addaon stanford Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 I've decided to get a mirror lens in the 400-600mm range. Why? (A) I'm a poor student. (B) I intend to use it for paragliding photos, which are categorically in bright sunlight, and with a usually with a uniform background. © It needs to pack into my own harness when I fly, so weight is an issue. (D) Did I mention I'm poor? My camera is currently a Rebel GII (did I mention I'm poor?), and I seem to recall reading somewhere that the lower-end eos cameras don't deal gracefully with lenses that don't report an f-stop to the electronics. Is this true? Can it be worked around? If so, what lens do I want? I'm looking at the $500 and under range. The sigma 600mm seems ideal, in that it's available with an EOS mount for $400 and it seems acceptable for a mirror lens... is there anyone else I should be looking at? (First person who recommends a $2000 zeiss lens gets ignored. First person who suggests a $3000 refractive lens gets reminded I'm poor.) Thanks for the advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yakim_peled1 Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 No. Mirror lenses are no good. Have you considered the 500/4 IS or 600/4 IS ? :-)) Happy shooting , Yakim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shachar_weis Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 Yakim is right, mirror lens are bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rover Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 Good or bad, I have a feeling you are poor. This article recently in Pop Photo may help. http://www.popphoto.com/article.asp?section_id=2&article_id=687 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shachar_weis Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 I've heard the 1200mm USM is very nice.110,000$ though is a little steep. Maybe they have a group discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_smith2 Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 If I am reading your question correctly you intend to use the mirror lens when airborne? ifso camera shake problems will be horrendous! Or do you just want to carry it whilst airborne? Cat. mirror lenses are relatively tricky to focus accurately because they have a low fixed F stop of F5.6 or F8 and produce dark viewfinder images, following flying paraglider action from the ground may be frustrating. They also have a shallow depth of field. Airborne work would be nigh on impossible I would have thought. Another drawback is that they produce highlight reflections as "donuts" which can make or break pictures depending on your taste or point of view. I used to use a Tamron 500 miror with Pentax equipment with reasonable results, but nothing I would call stunning, you should be able to pick one up secondhand relatively cheaply. But it would require a T mount and therefore may not couple to your metering system. You probably need to take your body to a camera shop and decide from there on what is best for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy10 Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 I guess you are looking at some budger lenses for occassional use.. Whether you are poor or not, some of us do use some of the mirror lenses for occassional use.. For instance I use a 1000mm f/10 lens but just once in a while.. and I couldn't justify buying a canon L lens... I am using a Rubinar 1000 f/10 lens which is fairly light for a 1000mm focal length lens.. You can get some more information about these lenses at www.rugift.com which list some of these lenses along with a host of others (500f/8 and zenitar fish eye).. Only catch is that you need an adapter for your camera body and you will be restricted to MF with stop down metering.. hope that helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karol_s Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 "Poor", yet able to go flying? Seems odd, don't you think? Just kidding; I am dirt poor yet often find myself taking aerial pics while flying around in a $1,000,000 private jet helicopter. :-)<p>Did I mention <b>:-)</b> ?<p>Although much shorter in focal length than what you are looking for, I recommend a Canon EF 28-135 IS lens, ISO 400, shutter 1/250 or faster, let the aperture fall where it will. It is the only lens I bother with while flying, as the Image Stabilizer controls the helicopter vibrations as well as the movement from wind gusts as I hold my camera out an open window.<p>On my 10D, the 28-135 is effectively about 45mm-216mm, but even then, I only seem to use the wide end of the lens anyway. Since you will be catching the full effect of the winds out in the open, it seems like a long focal length lens would be impossible to hold steady enough to get a shake-free shot.<p>If you are set on getting a mirror lens, check out Bob Atkins' article: <a href="http://www.photo.net/learn/optics/mirrors/">Mirror, Mirror</a> here on photo.net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addaon stanford Posted January 22, 2004 Author Share Posted January 22, 2004 Okay, I'll take the feedback given. For those who have expressed confusion over usage: I'll be using this on the ground, tripod mounted, shooting primarily pilots in the middle distance (so DOF shouldn't be too shallow) in formation (so an individual pilot need not fill the frame). Then I'll pack up everything into those little bags we carry and fly down... shooting from the air is strictly P&S, normally, although I may try the tiny little 50/1.8 II eventually. Am I incorrect that, with a relatively far focus point and a mostly solid (blue) background, the bokeh problem should just not be an issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addaon stanford Posted January 22, 2004 Author Share Posted January 22, 2004 Just to be a bit more concrete, my alternative is to use a 135mm with 2x teleconverter, and crop heavily. Does anyone think this will actually produce better results? And, again, can anyone confirm that I can/cannot use a mirror lens with this camera at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark u Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 I think that you'll be able to cope with manual focus just by setting it for subject distance without even looking through the viewfinder - though the view finder may help to confirm. I also think you're right that you won't get distraction from donuts shooting against a clear blue sky. Moreover, you'll soon learn the optimal shutter speeds for for front and sidelit subjects - working from the sunny 16 rule (1/ISO at f/16 in sunlight= 1/4xISO at f/8) and adding a stop for sidelight, 2 for backlight is probably good enough. Your problem may be that you don't have much leeway in ISO/shutter speed combinations given that you should be shooting at 1/750th or faster. Make sure you have a good stable tripod and a remote release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron c sunshine coast,qld,a Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 Ignor the naysayers,they jusy want you to spend 1000's.The sigma mirror you are talking about is at least a reasonably good one.And the situation you are using it in is about as good as you can get for sidestepping any problems inherent with mirror lenses.<BR>As for any metering problems-only certain eos bodies tend to get exposure mixed up with manual lenses-the elan 7 and eos 5 for example.I've never had a problem with any rebels,in fact they have tended to be the most consistant with a whole array of non eos lenses i've used Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addaon stanford Posted January 23, 2004 Author Share Posted January 23, 2004 Ron, just to clarify, since this little bit makes me a tad nervous. Does the sigma mirror lens report itself to the body as an F8, or does it not report itself to the body at all? If the latter, how does the body deal with that? Will it just let me take pictures even though it's confused? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george_roddy Posted January 23, 2004 Share Posted January 23, 2004 The Sigma works great on my Elan7 in AV or P modes. The view finder reads 00 for aperture, but the body set the shutter perfect everytime. I would take your body to a camera shop and try it on the lens before buying. BTW I got my lens on eBay for $150 about a year ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photographicsafaris Posted January 29, 2004 Share Posted January 29, 2004 Just used Fiancee's Eos Rebel with a silde copier and no f electronics. It works fine, as long as you remember to put it on Manual focus and not in the Auto [] mode, rather use manual and then control the shutter only. Cheers G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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