Pentax Digital Spotmeter - what is so good about it?

Hello photo.net community,

I am looking for an external 1 degree spotmeter. I am considering selling my Sekonic L358 incident light meter and buy brand new Sekonic L758 or L858 which combines both incident and reflect spot meter functions. Yes it is pricy, but one gets brand new state of the art professional product covering almost any photographic situation. Though it looks like there is some sort of cult around Pentax Digital Spotmeter - it sells on eBay for more than three quarters of L758/L858 price sometimes! I am wondering what is so good about Pentax spotmeter? The analogue scale on the lens seems useful indeed, but it is really worth it?

Thanks for your thoughts.

There's a much cheaper copy of the Pentax meter sold under the Elicar name, and others. Its internal baffling is woefully inadequate to keep adjacent areas from affecting what it's meant to be reading. Even after modification, there's still a lot of spill into the supposed spot circle.

 

I've heard the Pentax suffers from much the same affliction, and it's a generic issue with all spotmeters; since making a suitably small and non-reflective sensor box is almost impossible. You also need an auxillary close-up lens for any nearby reading, because the image of the subject needs to be focused onto the sensor to get an accurate reading. Focussing the spotmeter lens itself doesn't work because its effective aperture then changes.

 

In short, I'd really question whether you need a spotmeter at all, since any affordable one almost certainly won't give you accurate shadow readings from a true 1 degree circle. Not unless that 1 degree circle is surrounded by another 10 degree circle of similar brightness.

 

Zone system use perchance?

 

I'd be willing to bet good money that there are hundreds of spotmeters, or spotmeter functions, lying abandoned and unused after a few enthusiastic uses, and after proving to their owners that spotmetering is an almost complete waste of time.

Edited December 31, 2019 by rodeo_joe|1

I'm not up to date about the meters market and haven't handled the Pentax (am also not really familiar with Sekonic). I used to buy Gossens.

There are 2 spot meter usages: You know a (single?) spot you want to meter. Like a musician on stage 's face. Everything metering 1° will do that.

For "scanning" a scene according to the Zone System, you'd better get a spot meter with readout in it's viewfinder. My old Soligor was that way, I suppose Pentax are too. Gossen attachments are not.

I am talking meaningless numbers here usually from zero to 20something, that you'l dial on the scale around the lens later to read out shutterspeeds or apertures for your ISO. I think the interesting or important thing is getting an impression of the world's contast range with meter still at your eye.

 

I don't push the Zone sytem towards ordinary people with one kind of film to be processed one way in their single camera. if you have the backs or film holders to process high and low contrast rolls or sheets differently: Go ahead! <- It might make more sense to get a somewhat enjoyable digital "toy" camera (in terms of portability) and analyze it's histogram instead.

I got a close up lens for my Soligor and at least after sending it in to get it cleaned (it swam in a chocolate milk puddle inside my backpack) the marking for the metering area looked to be a little bit off.

There's a much cheaper copy of the Pentax meter sold under the Elicar name, and others. Its internal baffling is woefully inadequate to keep adjacent areas from affecting what it's meant to be reading. Even after modification, there's still a lot of spill into the supposed spot circle.

 

I've heard the Pentax suffers from much the same affliction, and it's a generic issue with all spotmeters; since making a suitably small and non-reflective sensor box is almost impossible. You also need an auxillary close-up lens for any nearby reading, because the image of the subject needs to be focused onto the sensor to get an accurate reading. Focussing the spotmeter lens itself doesn't work because its effective aperture then changes.

 

In short, I'd really question whether you need a spotmeter at all, since any affordable one almost certainly won't give you accurate shadow readings from a true 1 degree circle. Not unless that 1 degree circle is surrounded by another 10 degree circle of similar brightness.

 

Zone system use perchance?

 

I'd be willing to bet good money that there are hundreds of spotmeters, or spotmeter functions, lying abandoned and unused after a few enthusiastic uses, and after proving to their owners that spotmetering is an almost complete waste of time.

