Hassleblad Dual Format 35mm v. Medium Format

[andre_hassid]

I recently read a review of the new Hassleblad x-pan dual format 35mm camera. I'm interested in people's thoughts on the advantages of the panoramic mode of this camera compared to using medium format cameras (I use a Fuji and Rollei). Hassleblad mentioned in the review that this camera was an attempt to bring medium format to 35mm users. I guess they meant because the negative was 80% wider than a standard 35mm it provides a little of medium format's larger negative advantage. But what focal length lens would you need on a 645 format camera in order to get the width that the new Hassleblad provides in the panoramic mode.

 

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Thanks,

 

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Andre

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[bobatkins]

I played with one last week. The advantage is that it is

<em>small</em>. No bigger than a small 35mm SLR body or a even a large

P&S. Much smaller than ANY medium format camera including the Fuji 645

series. Much like a Leica M6.

 

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I belive the 40mm lens used in the panorama mode has an angle of view

similar to that of a 24 or 28mm lens in standard 35mm format. The

equivalent medium format lens would, of course be 40mm, since the

frame width is about that of medium format!

[paul_wilson2]

The lens is actually a 45/4 and the panoramic frame size is 24x65mm.

So, this should give a very similar perspective to cropping a 6x7 shot

taken with either a Pentax 67 with 45mm lens or a Mamiya 7 with 43mm

lens(or using the 35mm adaptor for the Mamiya). To figure out a 35mm

lens equivalent to a 6x7, multiply by .5(roughly) but the Xpan will be

different.

 

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As Bob says, the advantage is the size. The Xpan is certainly smaller

than the Pentax. I don't know if it's usefully smaller than the

Mamiya though.

 

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To me the Xpan seems like an ideal travel camera. You can take

regular 35mm shots all day long and quickly switch to a real panoramic

mode(none of the masking and cropping BS). Plus, lets face it,

dealing with 35mm film on a trip is a lot easier than 120.

 

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There's also the possible advantage(depending on need) of more films

being available in 135.

[jack_chase]

Add to all that; you can't beat Fuji lenses! (Fuji makes the camera

for Hasselblad).

[jim_chow]

I've seen the Fuji version. It looks almost exactly like a Contax G2

(same knobs, same location), but wider. There's also about a big

differential in price between the titanium Fuji offering and

Hasselblad model, at least in Tokyo (the fuji body sells for about

130K yen). True, 35mm film is easier to work with when travelling

(easier to buy, if you use Super G), but either way, how many gift

shops sell velvia?

[andrew l. booth]

The Hasselblad/Fuji is an interesting beast, but I think it has

limited application. Having got a roll of mixed panoramic/non

panoramic shots where will you get them developed/printed (or contact

sheets)? The 35mm convenience doesn't extend to using a high street

lab - since they'll probably make a mess of cutting your film into

strips.

 

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Once developed, where will you get printing/scanning done? Are the

printing masks available? Are there masks available for PhotoCD

scanning?

 

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In one of the reviews of this camera (British Journal of Photography I

think) the reviewer compared the X-pan to a Pentax 67, and came up

with the interesting point that cropping from 6x7 gives you a limited

shift capability (which made a useful difference in the architectural

examples they printed).

 

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Having said this, it's a great concept. I may be sent to Japan early

next year - and I may come back with a Fuji!

[peter_olsson]

Andre, to compare the width and focal lengths between different image

formats is easy. For instance, Xpan gives a panoramic 65 mm long.

The lens is 45 mm. Divide focal length/image width, 45/65 = 0,69231

Then, to compare with another image width, say 55 mm (as in 645 medium

format), multiply new image width, 55*0,69231 = 38 mm.

 

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But, with 645 your image height, given the same proportions as for

Xpan (65 mm long, 24 mm high), will only be 20,3 mm.

 

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The Xpan seems like a nice concept. For slide viewing, I imagine it

would be possible to use a 6x6 slide projector, if special slide

frames were developed. The image circle of the lens for a 6x6

slide-projector would cover more with a panoramic format, than what

is usable for 6x6 viewing. So a slide mount with thin borders

on the left and right side, but thick on the top and bottom should

work. Perhaps a mount like this is bound to be available on the

market, now when Xpan is out?

[mommy___2]

I thought that I may add that there are certain emulsions that are

only available in the 35mm format.

[andre_hassid]

I suspect that since Fuji builds the camera, that they will distribute whatever mask is necessary to get widespread availability of labs that process this dual format film properly.

 

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Does anyone know if Fuji builds the lenses as well as the body for Hassleblad?

 

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I wonder if Fuji will be imported into the US by Fuji. If not, will B&H and others make it available as a grey market item?

[niloy_hil]

It would be a perfect camera for me if it also comes with a 135mm

or 150mm lens, particularly the 150mm. Maybe it's just a matter of

time if the finder/body is ready for it.

