a good source of repair parts is always a good thing to have close at hand.

 

Robert, thanks for all your great information as this sort of information is what I'm hoping to see posted with a question such as what I posted.

[beeman458]

I went ahead, started the ball rolling and ordered the Bogen/Manfrotto 3502 Ball Camera Leveller from B&H.

 

B&H will be closed until 02May05, so I'll have to wait a couple of weeks before it comes in so as to be able to give it a try on the set of legs which I'm currently using.

 

The next purchase to follow will be the RRS BH-55, w/L-Bracket and necessary ArcaSwiss adapter plates.

 

Lastly will come the set of G-1348 legs.

 

Thanks for all the great input guys!

[Robert_Lai]

Thomas,<p>It seems that you already know what you want: The 1325 with RRS ballhead mounted on the Gitzo or Bogen levelling base. As far as tripod levelling goes, if I know I'll be facing the issue of a slope, I tend to extend the smallest leg sections first, then play with the upper or middle locks. Engineering-wise, in theory this is not so good as the smallest leg sections are the least rigid. In practice, the 1325 is very rigid even with the small sections extended. Ergonomically, as far as my back is concerned, I can easily reach the locking collar for the upper segment to make adjustments while still looking at the bubble level. If I try to play with the adjustment of the smallest leg sections, then it's a major headache trying to level this monster! However, I don't use this rig for panoramics yet, so for the final levelling I just use the ballhead with a double bubble level in the camera's flash hot shoe.<p>I understand your philospophy towards tools. Buy the finest, and keep them in good order, and they will last a lifetime. My camera is about 22 years old, and some of my lenses are probably above 30 years old. My car is 17 years old, and going strong. I buy the best hardware that I can afford, and keep them in good shape. When you work with your hands, you really appreciate well made tools. The Gitzo is definitely a superb instrument. By the way, I'm a surgeon, so being able to pay for the cost is not the issue. I'm against the excessive number of disposible items in today's world.<p>Best of luck in your tripod hunt!

[Robert_Lai]

It seems that you were posting while I was composing my epistle. Whatever you have decided upon, I'm sure you'll be quite delighted with!

[beeman458]

"I'm against the excessive number of disposible items in today's world."

 

I currently have three tripods, two ballheads, a monopod and a tri-axis head, none of which will be disposed of. If someone were to try and dispose of this new set up, after I die, I would have to come back and haunt them:)

 

"Whatever you have decided upon, I'm sure you'll be quite delighted with!"

 

And if I'm not, I'm bringing it to your place:) LOL!