Subway Officials Seek Ban on Picture-Taking

<img

src="http://graphics7.nytimes.com/images/2004/05/21/nyregion/21SUBWAY.

xl.jpg"><br><i>Philippe Sabathe, a tourist from Paris, taking

pictures yesterday, something that, in a year's time, might be

forbidden in New York's underground</i>

<P>

By ROBERT D. McFADDEN

Published: May 21, 2004

<P>

Citing the security of 7 million daily riders, 48,000 employees and

its transportation network, New York City Transit yesterday proposed

a ban on unauthorized photography, filming and videotaping on city

subways, buses and Staten Island Railway trains. The press and

businesses or individuals with permits would be exempt.

<P>

Transit officials also proposed a tougher rule against turnstile

jumping, banning it even if a miscreant has a fare card and acts out

of frustration when the card or a turnstile malfunctions, and they

suggested new rules against walking between subway cars, putting feet

on seats and misusing student or senior reduced-fare cards.

<P>

If approved by New York City Transit's parent, the Metropolitan

Transportation Authority, next fall after a public-comment period,

the changes would become the system's first new rules of conduct in a

decade, joining prohibitions against graffiti, littering, spitting,

smoking, panhandling, loud radio playing, drinking alcoholic

beverages and going onto subway tracks or into tunnels or other

unauthorized areas.

<P>

"The world we live in has changed dramatically since 1994, so has our

operating environment," said Lawrence G. Reuter, president of New

York City Transit. "These changes to our rules of conduct are

intended to enhance security and safety, not only for our customers

but our employees as well."

<P>

The proposed ban on photography, filming and videotaping drew

immediate objections from the New York Public Interest Research Group

Straphangers Campaign. "We think it's a mistake to turn the subways

into a scary underground where you can't take pictures," said Gene

Russianoff, a staff lawyer. "We respect the need for security in the

transit system but believe that there are important values in having

photographers document life and conditions on the subways and buses."

<P>

He noted that the M.T.A. was sponsoring an exhibition at Grand

Central Terminal of photos taken over decades of life in the subways.

<P>

Mr. Russianoff said the proposed ban on picture-taking could raise

First Amendment issues as well. While members of the press with

identity cards issued by the police would be exempt, other people and

businesses would need written permission. "No standards are detailed

in the proposed rules for issuing such authorizations," he said.

<P>

But Charles F. Seaton, a spokesman for New York City Transit, brushed

aside such objections. He said any person or commercial enterprise

with legitimate needs, including film and television producers,

advertisers, artists and others, "would all be allowed" to take

pictures as long as they obtained written permission in advance.

<P>

While transit officers would make common-sense judgments about

issuing summonses to tourists who take pictures without knowing the

rules, even visitors would be subject to fines, Mr. Seaton said,

although there is no provision for confiscation of cameras. He said

taking a picture or filming without authorization would be subject to

a relatively low $25 fine.

<P>

Spitting, smoking and littering carry a $50 fine, he said, while

vandalism and other more serious offenses are subject to penalties of

$100 or more.

<P>

The rules of conduct on the transit system are as old as the subways,

which mark their centennial this year. Officials acknowledge that

enforcement has always been something of a problem, with a few

thousand officers responsible for 468 stations, 660 miles of track

and a vast network of bus routes. The use of cellphone and other

miniature cameras may also complicate enforcement of a photography

ban.

<P>

But Mr. Seaton noted that this would not be the first ban on filming

and picture-taking in the city subways. One was imposed in the early

1930's, he said, for reasons that are no longer clear, and was in

force until 1994, when transit officials decided to relax it after

embarrassing news reports that a woman had been given a summons for

taking a picture on a subway in the Bronx.

<P>

Since the terrorist attacks of 9/11 and the bombing that killed

hundreds on a commuter train in Madrid earlier this year, tighter

security has been a high priority, Mr. Seaton said. The other

proposed rule changes are also needed, he said.

<P>

After the proposed rules are published in the New York State Register

early next month, a 45-day period of public comment would ensue.

Modifications might then be offered. Finally, New York City Transit

would seek final approval by the board of the M.T.A. The board does

not meet in August, but would probably consider the rules in

September or October.

 

 

ps: the above article is from today's NY Times.

Terrorists are winning.

If this type of thing continues, cameras themselves are going to be thought of as terrorist weapons.

If this type of thing continues, no picture taking will be allowed in airports, stadiums, Disney, etc..., and any one with a camera at public places will have his/her name in the database of the terrist suspects.

Head Terrorist: I want you to go down and take photos of the 42nd Street subway

station--and here's $100.

 

Flunky Terrorist: Boss, I don't need that much money for subway fares.

 

Head Terrorist: The money isn't for subway fares, but you might get a couple of

$25 tickets--and don't lose it all--remember the last time you played 3 Card

Monte!

Unfortunately, there are still a lot of people who haven't yet figured out one simple truth: We can't defend against everything, everywhere, all of the time. There just isn't enough money or manpower. (And that includes all of the money in the Treasury and in the private sector, and all of the people).

