How should beginners and young people use P Net to progress?

[david morgan]

What are the strengths and weaknesses of PN with regard to helping

people who are new to photography?

 

Should PN be regarded as a form of academy for photographers?

[mrstubbs]

I don't know about Academy. I have not been here long enough.

 

I would decribe it as Boot-Camp.

 

Post your images. Wait for the sarg to come along and tear you to ribbons. (The guy with Three Hooks) Eventually realise he is just there to toughen you up. Post more images. Compare yours and theirs. Learn. Enjoy. Laugh.

 

Go shoot yourself with a smile.<div></div>

[bennyboy]

I think it would be a better place if people who left churlish comments such as '7/7', or 'crap', etc, took the time to leave constructive criticism.

 

Don't you David?

[jayme]

David- My opinion is that if you ask, you most likely will get an answer on PN. Anthony is correct, if PN teaches you nothing else, it will teach you to eventually have a thicker skin & realize that everyone has room for improvement.

 

I think the place to start is by becoming a member & pay your dues. You obviously have done this.

 

Next, start posting your images through the critique forum. Ask for suggestions & questions in the photo's name, this way it will be seen by some people, who may comment. Don't take the comments as a personal attack, the majority are not.

 

Next, peruse the TRP via the categories that you find interesting. Make comments on images that you find interesting. Ask questions of those photographers that you find interesting. Most are more than happy to offer suggestions & answer specific questions. Start marking those photographers as "interesting" & offer help so you can find them again.

 

Look through the forums, many specific questions can be asked & have already been answered in these forums.

 

Of course, this is just a few suggestions. I'm off to take a look at your portfolio :)

[pjmeade]

Ben has a valid point.

 

I would say that the way to use PN to learn is to ask questions, both in the fora and when rating photographs.

 

We all know that if add an image to the RR queue all that is going to happen is someone will add a 3/3 within a heartbeat. That doesn't help anyone.

 

Asking a question when posting an image sometimes produces an answer but a better way is to comment on other peoples work and to also ask how or why they did what they did.

 

I think the bottom line is contribute to the community, including pay for membership.

 

My 2p

 

Pete

[ben conover]

I agree with some of the above and don't want to pick holes in the rest.

 

David, the operative word in your question is "should".

 

The word "should" implies that there may be a set way of doing things, of course, that's life. We "should" learn photography and we "should" do that in a way which helps ourselevs and other people.

We "should" aslo brush our teeth for exactly 3 mintes every morning....

 

However, when one realises that the "should" is a very weak link, then you see how photo.net operates.

 

According to Cathykins, "Should" is a modal auxiliary, like could, would, etc.

 

Personally and avoiding "should", I reckon people CAN use photo.net

anyway they like as long as they follow the site guidelines for usage. I find little benefit in dealing with "shoulds" etc.

 

More useful to say to oneself, I WILL use this site for learning etc.

 

Photo.net is not a royal academy of arts, it is just a website where people can participate, or not. Whether it "should" be regarded as an academy is not up to me, nor "should" it be. I don't pay enough to expect an academy type service, it's just a bit of fun.

 

However, I suppose there is a market for an increased subscription service within the site, thus providing a more in-depth experience regarding learning, etc. That "could" be an idea.

 

 

Cheers.

[bennyboy]

I'd certainly be interested in Ben's idea of further scubscription options - particularly in the learning environment: professional crits, composition masterclasses, photoshop courses, etc - it all sounds good, but perhaps not particularly cost beneficial for the site?

[ben conover]

Thanks Ben, - particularly in the learning environment: professional crits, composition masterclasses, photoshop courses, etc - it all sounds good, but perhaps not particularly cost beneficial for the site?

 

 

I think people would like to futher their knowledge, even if that involves spending mucho $$$. Let's face the sad fact that photography is an expensive hobby, for some.

