metering

[pak_estan]

i am new to photography and would like to know the importance of spot

metering. my primary and foremost interest is nature--capturing

images of landscapes, wildlife, etc.

 

the reason i am asking this question is because i am trying to choose

between the canon elan 7 and the nikon n80. the former has partial

metering while the latter one possesses spot metering.

 

thanks for the help.

[jason_elsworth3]

I find spot metering very usefull for landscape photography with slide film, especially when the scene you are photographing has an exposure range that exceeds the films lattitude, effectively around four stops(this is often the case for interseting landscape light). With a spot meter you can quiclkly determine if this is a case. Spot metering is also very usefull when using graduated neutral density filters to deal with the previously described situtaion.

 

Using a spot meter you can make a creative decesion about what exposure to use and the spot meter will tell you the outcome of this decesion e.g. what tone different areas of your composition will appear on the slide and if any of those areas will excceed the films latitude e.g be completely black or completely burnt out. Spot metering is usefull in nature photography when photographing bright white e.g gulls or very dark e.g bison type subjects when evaluative metering is fooled.

 

I would not buy a camera for landscape photography without spot/partial metering metering, but that might just be the way I work. You will probably be fine with partial metering.

 

I wouldn't make my choice between the two systems based on it. I am a Nikon shooter, but I would go for Canon unless you need access to Nikons manual range of lens for an affordable big telephoto, or 200mm macro option option etc. Of course the N80 doesn't work with Nikons old style manual focus lenses hmmmmm. If I was going into the Nikon system for landscape/nature and didn't need autofocus then I would get a secondhand 8008s or F4. If I needed and could afford autofocus lenses(essentially only usefull for birds in flight and moving birds/animals taken with big teles) then I would buy Canon.

[ac_gordon]

The Elan 7's partial metering covers about 10% of the viewfinder area. I have become accustomed to using this partial meter well enough that I don't really miss (well, sometimes I do) the spot metering I had with my camera prior camera bodies. The partial meter is definitely not as user friendly as a true spot meter, and I can see folks who really like/need a spot meter going bonkers with a 10% partial meter. However, I would not choose a camera system (Nikon v. Canon v. any other brand) based solely on whether a particular body has a spot meter.<p>

Like Jason says, you may want to consider the lenses you think you may need and what other subjects you may want to shoot to see which system would better suit you. For most photogs I know, and for me, the investment in lenses, tripods, flashes, and other accessories is far, far greater than the investment in a camera body alone. Both Nikon and Canon make bodies with spot meters, but the feel of the bodies in your hands may be very different. Also, Nikon does not make inexpensive lenses with ultrasonic motors, Canon does not have "D"-type flash, Nikon has only one lens with an image stabilizer, Canon EOS bodies are incompatible with manual focus FD lenses . . . I could keep going on the differences in the systems. Neither system is better than the other in every way for every person, you just need to figure out which system will serve as a better tool for you.

[todd_caudle]

Pak,

 

Since you're obviously new to the world of spot metering, here's a quiz for you (and others on this forum) that will help you with all your metering situations, esp. spot. Several years ago I bought a spot meter and decided to use it to photograph a concert. My thought was, with the spot meter I can take a reading right on the performer's nose, thereby leading to a perfect exposure under difficult lighting conditions. I took a reading, it was (for argument's sake) 1/250th @ f5.6. PERFECT!, I thought, and snapped the shutter. But when I got the film back, the images were about 1 f-stop under-exposed. Why? (I'll give you a hint: The performer was Kenny G) First one with the correct answer gets a gold star.

[alfred_matzer]

I would very much like a gold star...<br>

Could it be because Kenny G's nose was not 18% gray?<p>estan; I am not new to photography but I am new to trying my hand at nature photography. Unfortunately for me, I cannot afford either of the Nikon or Canon products at this time but would like to invest in them in the future. I would advise that you travel to the store and handle both cameras and base your decision on that --- both models have a list of impressive capabilities and both have a wide variety of lenses availible. I have fiddled with both and prefer the Elan 7 to the N 80 -- you may feel differently. In my opinion, partial/spot metering isn't the most important issue.

[todd_caudle]

Alfred, the gold star is yours. Figuratively speaking, of course. . .

[steve_thompson]

This question has started a good discussion. For me I would not consider a body without a spot meter. It is very important to remember any reflected light meter does not tell you what the proper exposure is, it will tell you how to make what ever you meter middle toned or 18%. For any reflected light meter it is up to us to take he sugggested reading and interpret that reading to get a good exposure. That involves our estimation of the tone of what we read with the meter. Then we have to compensate by adding light to lighter subjects and taking away for darker than middle toned subjects. It sounds hard but once you learn which direction and how much for each type of subject it is almost automatic. That is the one of the arts to photography. More important it makes you think, see, and plan. All these make you a better phototgrapher.

