geopappas Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 Greetings. I recently have found a website (http://http://www.ayaran.com/photo/) that has copied at least one photo of mine from Photo.Net and placed it on their website. Not only that, but they have pasted their own logo onto the photo (which gives it the appearance that it is their photo). Here is the link to the hijaaked photo:http://www.ayaran.com/photo/displayimage.php? album=57&pos=68 And it gets worse. I have seen other photos from Photo.Net on their as well. Here are links to other photos from Photo.Net: http://www.ayaran.com/photo/displayimage.php?album=57&pos=52 http://www.ayaran.com/photo/displayimage.php?album=57&pos=77 (originally by Dave Nitsche) http://www.ayaran.com/photo/displayimage.php?album=57&pos=76 (originally by Dave Nitsche) http://www.ayaran.com/photo/displayimage.php?album=57&pos=79 (originally by Kim Slonaker) For all I know, most (or all) of the photos might be hijaaked. I was wondering want course of action (if any) to take? I was also wondering what Photo.Net might be able to do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keith turrill Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 The Network Solutions Whois, lists the registration for Ayaran.com as coming from Iran. The contact is listed as a "Mazloumi, Shahram" having an e-mail address of info@pamchal.net. The servers that Ayaran.com runs on are DNS6.CHEAPERDOMAIN.COM and DNS7.CHEAPERDOMAIN.COM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nacivet Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 Why not ask to Dave and Kim in first place if they send pictures to Ayaran.com, actually Dave Nitsche pictures are still credited to his name on Ayaran.com. What is worrying is that one of your picture appear there, you have two solutions; a) they take it from you on PN. Or somebody steal your picture and put it there, pretending it was his own. I'm very intesrested to follow the case. You could even set a trap, asking to buy the copyrights for your own picture using an anonymous email address?!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geopappas Posted February 3, 2005 Author Share Posted February 3, 2005 Jean-Paul: << Why not ask to Dave and Kim in first place if they send pictures to Ayaran.com... >> I have already notified Dave Nitsche, Kim Slonaker, and Fabian Grunwald of the situation. I will see if they have given the site permission, but I really doubt. << What is worrying is that one of your picture appear there, you have two solutions; a) they take it from you on PN. Or somebody steal your picture and put it there, pretending it was his own... >> The only people that could have stolen my picture are viewers (or employees) of Photo.Net. I have never posted the photo or sent it anywhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
actuallynoname Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 quoting Jean-Paul Nacivet "You could even set a trap, asking to buy the copyrights for your own picture using an anonymous email address?!!" I think it would be a good idea... the simplest thing you could do afterwards is to ask them to delete the photo from their gallery... but if you want to go on... you could have the copyrights paid by that site. obviously, by naming the site in this forum you are already making a bad publicity to their site. If this thread will be listed in GOOGLE or any other search engine, they will have their name linked to the infringement of copyrights and intellectual property obviously, by naming the site in this forum you are already making a bad publicity to their site. If this thread will be listed in GOOGLE or any other search engine, they will have their name linked to the infringment of copyrights and intellectual property Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kslonaker Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 No, I did not give that site permission to use one of my images. I don't have much of a problem if they give credit to me, but in this case, they have their own logo on MY image. What can we do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappoldt Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 I recognized no less that 14 images on that site as various photo.net contributors. The images don't seem to be for sale, though you can send them on as "ecards." The file names are exactly as taken from the site naming convention - there hasn't even been an attempt to conceal. What to do? Well, you can begin by emailing the site owner, inform him of the copyright, and suggest that the web host may dump him for imfringement if you report him. I think Dave N. has the best move to prevent- sign your photos in such a place that the composition (and subsequent excellence) of a photo is ruined if the name is removed with a crop. As the guy isn't even re-naming the snatched files, it's pretty obvious he's lazy in nature - so likely wouldn't clone out a signature. By the look of it, he's trying to attract traffic to the site to get advertisers to pay more (based on number of site hits as pricing justification). He's making a buck off the images, in other words - sales of prints or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappoldt Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 Regarding legal recourse...It IS after all the same Iran who stood tall in the news today, denouncing Bush and his supporters as evil men who want nothing more than to cripple Islam in response to Bush's accusation that they fund terrorism and are developing nukes. Dunno how well legal recourse would go from that end - so watch empty threats! