super wide angle for architecture

[.th]

hi<br><br>

 

hope to get some recommendations from experienced users. i need a wide

angle lens to stick on a digital nikon body, say about 12-14mm. it''s for

shooting arcitecture, inside and out, so distortion is my worst enemy. i have

nothing against zooms, and the lens in question doesn't have to be all that

fast either, as camera will be sitting on a tripod most of the time. but sharp,

wide, distortion free,... is there such a lens??<br><br>

 

thanks in advance<br>

thorirv

[james_ogara1]

The 20 2.8 AIS is sweet. I'm sur esomeone will post re the 12-24 DX.

 

I think the lowest one could go in normal (24 x 36) format without distortion is 18mm.

[edward_h]

Since Nikon has one only tilt/shift lens and that would be the 85 PC which, I'm sure you'll agree, is completely useless for architechture due to its length. What the point of even having a PC lens is beyond me, but let's not second guess Nikon. They know what they're doing.

 

Your best guess would be the Sigma 12-24, seeing that if you ever use a film body it won't vignette, like the 12-24DX. After shooting you'll have to loose valuable megapixels correcting perspective with software, though. Unless you like really weird curved buildings and such.

[ShunCheung]

The 85mm Nikkor T/S is a macro lens meant for small product photography under a controlled environment: table top, light box, etc. Obviously there can be other applications for that lens.

 

The best way to shoot serious architecture photography is probably still large-format film cameras. If you must shoot digital, either use a full-frame Canon DSLR (from the 1Ds family) with the Canon 24mm T/S lens or perhaps a Nikon mount Kodak DSLR with the 28mm/f3.5 shift Nikkor. I am assuming that the latter camera/lens combinations will work. At this time I don't think there is any 12mm shift lenses.

[will_legge]

No lens can compensate for the wide-angle effect - round objects at the edge of the image appear stretched toward the center. To correct for perspective, you need shifts. Most 35mm shift lenses are quite long - 35mm or so. You may consider using that and stitching images together to get what you need. Your best bet is a large-format camera.

[Robert_Lai]

I found out the hard way that there's a big learning curve to <a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=008o8I" >architectural photography</a> <p>All wide angles for SLRs have barrel distortion. The wider you go, the worse it gets. There is software available for the 12-14mm, I understand, to counteract the distortion and straighten out the lines.<p>As Shun suggested, get a film camera for this one. If you can't get a 4x5 view camera, use a 35mm camera (full frame digital, or film) in order to get a wide angle that's not outrageously short. I used a 28mm PC Nikkor with success. You can see what results I obtained in the link above.<p>Truly, the hardest part is lighting (at least, it was for me). You can never have enough flash units and reflectors! Those flashes and the flash meter occupied over 95% of my time. Once they were all set up, taking the picture was basically trivial. I would still bring the digital camera along to preview the effects of flash on the scene, and to check the lighting balance as well as for lens flare.<p>There's good advice from other photo.netters in the link that I've provided. Good luck with your efforts.

[suvrat_lele]

I would use 12-24 and correct distortion in post processing. Panorama Tools - plugin for photoshop or stand-alone program called PTLens - does an excellent job.

 

I have used it for 18-70 DX lens which has a LOT of distortion at 18mm. Abosolutely no distortion (that is not noticable at 100% view on computer monitor - which is a large magnification) after processing. In the digital world it is not necessary to have a distortion free original picture.

[ShunCheung]

Coincidentally, a few days ago I posted an image of the old train station clocktower in Kowloon, Hong Kong. (The train station is long gone, but the clocktower is preserved as a historical building.) I shot it with the 12-24mm DX at 12mm on my D100. There is a comment that the tower looks leaning, and I added a "corrected" version using PhotoShop. The tower in the corrected version looks abnormally short.

<P>

<A HREF="http://www.photo.net/photo/2939472">

http://www.photo.net/photo/2939472</A>

<P>

However, architecture images shot with a shifted PC lens can look abnormal also. While the sides are no longer leaning, the corners of the buildings seem exaggerated.

[brian_caldwell]

"The tower in the corrected version looks abnormally short."

