john_kasaian1 Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 The heat was as relentless as Bookie collecting a bad bet. I blew into town late last night and checked into a cheap motel just outside the main gate of the abandoned Mather Air Force Bace in the "Big Tomato"--Sacramento. Nothing much going on so I checked out Ralph's Market off of Bradshaw Avenue. I should have opted for the Chinese at the little joint at the end of the shopping center, but I'd already chowed down at the "trucker's corral" Buffet at the Flying J in Ripon and needed something to help digest what the guy wearing the Kenworth ball cap and the Oakland Raider's tanktop said were "crab cakes." While looking for the Pepto, I came across the magazine rack and the latest Shutterbug caught my eye and my disposable income. I've had indigestion before and it didn't kill me so what the heck.... Meanwhile, back at the Motel, I wondered about the past, specifically Who had done what to Who on that King size mattress. Its tough being on the road and alone(sigh!) I dragged my imagination out of the gutter and took a gander at the Shutterbug--- especially the article on using coffee and washing soda to develop film. "Hey, this looks pretty interesting!" I said to myself. That was last night, this is tonight...but that coffee developer---I can't get her off my mind, I tell you! She haunts me with her silly promises of squeaky clean coffee prints. Just this morning at Starbucks I fantasized about the possibilities...but what, I ask you, could a pot of "joe" with a washing soda chaser do for my film? What if nothing developed from my little fling with caffiene? Could I ever go back to good old D-76, who has stood by me in thick and thin for all these years, through whatever wild and crazy emulsions I've dragged home from who knows where, without a complaint? Do I leave my beloved D-76 for the stimulating, keep you up all night long promise of Madame Cappuccinno? Or, has anyone here ever tried using coffee to develop film? ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lex_jenkins Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 I once tried a brew of very strong coffee and tea on a junk roll of color film (I think it was 35mm ISO 400 Ferrania disguised as Albertsons house brand). It developed an image. Too dense to be usable. But promising enough to investigate further if someone cared to, at least for true b&w film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 (LOL.) Gotta use de-caf, or your images will be shaky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank lahorgue Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 Well, if you'd rather drink the Starbucks you can soup your film with tea. Detailed instructions appear in the July/August edition of Photovision Magazine in an article by Dr. M. J. Vajed. Me? I'll stick to Zinfandel and Pyro, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_gagnon Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 SOMEBODY has been reading too many of Dagor 77's auction decriptions! [:~) DG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim_galli4 Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 I read the contents of a Mountain Dew can and tried to develop film with that stuff once. I suppose any of the above with a little Hydroquinone and Metol would work just fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thirteenthumbs Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 Do a search in Photo Techniques, the person who got the ball rollin on vitiman C developer also did some work with coffee as a developer. His research indirectly resulted in Xtol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_kasaian1 Posted September 7, 2003 Author Share Posted September 7, 2003 I read about vitamin C being used as a developer at www.unblinkingeye.com and that too is mentioned in the Shutterbug article. I was impressed by the images I saw there(Unblinking Eye), but the author of the Shutterbug article kind of leads me to believe he got better results with coffee. While the author didn't recommend continuous agitation, I might try coffee in the ol' Unidrum just to see what happens as soon as I can get some washing soda. Maybe Mrs. Olsen and Juan Valdez can get gigs on the Freestyle Photo Advisory Panel---mountain grown coffee for mountain landscapes? French Roast for Bergger BPF200? Soup the last of your Agfa APX in Chock Full O Nuts? FWIW, You folks who shoot digital must feel soooo left out, but not to worry---there is an article on what to expect if your flash card goes through the laundry in the same issue. Aye carumba! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lex_jenkins Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 It would be interesting to come up with a functional, reliable developer solely from ingredients available at any grocery store. No metol, no hydroquinone. Caffeine, in whatever form; vitamin C; borax; sodium bicarbonate - reportedly sodium carbonate can be made from it; lye; and possibly other ingredients are readily available. Whether a usable, versatile developer could be brewed up is another matter. Since even I'm not that hard up right now, despite my tight budget, it's unlikely I'll do more than speculate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pascal_miele Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 In "Chimie et physique photographique" P. Glafkidès "Any substance with an oxydo-reduction potential <0.180v had a chance to develop a photographic image. Arribat (Sci et Ind Photog, 1944, 15, p204) tried with succes many products : sugar, leucobasis, hemoglobin, anaerobic bacillus, old burgondy wine with alkali, etc..." In france we are disadvantaged, we must add alkali to our wine to develop, but in USA I'm sure you can develop with your pure american wine ! It's only a joke, in france too we can make bad wine !!! ;-) Pascal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_kasaian1 Posted September 7, 2003 Author Share Posted September 7, 2003 Pascal, Would wine developer be neccesary for a "vintage" photograph? Maybe thats what Atget used. Using vin ordinaire you could say "Its not a vintage negative, but I am amused by It's presumption!" ---Cheers!;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darin_cozine Posted September 8, 2003 Share Posted September 8, 2003 John, sorry to hear you had a bad time in Sacramento. I'm a 30-year native of Sac, and I cant say im to enthusiastic about it. But I suppose it's nicer than other towns. Out of curiosity, what were you doing here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pascal_miele Posted September 8, 2003 Share Posted September 8, 2003 John, For the Atgets dev I don't know if he use wine (I think he used vin ordinaire for him ! ) But for measuring exposure times he use the "cigarette timer": night with many lights: you smoke one cigarette during exposure, low light two cigerettes, etc... With wine and cigarettes he lives from 1857 to 1927, and metol is hazardous ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_kasaian1 Posted September 8, 2003 Author Share Posted September 8, 2003 Darin, It was a brief business trip in "The Big Tomato." I drove up from Baja Stockton(Fresno.) Actually there are some very nice areas in your neck of the woods, but unfortunately I seldom get the time off to go explore---and when I do get to Sac, work keeps me in the less scenic sections of your fair City. BTW, That Chinese place by Ralphs on Bradshaw(S.of U.S.50) really has great kung pao shrimp! I now have two rules for travelling: 1) Don't eat a crabcake served at truck stops, and 2) Never stay at a motel named after an aircraft carrier.(Corollary to Rule #2: If I do stay at a motel named after an aircraft carrier, I'll be sure to have a good photo magazine handy!) For the Moderators information, this actually does have something to do with LF---my Houston-Fearless(!) LF aerial film processor chungs chemicals in multiples of 5 gallons. If I can substitute Folgers or Thunderbird for Dev, it might be both a less costly and enviornmentally friendly alternative (if the results warrant the switch.)-------------Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_kasaian1 Posted September 8, 2003 Author Share Posted September 8, 2003 Pascal, What a great way to time exposures! Not that I'm giving the thumbs up to cigarettes, but thats a really clever system Atget figured out. I wonder if I can extrapolate for glasses of wine? Two glasses of burgundy for night scenes, one for bright sunlight? ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gauthier Posted September 8, 2003 Share Posted September 8, 2003 This is the most complete source I know on coffee developpers, complete with times, films and temperatures. Worth a look, at least as a starting point: <br><br> <a href="http://www.rit.edu/~andpph/text-coffee.html">http://www.rit.edu/~andpph/text-coffee.html</a> <br> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrick_gainer Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 I'm surprised at you guys. Vitamin C is as good as hydroquinone. You will need a tiny amount of metol or phenidone to make a really good developer. The only other ingredient besides water is an alkali, and you can make sodium carbonate from baking soda by heating it or from baking soda and lye by mixing 2.1 parts of baking soda with 1 part of lye in water to get a solution of 3.1 parts of sodium carbonate monohydrate. Or, you can use pHPlus from swimming pool supply places. It will cost you about 25 cents a gallon of working solution. It is a surface developer that gives fine grain and good film speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jorge_gasteazoro4 Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 <i>For the Atgets dev I don't know if he use wine (I think he used vin ordinaire for him ! ) But for measuring exposure times he use the "cigarette timer": night with many lights: you smoke one cigarette during exposure, low light two cigerettes, etc...</i><p> How well would that work with a joint?....:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
struan_gray Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 A lot of organic molecules will develop silver halides, and the early photographic literature is full of oddball recipies and formulea. The real problem with kitchen kemicals is finding a good *fixer*. See "The Killing Fields" for further details. Vit. C works well, but is susceptible to poisoning by high metal content in your water, and is itself easily broken down by heat, light, mechanical agitation or strong acids or bases such as residual stop bath or fixer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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