Black Pellix ?

<p>Nice Pellix there, James !<br>

Now put an FL 55mm F1.2 on it! ;-)<br>

At the very least, all the top items were off a chrome Pellix. On the other hand, it looks like brass around the edges along the front. I can't tell with that resolution pic. Can someone post the item #. I can try to look it up under complete items, but the item # makes it easier.<br>

And yeah I'm still eating dust every day. I can get mail, got a nice black FTBn around Christmas. I'm going to put in a different search criteria to try and find these when they come around. Like you James, I'm looking for a black non-QL model. There was one in the spring of 2012 (or 2011) - it went pretty high if I recall, then there's the QL that was pristine except for the mirror, that I picked up (I have a donor for the mirror!).<br>

But those non-QLs; only 1 year and very hard to come by.</p>

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<p>Nice Pellix there, James !</p>

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<p>Neither of those are mine! The top one is a picture from the well-known, high-end (mostly Leica) Austrian vintage dealer/auction house; the lower one is from Wikipedia. The point of my post was to illustrate that the eBay model (picture of top plate below) looks much like the Westlicht one, which is a non-QL, whereas the top plate of the QL model is indeed different (as Jim said it might be) - thus suggesting that the eBay model was not perhaps all that suspect.</p>

<center><a title="Black Pellix on eBay" href="http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Original-version-Canon-Pellix-Black-boxed-lens-hood-very-scarce-/00/s/MTA2NVgxNjAw/z/XqEAAOxye3BRt56a/$T2eC16NHJHgFFl6cMBBBBRt56,T3JQ~~60_57.JPG" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><img src="http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Original-version-Canon-Pellix-Black-boxed-lens-hood-very-scarce-/00/s/MTA2NVgxNjAw/z/XqEAAOxye3BRt56a/$T2eC16NHJHgFFl6cMBBBBRt56,T3JQ~~60_57.JPG" alt="" width="700" height="466" /></a></center>

<p>© eBay etc.<br /> Plus I certainly see brassing along the edge of the prism (another photo below).</p>

<center><a title="Black Pellix brassing on eBay" href="http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Original-version-Canon-Pellix-Black-boxed-lens-hood-very-scarce-/00/s/MTA2NVgxNjAw/z/gYUAAOxyMxpRt56e/$(KGrHqUOKo4FGT1mu(kDBRt56eD1Qw~~60_57.JPG" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><img src="http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Original-version-Canon-Pellix-Black-boxed-lens-hood-very-scarce-/00/s/MTA2NVgxNjAw/z/gYUAAOxyMxpRt56e/$(KGrHqUOKo4FGT1mu(kDBRt56eD1Qw~~60_57.JPG" alt="" width="700" height="466" /></a></center>

<p>© eBay etc.<br /> YMMV, of course.</p>

 

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<p>Can someone post the item #.</p>

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<p>161044512042. But the the <a href="http://go.redirectingat.com/?id=27015X856183&site=photo.net&xs=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fitm%2FOriginal-version-Canon-Pellix-Black-boxed-lens-hood-very-scarce-%2F161044512042%3F_trksid%3Dp2047675.l2557%26ssPageName%3DSTRK%253AMEWNX%253AIT%26nma%3Dtrue%26si%3DZ9qtEh3af%25252FFL32tSGtod4LHZ9jk%25253D%26orig_cvip%3Dtrue%26rt%3Dnc&xguid=88fde4baefcffaae172ceb2f60e4523d&xcreo=0&sref=http%3A%2F%2Fphoto.net%2Fcanon-fd-camera-forum%2F00bhY8%3Fstart%3D10&pref=http%3A%2F%2Fphoto.net%2Fcanon-fd-camera-forum%2F00bhY8%3Fstart%3D20">link</a> <em>should</em> take you there.</p>

<p>Good point James. Non-QL Pellixes are hard enough to come by in chrome, let alone black. There is no doubt that the top plate is indeed an authentic Black Pellix Top Plate, but was it a swap from a QL black body??? Or did the first year (non-QL) Pellix bodies indeed use chrome knobs and levers on the top.....<br>

