Shooting at weddings wide open - technique and philosophy

[fotografz]

"Shooting at weddings wide open - technique and philosophy"

 

For me there is no single philosophy, and a variety of techniques. There is no pat answer.

 

I'll share a few opinions, with the full idea that it's not everyone's cup of tea, nor do we all

agree on everything.

 

In general, shallow DOF is the first thing people think of concerning the use of fast lenses

wide open. This is exactly that, a generalization. As stated in previous posts, distance is a

mitigating factor, as is the focal length being used. A 24/1.4 has an enormous DOF

compared to a 80/1.4 even when shot at a closer distance to subject.

 

For example, here's a shot of the bride's Grandpa who snuck outside for a cigar. It was

shot with a 24/1.4 @ 1.4 pretty close up. It held DOF for the subject while softening the

distant background.<div></div>

[fotografz]

Now, here is a candid of the bride using a 85/1.2 @ f/1.2. When shooting this kind of image

being just the right distance can help hold important areas of focus, and you have to be

aware of what is going on in the background and position yourself to use it ... like I did with

the attached photo using the bright areas as part of the design.

 

An interesting side note: What you see in the viewfinder of a SLR/DSLR ISN"T what you really

will get. It's a tiny version of it, and like small icons on your desktop, it looks sharper and

some marginally in-focus areas of the image will look in perfect focus to your eye ... until you

open them at size.<div></div>

[fotografz]

The issue of shooting the KEY, must have shots wide open is a matter of practice and level of

confidence based on experience. Personally I wouldn't recommend it until you absolutely

have the technique down pat. When in doubt, stop down.

 

That said, I love doing these key shots wide open, because it zeros the eye in on the very

reason your shooting that image in the first place.

 

Like this first kiss shot ... one chance, one frame ... get it or you don't.<div></div>

[fotografz]

Another use of DOF, is to shoot through to the subject, with the foreground gone soft as well

as the background. It creates an interesting layered sense of depth. Like this salon shot done

with a H2D/22 using a HC100/2.2 @ f/2.2 ( this is a medium format kit, and MF lenses have

less apparent DOF than their 35mm equivalent at the same f stop ).<div></div>

[fotografz]

Lastly, an opinion on what's sharp and what's not. Technique plays a much larger roll in

this than does the lens quality. Accurately placed focus, understanding the concept of

distance/focal length, and holding the camera reasonably steady are very important when

shooting wide open apertures.

 

Given all those are mastered, THEN higher quality glass is worth the money. Why? IMO,

because attention is paid to optical performance by lens designers with their flagship fast

glass. Most (not all) lenses perform pretty well a f/5.6 ... the true test is how much that

quality dissipates as you open up.

 

Except for a few examples, almost all fast lenses are sharper stopped down a stop or two.

The question is how sharp are they wide open in comparison to other makes and models?

 

I've found that the areas that are in focus with the Canon 85/1.2 @ f/1.2 are very sharp ...

surpassed only by the 135/2 @ f/2 which is Canon's best lens under 200mm IMO.

 

When I shot Contax N their Zeiss N85/1.4 was the best 85 I ever used wide open. If I shot

Nikon, I'd be checking out the new Zeiss ZF85/1.4.

 

Without a doubt, the best over-all fast glass for shooting wide open that I've ever used is

that for the Leica M.

 

But this is all subjective opinion. You have to ferret out what lenses, at what price, will

satisify your needs, and not worry about what else is out there.

[ken c oshkosh, wi]

I love using my 85mm 1.2L wide open. Here's one from a few weeks ago... I love how wide apertures set off my subjects. More often that not I use my 24, 35 and 85 L's wide open.<div></div>

[fotografz]

Oh, and another cool thing about fast lenses is using them without flash to get shots that

feel like it really was. Kind of obvious, but with the higher ISO cameras these days a real

oportunity to get images that no one else at the wedding will get with their P&S cameras : -)<div></div>

[larry schaefer - chicago,]

How much sharpening is put on all the images?

[fotografz]

Correction: Lucas was good enough to point out that the B&W shot of Grandpa I posted was

done with a 35/1.4 not a 24/1.4. Actually it makes the point even better. Wider lenses offer

more DOF.

 

 

What do you mean Larry? I'm sure they are all sharpened to some degree. Web sized images

are no way to judge that kind of thing ... it's so easy to under or over-sharpen something

only 500 pixels wide.

[ben_rubinstein___mancheste1664880652]

Well I think I've found a good solution based on Bruce's very important point that traditional clients want something rather more 'traditional' for the must have shots.

 

Yup a second body. The first body will be my 5D with 24-70L and flash as usual, the second will be the new Pentax K10D (which I was buying anyway) and the pancake 70mm set constantly to f2.4 which is wide open for a different viewpoint, shallower DOF and ambient light only. The Shake Reduction and auto iso will of course be useful for this. That way I get the 'expected' shots with the expected look, as well as being able to provide something different and better than my competitors, namely a more artisitic approach scattered throughout the album.

[ken c oshkosh, wi]

<i>being able to provide something different and better than my competitors, namely a more artisitic approach scattered throughout the album.</i><p>

 

Exactly. I'm familiar for the most part with what my competitors shoot with and none of them shoot with 1.4 or 1.2 primes. Mostly 2.8 and slower zooms that they can kind of achieve the look but not quite. With my wedding stuff, the occasional senior and engagement shoots I often shoot nearly wide open all the time. My customers like it and it's kind of unique.

[jonj]

Much like stacy I now favor my 135mm f2.8 on a Pentax DL (non-pro)body. I think 85mm and 135mm prime as fast as you can get are ideal and a must for portraits and weddings. I use my 135mm for Photojournalism like in this shot from last week. It gets me far enough from the subject without being in their face and DOF is just right that it does not over power the photo. There is no way this shot would work if the DOF was not shallow. Hope this helps<div></div>

[jake_holt]

"Well I think I've found a good solution based on Bruce's very important point that

traditional clients want something rather more 'traditional' for the must have shots.