 

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For the concerns on the panoramic slide mounts, Wess Plastics supplies

two sizes: 7cmx7cm with ~23.6 mm x 54mm opening, and 8.5cm x 8.5cm

with ~22.3mm x 67mm opening. You can choose AN glass or glassless, you

can also choose pin registered, peg registered, and regular type.

 

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The problems would be more on the projector. 6x6 Projectors for 24mm x

54mm aren't difficult to find, but a good 6x7 for 24mmx65mm, would be

tough to find.

 

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Don't know if the 35mm slide scanner and the Fuji's 1-hour lab would

give this format support as good as the regular 24mm x 36mm format, or

at least close to that. It might make big difference.

[raymond_tai]

I played with this camera at my local dealer several weeks ago. It is a well made solid camera and I will buy one eventually because I am a sucker for rangefinders. I already have the Mamiya 7 so it would make more sense, if I only care about 35mm panorama, to get the adapter. However the Hassy/Fuji has the advantage of midroll switching from either standard/panorama format. In effect, with only one lens on the camera, you can change the angle of view by changing modes. I would say this is primarily a 35mm camera with panoramic capabilities and not the other way around, and IMHO you are correct in implying a longer strip of 35mm film does not make it MF.

 

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As an aside, in its press release/advertisement, Hasselblad claimed that even though the Xpan is made by Fuji (in Japan), quality control is done by Hasselblad, so now we can all rest easier. As someone who uses Fuji, Hasselblad (500C/M), and Mamiya, I find this statement laughable and insulting to the Japanese photographic industry.

[peter_olsson]

Rai, where did you find this slanting of Japanese camera manufacturers

you are talking about? I have read both press-releases at the HB

homepage and found nothing degrading about Japanese camera manufact.

Not at all. On the contrary, HB is speaking very highly of Fuji.

 

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Selected quotes from HB:s press release:

 

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The Hasselblad XPan is a new 35 mm film based

dual-format camera concept that has been

developed and produced by Hasselblad in close

co-operation with Fuji Photo Film Co. Ltd.

Through this successful co-operation

Hasselblad can offer its customers a

technically advanced camera which provides all

the convenience and advantages of the 35 mm

format, but with the additional option to

rapidly switch to a full panorama format

without changing film.

 

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Hasselblad considers its successful history of

OEM co-operation as a very beneficial business

development from many aspects, and carefully

selected partners in the high quality field

include Zeiss, Rodenstock and Schneider to

mention but a few. For the Hasselblad XPan

camera project, Fuji Photo Film Co. Ltd. has

proven to be the ideal partner.

 

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The research and development co-operation

between Hasselblad and Fuji Photo Film Co.

Ltd. is a long term project relating to 35 mm

film based dual-format cameras for

professional and discerning amateur

photographers.

[raymond_tai]

Peter, I actually don't remember where I read that but a fellow

photographer friend and I were laughing and joking over it. I may

have read it in the latest Practical Photography (10/98) review of the

Xpan. Anyway, in all fairness to Hasselblad, most 35mm photographers

out there (target group for the Xpan, I believe) have never heard of

nor experience Fuji MF quality and optics. For marketing purposes

Hasselblad is right to stress their heritage of quality to potential

buyers. I suppose Hasselblad is taking a huge chance with this

product and if status sells I hope it sell well with the Xpan.

Regards, ray.

[peter_olsson]

Rai, you were right! I found this on Hasselblad-USA:

 

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"The Hasselblad XPan is a new camera model developed by Hasselblad in

cooperation with Fuji Photo Film Co. Ltd...

...The Hasselblad name ensures the superb quality throughout for this

innovative new model in an expanding branch of the Hasselblad system."

 

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This makes one wonder what they mean... But it is in this case the

distributors formulation, not the manufacturer (Hasselblad). So,

Rai, sorry for doubting you.

 

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Sorre Andre for getting off the subject. I also think this camera is

for 35 mm shooters who doesn't want to crop to 15x36 mm on panoramics.

A medium format camera will produce better results in "normal mode".

I would like to have one anyway for travel, as all the people above.

 

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Regards

35-mm users who wants to get

[p_ll_stef_nsson]

I bought the xpan three weeks ago. As

a traveling 35mm camera. I have

Leica, bouth the M6 and R6.2 and

bouth Linhof 612PCII and Fuji GX617.

Perfect cameras but.....when you are

doing travelling stoeies in cities, you

need a handheld camera for candid

shots. It+s good camera for that. The

only problem with this camera is who

stupid I am. When I put the first film

in and the camera was on P....I saw i

had only 21 frames. Wrong DX on my

Velvia. Put another film in same

problem. I lookeed very strange and

said to my wife i got a new camera

with failure. She looked one moment

put the knob from P to normal and

suddenly I had 36 frames.

[martin_davidson]

The other advantage the X-Pan has over MF cropped, is much closer

focusing. Cant wait to see one.

[andrew_padey]

If you want to see some of my xpan photos, check out this thread

 

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=000aGD