roger_hicks1 Posted January 16, 2005 Author Share Posted January 16, 2005 Dear Tom, I'm not so much worried by what he says as intrigued as to the reasons behind why he says what he does. The same applies to many others on the forum, not excluding myself, hence the present thread. But I fully take your point. Cheers, Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricM Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 "You are like a piece of choclate cake with a curry sauce on top." too funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_beckmann Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 Japanese cameras are overpriced. There are some Chinese manufacturers, that will sell you a camera with lens, shutter and everything for like 2 bucks. Of course you need to buy a substantial number of these to qualify for the price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spearhead Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 So is the real purpose of this thread to discuss Scott? If you don't like him or his posts, isn't that a waste of time? Music and Portraits Blog: Life in Portugal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icuneko Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Regardless of equipment, the Kid's Pool photo is one of the most delightful I've seen herein in some time (except for Reina's usual charmers). No special "glow" or creamy bokeh or blah-blah-blah technical this or that. Just one finely captured image of a child's innocent glee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frederick_muller Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Consider the following: rather than rent a leica camera or lens, go buy one used, use it for as long as you like (use, not abuse),and when you get tired of it, sell it. You will likely lose the bid-offer, or the dealer's 10 - 15 pct commission, which you can look at as the cost of rental. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger_hicks1 Posted January 17, 2005 Author Share Posted January 17, 2005 Dear Frederic, Keep it for more than a year or two and you may well sell it at a profit, possibly even an inflation-adjusted profit. Try that with almost anything else! Cheers, Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vic_. Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 An old Leica quote: ".... It's not about the Benjamins ...." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
les_lammers Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 The reason these keyboard discussions get out of hand is the impersonal nature of the net. It happens on every forum regardless of the forums primary topic. I think it can be worse in photography because there is a lot of ego invloved. I don't know Scott, but his posts always seem to lead to the conclusion that 'it's my way or the highway'. I just do not read them anymore. Works for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger_hicks1 Posted January 17, 2005 Author Share Posted January 17, 2005 Dear Les, I envy you your powers of concentration. I'll read the label on a sauce bottle if there's nothing else available. You point is well made, though, for them as has the willpower. Cheers, Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
les_lammers Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 *One of my biggest joys is listening to Leica photographers, like above, convince themselves that photography is only about small format, grainy, B/W photography and darkroom work is only about making B/W prints, then convincing themselves that other people care. I then realize that photography consists of more than 35mm small roll B/W work shot with absurdly over rated German lenses, and why the better photographers don't associate with that club.* Scott's original reply/post. I believe that most of the powerful images that we are familiar with were taken with small format cameras. Just leave the country of origin of the camera to the imagination. There have been many posts here by users of larger format systems inquiring about M's for their personal work. 35mm/Leica/M is not the be all end all but is sure is easy to take a small camera with you and is preferable to having no camera. Hi Roger, There is just no logic to Scott's post. I have never seen a statement here that would have promulgated Scott's conclusion. Les the Mess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mskovacs Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Some of us are just plain sentimental to our roots, 50% in my case. There's something proud that I feel when I handle my old German cameras knowing that its not a product built to a price. My Oma *insisted* that I learn this and I've never forgetten it. <p><b>Das Lied der Deutschen</b> - as sung post-WWII <p><i>Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit<br> für das deutsche Vaterland!<br> Danach lasst uns alle streben<br> Brüderlich mit Herz und Hand!<br> Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit<br> Sind des Glückes Unterpfand;<br> Blüh' im Glanze dieses Glückes,<br> Blühe, deutsches Vaterland.</i> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icuneko Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 <Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit für das deutsche Vaterland! Danach lasst uns alle streben Brüderlich mit Herz und Hand! Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit Sind des Glückes Unterpfand; Blüh' im Glanze dieses Glückes, Blühe, deutsches Vaterland.> This surely ain't English English... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keith_laban Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 <a href="http://www.keithlaban.co.uk">Keith Laban Photography</a><p>It's no good, I've just got to say it, I like Scott Eaton. I agree with most of what he has to say and I'm often amused by the way he says it. Wish there were a few more like him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