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wind.dk Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 If the images are served from Iran, there's probably not a lot to do - it appears that Iran is one of the few countries that hasn't signed the Berne Convention. This is not something I actually *know*, I just googled a little to check. You can ask (as politely or impolitely as you like) the site administrator to remove the images and see what happens. Maybe he'll respect your wishes and remove them. Maybe he doesn't know that what he's doing is legal (if it really is served from Iran) and will remove them out of fear. Maybe he'll ignore you and keep the images up. In that case there's nothing you can do legally. He may not do the right thing, but he's doing the legal thing. Again, all assuming the images are served from Iran. And assuming there are no bilateral copyright protection agreements specifically between Iran and your country. Or you can wait until Iran signs the Berne Convention, they'll probably get around to it some day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keith turrill Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 Looking a little further, even if the website owner is in Iran, the webhost and computer servers (Cheapedomain.com) are in California. I am no expert in law but the first step is probably for any agreived parties to make a complaint by certified mail to the webhosting company. Their address appears to be as listed below, but the phone number looks a little odd. Cheaper Domain, Inc P.O. Box 1255 Rancho Santa Fe, CA 92067-1255 858-123-4567 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertpastierovic Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 If nothing helps, the only thing you can do is send e-mail to google.com or other similar sites in order to block their site to be searched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james_oneill Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 Contact the hosting company and tell them that the items in question are the subject of a copyright dispute. They're in California and I think the law there makes someone liable if they help a third party to infringe your copyright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_thalheimer Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 This isn't the first time this has come up. Some sites have the right click copy/paste ability disabled. Can that be done at PN without much trouble? On the down side this will hamper one who is critiquing to be helpful in altering an image and posting it into the critique. I guess I'm asking would it be worth disabling the right click function on an image? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geopappas Posted February 4, 2005 Author Share Posted February 4, 2005 I have checked out cheaperdomain.com to see if I could find a contact and there is none that I could find. It also looks like an Iranian run website. I say this because of two links at the bottom of the page: The first is "Dating Singles" which links to www.hotiranians.net. The second is "Live Chat" which links to www.farsichat.com. The site seems to do nothing but list other sites. So it seems like the site is also making money from advertising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geopappas Posted February 4, 2005 Author Share Posted February 4, 2005 Christopher Appoldt: << I recognized no less that 14 images on that site as various photo.net contributors. >> I would suggest that you (or someone) notify the owners of the copyright infringement. They at least have the right to know what is happening with their images. Plus, they might be able to add some valuable insight into the matter. << I think Dave N. has the best move to prevent- sign your photos in such a place that the composition (and subsequent excellence) of a photo is ruined if the name is removed with a crop. As the guy isn't even re-naming the snatched files, it's pretty obvious he's lazy in nature - so likely wouldn't clone out a signature. >> Actually, there are some photos on the site that don't have a signature that don't have the Arayan logo. For example, the image by Fabian Grunwald (http://www.ayaran.com/photo/displayimage.php?album=57&pos=52 ) has not been compromised (as of yet). << By the look of it, he's trying to attract traffic to the site to get advertisers to pay more (based on number of site hits as pricing justification). He's making a buck off the images, in other words - sales of prints or not. >> I agree. I am wondering if we can contact the advertisers themselves. That might be the best way to put the site out of business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geopappas Posted February 4, 2005 Author Share Posted February 4, 2005 This just seems to get worse the more I look into it... One thing that is starting to really concern me is the fact that <B>the Ayaran website seems to somehow have gotten a hold of the EXIF info for some of the photos as well</B>. NOTE: You can view the info for the photo by clicking on the small blue "i" button above the photo. For example, the following photos both have EXIF info: http://www.ayaran.com/photo/displayimage.php?album=57&pos=52 http://www.ayaran.com/photo/displayimage.php?album=57&pos=68 How is this possible? <B>This makes me think that the Photo.Net database might have been comprised.