Yup a second body."<p>

 

Ben, that's just what I do. 5D with bracket, flash and zoom lens for the gotta have it shots,

and a 20D over my shoulder with either a 50 1.4, 85 1.8 or 200 2.8. I mix them up

constantly, and I like the results. I generally use the 17-40 as my zoom, since I like to

shoot wide and it can give a very good mix of perspective. Side by side shots of important

moments like a ring exchange from a true 17mm and then a 1.6x 85mm or 200mm look

great together!

 

<p>Another nice benefit of the 2 camera setup is that, with the ST-E2 on my 20D, I can

quickly pull the flash off of the 5D's bracket and trigger it off-camera while just holding it

up in my left hand. So I get the options of a zoom with flash, a fast prime with available

light or a fast prime with off-camera flash at my disposal within 5 seconds. A 2 camera

setup is the way to go, although it kills my back!

[picturesque]

That's interesting, Jake--how does the 580EX have to be set to operate with the 5D and with the 20D via the ST-E2? Do you have to move switches before you can go from one to the other?

[jake_holt]

On the 5D, the 580 is on a bracket with an off-camera shoe cord, and the master/slave

switch is set to "off." If I want to use it with the 20D, I just detach it from the bracket, move

the switch to slave and turn on the ST-E2.

[picturesque]

Thanks, Jake--never thought of that. Might try it one day.

[picturesque]

Makes me realize that no one has mentioned using the ST-E2 just as a focus aid for low light/wide aperture shooting, although Marc Williams has mentioned this numerous times in the past. Are there better ways to autofocus now?

[jake_holt]

I haven't tried to use the ST-E2 just as a focus aid - I thought about it once but I believe

the manual said it won't fire the IR assist beam if it doesn't detect a slave unit - so you

gotta be firing a flash. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

<p>

Also, I forgot to mention one important and useful part of the setup I mentioned earlier - I

almost always have an assistant holding a slave flash as well, so I can take advantage of

that slave 580 in multiple ways:

<p>

I can use it along with the 5D and 580+bracket. The on camera 580 works as a fill and

the assistant held 580 works as a main light. The assistant-held 580 is often set at +1/3

or 2/3 <p>

 

Or, with the 20D and ST-E2, I can trigger both my off camera hand held 580 and the

assistant held 580 to provide the same effect.

<p>

OR (getting back to the topic of wide-open shooting) the assistant held 580 can be used

just with the 20D + ST-E2 to provide a directional Rembrandt style effect. I really like to

use this setup with my 85 1.8 opened up - it creates some very dramatic effects.<p>

 

Anyway, just wanted to share this setup - it opens up lots of lighting options with just a

minumum of quick minor adjustments. You can have zoom, prime, available light, on

camera flash, off camera flash and multiple flash setups at your disposal within seconds.

That is, if you can find an assistant who will hold a slave flash for you all day!

[jake_holt]

Yeah, that was supposed to be HTML.

[jake_holt]

Here's an example of that Rembrandt style effect with the 20D, ST-E2 and one assistant held

580EX. This was the 50 1.4 shot at f3.5. Not wide open, but you get the idea.<div></div>

[jfr]

Jake, you could also try exchanging your off shoe camera cord for the ST-E2. That way you won't have to switch camera's and you get a much better aimed focus assist from the top of your camera.

[fotografz]

The STE-2 DOES work as a focusing aid without a flash.

 

While it may not send out a firing signal if no slave flash is present, it does send the focus

aid red light.

 

NOTE: I have two STE-2 senders. On one of them I lost the lower red plastic front cover

during a wedding. What I discovered was that it vastly improved the performance as a

focus aid. The light emitted is way brighter and more concentrated lines are placed on the

subject. It also works better at longer distances. So, I use that one when shooting fast

lenses in available light with no flash. Try it. The cover pops right off. Take it into a dark

room and project it on a wall, then put on the cover and watch how the light becomes

fuzzier and dimmer.

 

When the flash is on a bracket using an off camera cord, the flash's red focus aid light is

all but useless ... and the closer you are to the subject, the more useless it gets as a focus

aid. It's too high. Especially true if you're using the more sensitive center focus point in the

viewfinder.

 

The best set up IMO, bracket or not, is to mount the STE-2 in the camera shoe, so the

focus aid works. When I used to use a bracket, I had the flash mounted on a quick release

and set to slave, and the STE-2 in the camera's flash shoe. No cords, and being that close

to the flash, never a miss-fire. For hand held work, just QR the flash, and shoot. No

fiddling around.

 

A) Stroboframe Quick Release for flash.

 

B) Red Plastic cover removed on STE-2 to improve Focus Aid function.

 

C) Need a bracket that extends up high enough, so the flip arm doesn't block the STE-2's

Focus Assist light ( Stroboframe Pro-T works, Press-T doesn't work)<div></div>

[jake_holt]

Marc, that's a good idea to ditch the cord - I didn't figure the St-E2 would fire the flash in

that position since it isn't pointing directly at it.<p>

I always lose that little red plastic piece, and feel so lucky that I always find it! I guess I

should just let it go.

[john paul]

Hi Ben. I'm a big fan of shooting wide open with a 1.8 lens and a couple of 2.8s

 

I was working a wedding last weekend and came up with your problem of buisy backrounds.

I decided to photoshop many of the pre wedding shots with lens blur.

 

John.<div></div>

[robbie_caswell]

Damn your the mad scientist... now I'm researching how can I get that to work on my Nikon D200/Sb800?