 

I think the corrected version may not be corrected correctly. Panorama Tools together with a good frontend like PTAssembler can give flawless results on images like this. The LensDoc plugin for Photoshop is also good, but I think not as accurate as Panorama Tools.

[ellis_vener_photography]

12-24mm f/4G DX Nikkor sharper than the 20mm f/2.8D AF Nikkor (yes this comes from

actually testing the lenses). No it isn't completely distortion free (what lens in this focal

rnge is as someone earlier pointed out) but the PanoTools+ Lensfix plug-in for Photoshop

solves most problems.

[johnmarkpainter]

THorir,

 

Your best bet is to get as high as you can (I use a ladder) and keep your camera as close to

parallel as possible.

 

Then correct in Photohsop. I get better results from shooting Film with a longer focal

length than I do with a Wide lens cropped by a DSLR.

 

jmp

[.th]

thank you all for your promt responses.<br><br>

 

but i feel that maybe i didn't make myself clear on what i'm after.<br>

converging verticals is not a concern, since i'll be mounting the camera on a

tripod, keeping the film plane (sensor chip) vertical. i don't need shift

capabilities - well shift in this case doesn't excist since nikon doesn't make

one wide enough - instead i'll move the camera up/down where appropriate

to compose the desired frame. what i am after is simply a wide angle lens,

giving a similar coverage as - say - 21mm on a 35mm camera (or slightly

wider), BUT, a wide angle lens that doesn't distort like a madman. judging

from what i've been reading, i'm beginning to think that such a lens doesn't

excist for an slr system. at least not nikon, not knowing about what the other

brands are offering.<br><br>

 

i have the 18-70dx lens, which in this respect is plain awful at the wider end.

the same things have i heard about the 12-24dx lens, though as some have

pointed out that one may be a good choice, combined with digital correction

(pano tools or similar), which i'm btw unfamiliar with. discussions on the sigma

12-24 point out some quality issues, some people claiming that their good

sigma came with their third example....<br><br>

 

as some have pointed out, lf would be the optimum solution, not only in terms

of perspective control but film size as well, but the process is too slow.

<br><br>

 

but thanks a lot for your input.... ;-) <br>

th.v.

[ellis_vener_photography]

The 12-24mm f/4G DX Nikkor is very far from awful at the short end of the focal length

range. Very far.

[.th]

ellis, i'm pleased to hear that.<br><br>

 

it would be kind of interesting to see comparison between the nikon 12-24dx,

and the sigma 12-24, to see which one distorts more. i'm sure the nikon is

sharper, countless user reporst claim it to be excellent in that respect, but

quite a few have also complained about considerable distortion @12mm.<br>

<br>

 

but somehow, the more i think about this the more i feel i'm asking too much

from an slr lens....

[astral]

My approach to architecture: first, I work hard on selecting the best viewpoint before even looking through a camera; second, I have a choice of equipment that I can use (even if most of it is at home when I need it!):

 

Nikkor 20mm f2.8AF which gives some distortions and a touch of illumination fall-off but is fine for many architectural shots; Nikkor 18-35mm f3.5-4.5 IFED AF has some fall-off at wider apertures and has somewhat more complex distortions than the 20mm; a Tokina 20-35mm f3.5-4.5 (Mk I) which has better fall-off characteristics than the 18-35 Nikkor and appears a touch sharper at some apertures, but has slightly lower contrast - a very good lens nevertheless.

 

However, for wider angles (15mm) and more demanding applications I use a Voigtlander Bessa R2 with 15mm Heliar & 25mm Skopar (possibly a 12mm soon too). The key advantages to me are: a) distortions are better than with most SLR lenses (despite other trade-offs); b) I have a small camera dedicated to the 15mm lens; c) my secondhand Bessa+15mm+25mm cost me less in total (around 600UKP) than a 15mm AF Nikkor would.

 

I also use a Pentax 28mm shift lens at times: this gives good control of perspective and tolerable distortions, but at full shift the effects become unnatural or unacceptable, though interesting. My main use for this lens is in exploiting its depth of field/depth of focus characteristics to the fullest.

 

Alan Clayton

Nottingham

England