 

The best defense, like it or not, is a strong offense.

 

But, at age 60, I doubt that I will see things change before I die. So, I'll go take pictures of flowers, if I must.

Here in Boston, subway photography has apparently already been banned. I haven't seen it

posted anywhere, but I have been repremanded more than once by the MBTA Police. I see

no mention of the rule on their website, with the only result for a search on "photography"

being procedures for commercial movie filming permits.

 

I don't know how long the "rule" has been in effect, but I don't like it at all!

There are other posts in photo.net concerning this issue.<p>

Check out this one in the <i>Street & Documentary</i> forum...<br>

<a href=http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=008JYc>Here</a><p>

 

And this one in the <i>Leica</i> forum...<br>

<a href=

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=008Jg2>Here</a><p>

 

By our giving up on an ever continuing list of small freedoms and liberties, soon we, and our children and grand children, will have none.<br>

The terrorists and their political counterparts, the bureaucrats, will have won and taken over completely.

Fascism. Is this too strong a word? And when should we stop it? ....;)...J

Well...quite a stupid idea, but, maybe, if it goes through that "final approval", the price of Leica and other rf equipment will drop on the used market:o)

<i>Fascism. Is this too strong a word? </i>

<p>

"fascism" has come to mean anything close-minded leftists oppose (it was used endlessly to describe former mayor Rudolph Giuliani). it's shameful, really, because it trivializes all those who suffered under real fascism.<p>

===============================================<p>

Bloomberg Blasts Subway Photo Ban<p>

 

May 22, 2004 6:45 am US/Eastern

(1010 WINS) (NEW YORK) Transit officials' proposed ban on cameras in subways to prevent terrorism was overzealous and would affect mostly tourists, Mayor Michael Bloomberg said.

<p>

"If somebody's there with a high-powered camera at the front of the train trying to photograph switches and signal boxes, maybe there is something going on," Bloomberg said Friday on his weekly radio show.

<p>

"But if there are some tourists and they want to take pictures of each other on the subway train � come on, get real," he said.

<p>

NYC Transit, a division of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority, proposed the ban Thursday to deter terrorists from conducting surveillance of the nation's largest mass transit system.

<p>

The proposal would be subject to amendment following public hearings this summer, transit agency spokeswoman Deirdre Parker said.

<p>

(© MMIV Infinity Broadcasting Corp)

Then I take it your answere is yes it is too strong a word.

 

I take facsim to mean:

 

[n] a political theory advocating an authoritarian hierarchical government (as opposed to democracy or liberalism).

 

This can be seen in the police enforcing a law that does not exist.

 

 

authoritarian:

a] characteristic of an absolute ruler or absolute rule; having absolute sovereignty.

 

2. [a] expecting unquestioning obedience.

 

Some believe this could be the definition of the Federal Government as well. Why does that matter to NY? 911 There is a "war" on you know.

 

....J

 

No, I have never experienced whatever it is you call Facism but the US does seem to be headed in a strange direction.

<i>US does seem to be headed in a strange direction.</i><p>

it is your brain that is headed in a strange direction. the u.s., due to checks and balances, is headed in the same direction it has always headed: more less down the middle of the road (a fact that has been a source of disdain to elitists at least as far back as de Tocqueville). it zigs a little this way or that, but it has never varied as far from the center as most other countries in most other parts of the world.

>>>it is your brain that is headed in a strange direction. <<<

 

hahahahahaha.... Thank you Gaetano. Perhaps your faith in the checks and balances of this great land will make everything A-Ok in the end.

Take care my friend....;)....J

This is a ridiculous proposal. The transit officials will be diligently handing out citations to

artists with Leicas and tourists with point & shoots. Meanwhile, anyone who really wishes

to take surreptitious photos will use simple cellphone cameras or cameras now built into

Palm Pilots without being noticed by anyone. This is a feelgood proposal that provides no

actual security benefits and makes everyone else paranoid. Reuter is an idiot.

There is an interesting article, dated June 4th, which is posted on the Village Voice

website at: http://villagevoice.com/issues/0423/haber.php

 

The article contains interviews with a number of photographers and photobloggers,

with samples of their work and links to their sites.

As bob lazzarini stated, all this crap with new securities (ex. the partriot act) and this, is leading to a downfall of our liberties. I am 16, and i really dislike how everything is being handled. The leaders are imposing things they would have done before, but now they get their support by calling those who oppose them unamerican or unpatriotic. Yes, some of it is necesary. So for you people who can vote, please take into the consideration of younger generations. It will be greatly appreciated.

There is a meeting of the NYC TransitRiders Council on Wednesday April 6 2005 from 5:00 - 7:00 pm where you can voice your opinion. for more information call 212 878 7087...

 

If cannot attend the meeting you can email.... kberger@mtahq.org with the your name, address and comments and ask her to pass your request to the meeting.