les_lammers Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Hi Roger, I went back and read it. As I said B4, I don't know Scott and he is entitled to his opinion. What I don't understand is that if he does not like Leicas, why does he post here? Les Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaius1 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 " market is a market, whether it is in commodities, people, carpets, camels, derivatives, or cameras." But there are TWO Leica markets. One is made up of photographers who would like the equipment to be as cheap as possible without compromising quality. The other is made up of collectors who prefer higher prices; the more difficult it is to own something, the more pleasure they derive from owning it. Leica is a corporation, and knows that it can spend $5 extra on a different kind of leather or some engraving, make only 1000 units and charge $500 extra for a "limited edition". Quite rightly, from a corporate point of view, it it more interested in selling objets d'art to collectors than tools to workmen. THAT is what is meant by Leica is overpriced; they could not charge anywhere near the prices they do if they just sold into the first market. Similarly, if Nike sold only to runners they couldn't charge what they charge, but trendy kids want to be seen in the latest trainers, Nike uses artificial scarcity to drive up the price, I wouldn't be surprised if the number of Nike customers who actually wore the gear in the gym or on the track is only a small minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob haight Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Who really cares what Scott Eaton says or thinks. Certainly, with your expertise, Roger, you can determine cost/value of German gear without his input. One reason German gear tends to cost more is economies of scale, smaller numbers of units leads to higher production cost per unit. Period. If you like the quality and want to use the gear, you have to contribute to Zeiss's or Leica's overhead. Its just that simple. So the reality is the price doesn't just reflect quality but also total production cost. Now, I have got to go and shoot some grainy BW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 I have always thought of Scott as a fun character. He comes along every so often to berate the wicked Leica owners and stick he tongue out. Everyone then gives chase and have a fun time. Claude, Eric, neither of you would suit a cauliflower ear........so watch it ;) Are German lens better? To those who think they are, yes. Are they overpriced? To those who think they are, yes. Does it really matter, no. Pay your money take your choice. Gear is the least thing in life to get worked up about. There, there's a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_perlis Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 "Agreement and right and liberty for the German native country! Afterwards let us all strive fraternal with heart and hand! Agreement and right and liberty are the luck pledge; Flower in the gloss of this luck, flower, German native country." It would seem machine translation isn't quite there yet. That "Afterwards ..." is a little ominous tho'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mskovacs Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Unity and right and freedom<br> For the German Fatherland;<br> Let us all strive to this goal<br> Brotherly, with heart and hand.<br> Unity and rights and freedom<br> Are the pledge of fortune grand.<br> Prosper in this fortune's glory,<br> Prosper German fatherland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_beckmann Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 OK, this is heavily off-topic. As an exercise, here is a human translation (mine) of the German national anthem. The biggest difficulty IMHO is in the word "Unterpfand" which is not in use by a single person who speaks German. Unity, justice and freedom for the German fatherland. Let us all strive for that as brothers with our hearts and hands. Unity, justice and freedom do bestow happiness. Do blossom in the shine of this happiness. Do blossom German fatherland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricM Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 c'mon Hebert, that was funny... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger_hicks1 Posted January 18, 2005 Author Share Posted January 18, 2005 Dear James, On second thoughts: "Look it up" "Try and do better" What are you: a failed primary school teacher? You have the honour, etc. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dennis_couvillion Posted January 18, 2005 Share Posted January 18, 2005 I'm thinking about buying a new Leica MP with a 35mm f1.4 Summilux ASPH lens. (I want to pay full retail price, too.) Should I get silver or black? ;>) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger_hicks1 Posted January 18, 2005 Author Share Posted January 18, 2005 Dear Dennis, Both, of course. Surely you won't stint over details like that? Cheers, Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now