 

This idea would not segrgate the non-subscribers, just give them something to aim for. I know that a good teacher can be invaluable, but they are expensive. I think photo.net could introduce an all in one photography masterclass forum, with a subscription fee of say $200 for a year? It could access all elements of the already existing forums and criteria, however it might provide a clear one to one service with perhaps the incentive of featured work, etc. New front page of photo.net might include a link to: "Pro-Masterclass forum results week 1."

 

That way people HERE could see what they were up to but not participate...the incentive being to lure them into buying a subscription to gain access and participation. Of course, it'd have to be worth the $$$ and it'd have to be done very well.

 

It'd also provide a safe haven for those people wishing to avoid beginners questions about digital point and shoots, etc.

 

I think it would be cost beneficial for photo.net, assuming the people "teaching" were qualified to do so, and were not paid too much or too little. Those teachers could have a new sybol or icon next to their name, representing their new found functiona and status. It would not pretend to be a foot into the door of stardom, just another way for people to spend $$$ online, learning. Of course, if stardom follows, that'd be great advertising for photo.net

Photo.net could also promote it's most highly rated "Pro-Masterclass forum members", as part of the site.

 

Perhaps another idea following on from that last one.

With the final results from "Pro-Masterclass forum results week 52" photo.net could organise a featured exhibition of work and sponsor for a chosen photographer. Thereby inspiring exisitng "Pro-Masterclass forum members" to get their skates on.

 

Cheers.

[johncrosley]

David M.

 

I was not a beginning photographer when I began posting two and a fraction years ago . . . I had taken photos seriously some 30 or so years previously, but had slipped into nonproduction.

 

It took a couple of months for me to find the Request for Critique forum, and then I was underwhelmed by the responsse to older, quite good photos I'd considered my masterworks (which now are part of a folder with nearly 4 million views), but the word is 'keep on plugging' and don't be deterred by miserly low rates.

 

Ask for and take with equanity all the good critiques (and learn from them) and ignore the bad.

 

It's kind of like my philosophy for taking good photographs: Put all the good stuff in the frame and leave all the bad stuff out.

 

Same for the fora: Ask all the good questions and keep all the enlightening answers, and ignore the trash and the bad stuff that might be distracting. You'll get a thick enough skin if you know that in any large group there are some troublemakers, especially in the minor fora (forums), where trouble can brew sometimes without prompt moderator interference (I tend to stay away from those fora).

 

Your experience on Photo.net can be a very positive one; it has been for me. I have a wealth of commentators on my photographs, though it seems I'm in a minority; you might look at my photographs and how I treat my commentators to see why, as I'm a little unusual in that regard.

 

You always should acknowledge your commentators -- after all they've taken time to leave you a message and it's no small amount of difficulty to give you a personal message, and like conversation, you should acknowledge it, as they usually come back to see what you have to say to them (there's a feature that allows them to do that, and you for when you leave comments). And always be polite, even though you don't have to accept all comments.

 

Best,

 

John (Crosley)

[ben conover]

I agree with John above and would add that it took me at least as long to find the critique forum.

[david morgan]

Thanks to all who responded to this thread. I note that little reference was made to the rating system which is no surprise.

 

The advice is perhaps best summed up as > Ask, Comment, Contribute.

 

I would perhaps add ''Choose your teachers well'' In other words,

find the photographs that strongly appeal to you personally and

follow those photographers, study their technique and follow their example.

 

Thanks again.

[dave_nitsche]

David, I would suggest to anyone starting or even advanced users with a quest to help <br>

join a group like <a href="http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=617763">Picture This</a> . They are a great group and an amazing way too learn.

[david morgan]

Thanks Dave, on my way over to take a look. Dave

[joe baker pine bush ny]

i once asked a question simular to your here in this forum, Brian,s responce was that this website was not a teaching tool. maybe not by desighn , but i can tell you from my own experance,you can learn, and you can teach. by posting your photos for critique,many wonderful photographer here will comment and incourage you, we will see your creativity and see life as you see it. if you in return comment on photo that interest you, in return you will learn about photographers around the world, there techniques and there passions.

keep shooting keep posting keep commenting keep learning.

sincerly Joe B.