</B> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mottershead Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 The reason we don't disable the right click thing is that it is so trivial to circumvent that all we would do would inconvenience honest people. For example, there are plenty of browsers that don't even have that "feature". You don't even have to use a browser to retrieve information from web sites. In a command window, just type "telnet www.photo.net 80"; then type "GET some.jpg HTTP/1.0", and you have the image. And there are plenty of easier ways. The right-click thing is really a false sense of security, and is only worth doing if you want to snow your users that you are "doing something". photo.net isn't into that. So, there is no technical solution. The only thing that stops people from copying your images is either not publishing them (including in print) or enforcing your copyright rights legally, if possible. Since the web hosting company is in California, under the Digital Millenium Copyright Act, you can send a "takedown notice" to the "DMCA agent" of the ISP or web hosting company. There should be somewhere reasonably easy to find on that site which tells you how to contact the DMCA Agent. On photo.net, you will notice that we have a link to the information about how to contact *our* DMCA agent on every page. The DMCA agent is obliged to investigate your claims and respond. Almost certainly, they will take the stuff down. If the site was actually in Iran, there probably isn't anything that you could do, other than appeal to the conscience of the person who is doing this, and who knows whether that would work. I would try contacting the person anyway, since if they take it down, that will save you some effort with the DMCA approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geopappas Posted February 4, 2005 Author Share Posted February 4, 2005 Brian: Would they be able to obtain the EXIF info via a telnet GET? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mottershead Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 Sure, its embedded in the JPEG file. I'm not speculating that my telnet example is how arayan.com got the images. My point is that there are any number of ways to get images off a web site. Since we don't disable right-clicks, that is probably how they got them, since it is easy. But even if we did disable the right-clicks, there are still plenty of easy ways to get them anyway. Our server serves them to anyone who sends a valid HTTP request. The right-click thing assumes that someone is using a standard browser, but there are plenty of ways to get them by not using a standard browser, as illustrated by the telnet example. Even with a standard browser and the right-click thing turned on, someone can still get the images by doing a screen-capture, or getting them out of the browser cache -- to mention two easy ways. The right-click thing is completely bogus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mottershead Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 On looking into this further, I think the company in California, CHEAPERDOMAINS.COM, is just the domain registrar and the operator of the name server. All the name server is doing is telling the world that "arayan.com" is really such-and-such IP address. The web site looks like it is in Iran. I could be wrong, but I don't think you'll get far with a DMCA takedown notice to the company operating the name server. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
._._z Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 Domain Name: AYARAN.COM <br> Registrar: WILD WEST DOMAINS, INC.<br> Whois Server: whois.wildwestdomains.com<br> Referral URL: http://www.wildwestdomains.com<br> Name Server: DNS6.CHEAPERDOMAIN.COM<br> Name Server: DNS7.CHEAPERDOMAIN.COM<br> Status: REGISTRAR-LOCK<br> Updated Date: 28-jan-2005<br> Creation Date: 28-apr-2004<br> Expiration Date: 28-apr-2006<br> <p> Last update of whois database: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:03:54 EST <br> <p> Registrant: Pamchal<br> - - -, - - Iran<br> <p> Registered through: LIFEDOMAINS.NET<br> Domain Name: AYARAN.COM<br> Created on: 28-Apr-04<br> Expires on: 28-Apr-06<br> Last Updated on: 28-Jan-05<br> <p> Administrative Contact: Mazloumi, Shahram info@pamchal.net<br> Pamchal<br> - - -, - - Iran<br> 98219121142951 Fax -- <br> Technical Contact: Mazloumi, Shahram info@pamchal.net<br> Pamchal - - -, - - Iran<br> 98219121142951 Fax -- <br> <p> Domain servers in listed order:<br> DNS6.CHEAPERDOMAIN.COM<br> DNS7.CHEAPERDOMAIN.COM<br> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kslonaker Posted February 6, 2005 Share Posted February 6, 2005 I emailed the contact address and no reply so far - big surprise. Thanks .[.Z for posting the information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geopappas Posted February 6, 2005 Author Share Posted February 6, 2005 It might be better to try and contact the companies that are supporting the website. The site has Google ads on it, so it might be better to contact them. If the site can't make money, maybe they will go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kslonaker Posted February 6, 2005 Share Posted February 6, 2005 George, that's what I threatened in my email. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ah_faat Posted September 24, 2005 Share Posted September 24, 2005 The IP address of www.ayaran.com is 66.235.185.227 and i did a tracert to the server. <br> .....<br> 8 86 ms 87 ms * ae-0-0.bbr1.Washington1.Level3.net [64.159.0.229] <br> 9 90 ms 89 ms 129 ms ae-22-56.car2.Washington1.Level3.net [4.68.121.179] <br> 10 103 ms 89 ms 88 ms ge10-0.core1.dca2.hopone.net [66.36.224.190] <br> 11 85 ms 90 ms * vl2.msfc1.distb2.dca2.hopone.net [66.36.224.229] <br> 12 86 ms 130 ms 138 ms 66.235.185.227 <p> So, the last hop to before reaching the ayaran web server is a router from hopone.net. <p> From theISP's web site, www.hopone.net, it said it doesn't provide end-user service and have to go through it's reseller, http://www.hopone.net/resellers.php. More effort can be done to find out which reseller ayaran used. Most of the resellers are US, Canada or UK based companies. That make use easier to complain to them. <p> --arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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