[dr._steven_bein]

An alternative , if buying a used camera body, is the Nikon N70, which can meter both with AF and manual focus lenses. They are not being made presently, but are fine. The only downside in comparing is that they have only one sensor rahter than the 5 points of the N80. I donot shoot Canon,though Canon is excellent also.

[andrey_mikhaylov]

If you are really interested in wildlife, I would not recommend you choosing the camera system (Canon vs. Nikon vs. others) on the basis of camera alone. <p>

I would even consider the lenses first. For me the telephoto lens you can afford for the given camera is the most important factor, and I would probably even buy it first (I still have no 50 mm lens for my EOS 50E bought in 1997). I would consider mostly 300 or 400 mm primes for the beginner stage in wildlife photography. Find a place where you can try a camera with the 300/400 mm prime both handhold and on a tripod, and to see how the camera's features work with it. The lens for the wildlife is typically much more expensive than the camera body (and/or hard to find if you opt for an older model). <p>

As pointed in previous posts, there are many differences between the systems about focusing, old lens compatibility, flash, macro features etc. It can be wise to study the complete systems before making the definitive choice.<p>

There is a lot of information on specific lenses etc. on this forum, on <a href="http://bobatkins.com">bobatkins.com</a> and elsewhere.<p>

 

<p>For landscapes, consider also a more wideangle choice than a normally bundled "standard lens", e.g. a 28 or 24 prime or a 24-80 mm

or alike. Do not forget to check the lens for distorsion (the straight lines near the edges of the frame should not appear curved) and vignetting (darkening in the corners of the picture).

[christian deichert]

RE: nose metering.<p>

 

Todd: now you know why Caucasian skin is normally placed in Zone VI, not Zone V (18% gray).<p>

 

"Pak:" Spot metering can really make a diference in landscape photography as long as you know how to spot meter -- Todd's Kenny G story highlights (pun intended) the importance of knowing what to do with the results of spot metering. Partial metering will only give you the same results as spot metering if it's a really big spot: partial meters a 10-degree area, spot metering (usually) a 1-degree area.<p>

 

Of course, if the price difference still makes you lean towards the Canon, get a handheld spot meter. Minolta makes a great one, the Spotmeter F, for I believe under $400.

[todd_caudle]

Yes, my Kenny G Experience (sorta like the Jimi Hendrix Experience, only crappy) was one of those AHA! moments for me. I had been shooting for several years, but hadn't been able to wrap my brain around the Zone System. In an instant I understood.

[todd_caudle]

Oh yes, and I should mention that if Pak is having trouble understanding what Christian and I and others are talking about, don't be shy. Ask, ask, ask!

[woodsman]

Pak, go with the Canon you won't be sorry. It's the guy behind the viewfinder more than the equipment anyway.

Todd"That's what you get for going to a "G" concert anyway. Garth Rulz

[ellis_vener_photography]

Way way off topic but has anyone else here heard the great

songwriter /guitarist Richard Thompson's recent song "I Agree

with Pat Metheny"?:<P>

 

<B>I Agree With Pat Metheny </B>--

© Richard Thompson<P>

<P><I>

" I agree with Pat Metheny<P>

Kenny's talents are too teeny.<P>

He deserves the crap he's going to get<P>

He overdubbed himself on Louis<P>

What a musical chop suey<P>

Raised his head above the parapet<P>

<P>

Well Louis Armstrong was the king<P>

He practically invented swing<P>

Hero of the twentieth century<P>

He did duets with many a fella<P>

"Fatha" Hines, Big Hoagy, Ella<P>

Strange he never thought of Kenny G<P>

<P>

A meeting of great minds, how nice<P>

Like Einstein and Sporty Spice<P>

Digitally fused in an abortion<P>

Kenny fans will doubtless rave<P>

While Satchmo turns inside his grave<P>

Soprano man's bit off more than his portion<P>

<P>

Oh brainless pentatonic riffs<P>

Display our Kenny's arcane gifts<P>

But we don't care, his charms are so beguiling<P>

He does play sharp, but let's be fair<P>

He has such lovely crinkly hair<P>

We hardly notice, we're too busy smiling<P>

<P>

How does he hold those notes so long?<P>

He must be a genius. Wrong!<P>

He just has the mindlessness to do it<P>

He makes Britney sound like scat<P>

If this is jazz I'll eat my hat<P>

An idle threat, I'll never have to chew it<P>

<P>

So next time you're in a rendezvous<P>

And Kenny's sound comes wafting through<P>

Don't just wince, eliminate the cause<P>

Rip the tape right off the muzak<P>

Pull the plug, or steal a fuse, Jack<P>

The whole room will drown you in applause<P>

<P>

Yes, Kenny G has gone too far<P>

The gloves are off, it's time to spar<P>

Grab your hunting rifle, strap your Colt on<P>

It's open season on our Ken<P>

But I await the moment when<P>

We lay off him and start on Michael Bolton<P>

<P>

I agree with Pat Metheny<P>

Kenny's talents are too teeny."</I>