I use a Minolta Autometer IIIF. It measures incident plus has an attachment to measure 10% reflective. Since I shoot medium format 120 roll film (Velvia 50 and Tmax 100), I don;t use the Zone system anyway. So I'm only concerned with getting the right exposure for the overall shot and film. I also bracket +1 and -1 so I'm covered.

 

I wonder how off the 10% really is if the 1% meters are off?

Thanks for your comments, appreciate that a lot!

Yes it's for the zone system use. I feel like experimenting with it would increase my overall technical level and understanding of light and film, plus playing with exposure and chemistry for grey values control sounds like fun and serious creative tool at the same time. I am currently shooting 120, but if the system works for me I would even consider going 4x5 in the future.

 

I have built-in spotmeter in my Nikon F100, the issue is that zone system and grey values control is not something for 35mm film as pointed out by jochen. Even with 120 and dedicated film back it's likely going to be a lot of waste... For learning I could consider carrying a bit of extra weight by using Nikon F100 + 50mm lens as spotmeter before spending $$ on dedicated one.

I have built-in spotmeter in my Nikon F100, the issue is that zone system and grey values control is not something for 35mm film as pointed out by jochen. Even with 120 and dedicated film back it's likely going to be a lot of waste... For learning I could consider carrying a bit of extra weight by using Nikon F100 + 50mm lens as spotmeter before spending $$ on dedicated one.

 

See "The Zone System for 35mm Photographers," by Carson Graves. You might find it helpful.

using Nikon F100 + 50mm lens as spotmeter before spending $$ on dedicated one.

Looking at a FOV table I'd suggest bringing your light weight telephoto lens (135/2.8?) instead, to get a 1° measuring spot - I don't know how big the F100's is, but...

I have used a Soligor 1 degree spot for 30+ years. I had it modified by Zone VI Studios to deal with internal flare and to match the silicon blue cell color response to B&W film and it has proved to be very accurate. The Pentax digital is a lot smaller and lighter and thus is popular with many photographers, and is still quite pricey for that reason. One advantage of the current Sekonic meters would be the ability to meter studio flash, if that is of any potential use to the OP.

In my inventory, I have two Zone VI modified meters, a Pentax and a Soligor. Measuring them against a number of different light sources and subjects, I could find no discernible difference between the two, less than 1/3 EV, every time. I also have an unmodified Soligor, Minolta Spot Meter F, and a Sekonic L508. They all read very close to one another, not more than about 1/3 EV against common subjects.

 

My film tests were all done using either Ektachrome or Fuji transparency films a number of years ago.

 

Like others I've also used a zoom lens to meter @ 1 degree, locking in the reading and recomposing. Works just fine.

See "The Zone System for 35mm Photographers," by Carson Graves. You might find it helpful.

 

Just wanted to update this thread with gratitude as this book advice was very valuable - thanks Vincent! It is indeed fantastic book that clarifies the concepts in clear and compact form with practical real life examples.

 

As for light meter, I ended up with Sekonic L758D which is combined 1 deg spot + incident meter in one and costs reasonable money when bought used on eBay. This is such a good tool that I don’t see me switching to any other meter in the foreseeable future. To be honest, I am still puzzled why would Pentax Digital Spotmeter go off eBay at nearly hundred bids and at the price higher than device like L758D.

Just wanted to update this thread with gratitude as this book advice was very valuable - thanks Vincent! It is indeed fantastic book that clarifies the concepts in clear and compact form with practical real life examples.

 

As for light meter, I ended up with Sekonic L758D which is combined 1 deg spot + incident meter in one and costs reasonable money when bought used on eBay. This is such a good tool that I don’t see me switching to any other meter in the foreseeable future. To be honest, I am still puzzled why would Pentax Digital Spotmeter go off eBay at nearly hundred bids and at the price higher than device like L758D.

The short answer is that Pentax 1deg spot meters have a certain amount of cachet, and have been a photographic standard for years. They're no longer produced, and the ones converted to Zone VI bring even higher prices. Supply and demand. Large format photographers like the meter. I like them for both medium and large format cameras.

 

The L758 is a tremendous meter. If I ever consolidate my collection, I'll probably buy the L758D. You made a great choice. Enjoy it.