Noctilux versions and experiences, new and old

Thinking of getting a noct for my wedding photography, and I'm wondering if anyone has

COMPARATIVE experience with the 3 (or four?) different versions of this lens.

 

<p>I know they are all the same optically, but I'm thinking of lens coatings (better

anti-flaring?), the three different hoods (two different types of snap on, and one built-in),

built quality, and any vignetting OR vignetting with filters differences especially between

the E58 (58mm) and E60 (60mm) versions.

 

<p>I've searched around the LUG and photo.net, and haven't come away with many

opinions, save this one (<a href="http://mejac2.palo-alto.ca.us/leica-users/v22/

msg01759.html">

http://mejac2.palo-alto.ca.us/leica-users/v22/msg01759.html</a> and <a href="http://

www.cameraquest.com/mlenses.htm">Camerquests</a>.

 

<p>Thoughts? It probably makes little difference between all of them.

The 1.0 Noctilux came out in the 1970's; had a 58mm thread; and was about 600 to 850 bucks new; it has the more commonly available 58mm filter size. Optically; I believe it is the same as todays 60mm filter version; same lens design; same coatings. I have never really used the goofy hood much at all. The lens flares little at all; The Leitz coating and design is great. Many sellers sell the Noct after the honeymoon phase; so getting a used lens real easy. Many owners own the lens for only months; instead of years; and dumbly sell their Summicron; and cry over the loss; and complain about the Noct's weight. It is not a replacement for a Summicron. Another goofy thing is that some complain that it only focuses to 1 meter. This maybe a problem for some; but not in my usage at all. The DOF is Nil at 1 meter. Here I consider the Noct to be a 6 or 12 Lb sledge hammer; just a tool for certain odd times; and the F2 Summicron is a 16oz hammer; used alot more. Here I like the low light F1.0 gathering of the Noct in clubs; using asa 800 4 layer print film; and going down to 1/15 second hand held.

I've got the latest version and optically, the only difference is that some, not all, of the elements are multi-coated compared to earlier version where all elements had the standard coatings. I'll keep mine although I suspect you'll see more used ones show up with the introduction of the 50/1.4 ASPH. which may be the best 50 ever.

The Noct is my primary lens (I use it for 90+ percent of all my images), and I've owned and thoroughly used three of f/1.0 version, but not the f/1.2 version. Mine consisted of one of the very earliest of the batch with the E58 front and detachable hoods (serial number dated to 1975, seemingly before they actually were released to retail), one dated from the mid-1990s with the E60 front and built-in hood, and a current production version I picked up late last fall. My findings are as follows:

 

- I prefer the imagery from the latest version the best, as the colors it reproduces on film appear to match reality closest of the bunch (the one from the mid-70s rendered a cool cast to the images, while imagery from the two later models are virtually identical). If you're shooting with mono film, I don't think you'll see a difference between any of them (I certainly couldn't). While there are certainly improvements in the coatings since the lens first came out, I don't think you could go wrong with a used version that dates from the mid to late-80s.

 

- Build quality is the same between all the versions, but the later ones have much improved lubricants. My E58 Noctilux had lubricants that were so stiff I was concerned about wrenching the lens mount out of the camera body, a condition that only got worse in cold weather. I originally sent the lens to Sherry for servicing, but she couldn't fix it after a week of intense effort (neither could Leica in New Jersey), so it eventually went to Solms for three months and came back in perfect condition.

 

- Flare control appears to be the same level among all versions; it's simply fantastic. Once you've used it, you'll not want to ever go back to another lens. I have not been able to see differences between the old and the new with the type of shooting I've done with the lens.

 

- I prefer the detachable hood of the first version the best, but got around that on the later versions by ripping off the built-in hood with a pair of pliers and replacing it with a screw-in metal hood (and, no, I'm not joking). I strongly suggest and promote the use of a rigid hood on the Noct, as it provides protection to the front element that the built-in hood does not.

 

- There is no real difference that I can see to the different front diameters; they all vignette to the same degree when used wide open. I had read sometime ago that Leica decided to enlarge the diameter of the front element to lessen the vignetting, but I sure don't see that on my images.

 

- When using filters with the Noct (polarizer and ND filters only), I use a step-up ring to go from E60 to 62mm. I use this same ring for the screw-in metal hood. Any vignetting that I see appears to be from the lens itself, rather than anything I've put in front of the front element, and that's based on comparative testing.

 

- I've used the Noct and Delta 3200 at one wedding, and the bride and groom liked my available light images better than those from the pro they hired to shoot medium format images with a flash. Indeed, at one time during the festivities, the pro strutted over smirking and asked if I was getting any images at all, noting that I didn't have a strobe; I simply showed him what I was using and said I was shooting between 1/250th and 1/60th. He shuffled off, muttering to himself.

 

There's more to read and see at Andrew Nemeth's Noctilux FAQ website:

http://nemeng.com/leica/040b.shtml

 

Regards,

 

Mitch

Wow! Thanks Mitch.

So, Mitch, after carefully re-reading your post, you never owned the second version (as per

Cameraquest's site), ie. the E60 one with the detachable hood, correct?

Correct.

Mitch,

 

Regarding vignetting with filters: I use B+W MRC UV filters for protection on my lenses, as

I hate lens caps, and I don't use step-up rings. Have you done similar? If so, do either of

the E58 or E60 vignette more with one filter? How about two? Thinking of a UV filter and

an ND filter here.

 

Thanks,

 

Dave

And while we're at it, notice any subtle differences in bokeh between versions? I know

we're in dicey territory here, but what the heck, let's cover all the bases. Even if the bases

are covered with cheese.

The Noctilux 1.0 since the mid 1970's is the same optical design; so the out of focus characteristics are the same; since the lens is the same optical design.

Kelly, Jack Flesher (before he went Canon digital) had something to say about the bokeh

issue here: <a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?

msg_id=003Ucx">link</a>

 

<p>He thought there were subtle differences, even though I have a hard time believing

that it's possible. Just looking for some other opinions on the matter.

I have the current version and am of the opinion that using a B &

W MC UV filter does make the vignetting worse when used at

F1.0 or F1.2 or so. I have taken it off for that reason. I also find

that the vignetting can be worse when using an ND filter in good

lighting situations (but strangely not all situations it seems). I

guess I should methodically test the lens and filters and try to

determine under what situations the vignetting is most apparent

but I am far too lazy to do that.

For others looking for opinions on this matter, I found that fellow forum poster Eliot

has either good info or has commented on interesting threads regarding this

topic.

(<a href="http://www.photo.net/shared/community-member?user_id=501295">link

</a>) Check his postings and search the page for "noctilux."

 

<p>I found the results better than the photo.net google search tool.

David; thanks for the old links on the Noct.

Hey Kelly, no problem. Here are two of interest:

 

<p><a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=002eg8">one,

</a><a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=003lAj"> two

</a>