I'm thinking here. I cannot verify at present because all my non-QL Pellix bodies are back home, but I will verify when i get home that there was a small (about 2 - 3mm) size difference between the Pellix and Pellix QL (and FT which had an identical body size). It that's true than that top plate is indeed an authentic non-QL Pellix top plate and there would be less suspicion regarding it. <br>

Just because an Austrian auction house has a camera body does not make it authentic. A respected US camera company recently had a fake Montreal F-1 for sale, and they didn't know. <br>

Canon might indeed have done that with the chrome knobs on the original Pellix, but my black (QL) Pellix is like the one pictured - ALL black, as is my FT. I guess we'll just have to keep looking...</p>

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<p>... Or did the first year (non-QL) Pellix bodies indeed use chrome knobs and levers on the top....<br /></p>

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<p>But the knobs are <em>not</em> chrome in the way that a chrome QL Pellix's knobs are chrome: the shutter speed dial and rewind crank on my chrome QL Pellix are not black, for instance. They look like this one:</p>

<center><img src="http://harrowgatepress.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/canon-pellix_1.jpg" alt="" width="400" height="348" /></center>

<p>And the same would seem to apply to a non-QL chrome Pellix:</p>

<center><img src="http://logic44.co.uk/mark/Film%20Cameras/Canon%20Pellix.JPG" alt="" width="576" height="432" /></center>

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<p>Just because an Austrian auction house has a camera body does not make it authentic.</p>

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<p>Agreed. But a bit of a coincidence for <em>two</em> non-authentic cameras to look the same, wouldn't you say?</p>

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<p>there was a small (about 2 - 3mm) size difference between the Pellix and Pellix QL<br /></p>

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<p>In which dimension, out of interest?</p>

<p>There is most definitely a size difference between the non-QL and QL bodies. A few year's back, I had planned on changing bottom plates between my QL and non-QL Pellix bodies. As I quickly found out, you can't do it, the QL is larger than the non-QL.</p>

<p>As for the black Pellix, I doubt that Canon would put a chrome advance, shutter button, shutter speed dial and eyepiece ring on a black body. Look at the pic of the black FX. The FX was made before and during production of the original Pellix and came with a black advance lever, etc. Why would they do differently on the Pellix?</p>

<p><img src="http://gallery.leica-users.org/d/357436-1/Canon_FX.jpg" alt="" width="640" height="480" /></p>

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<p>As for the black Pellix, I doubt that Canon would put a chrome advance, shutter button, shutter speed dial and eyepiece ring on a black body. Look at the pic of the black FX. The FX was made before and during production of the original Pellix and came with a black advance lever, etc. Why would they do differently on the Pellix?</p>

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<p>Well, the chrome version of the FX had a black shutter speed dial, whereas both versions of the chrome Pellix were white, plus the knurling on the shutter speed dial and rewind knobs was completely different as between the FX and the Pellix. So that argument seems a tad thin, IIMRSS.</p>

<center><img src="http://collectiblend.com/Cameras/images/Canon-Canon-FX.jpg" alt="" width="400" height="266" /></center>

<p>Interesting debate, though ...</p>

<p >The chrome FX looks like an FTb or any other Canon chrome body FX-based SLR's. </p>

<p > </p>

<p >I'm still unconvinced about the factory panda non-QL Pellix. Why would Canon make a panda Pellix non-QL and then make a true-black Pellix QL? The black FX suggests that they liked all-black SLRs.</p>

<p > </p>

<p >And yes, it is an interesting debate.</p>

<p>In the late 1950s and early 1960s, Canon took a detour into 8mm and super 8mm movie cameras that nearly drove them into bankruptcy. They got back on track with the introduction of the FX and FP bodies and the FL mount in 1964. The release of the Pellix the following year was a statement to that effect. Because it was their flagship model and a technology demonstrator, the differences in trim were unique to the Pellix to make it stand out from their other models. Not only were the shutter speed and rewind knobs different, but the locations of the Canon logo and model name were switched. I believe that the Pellix is the only FL/FD body that doesn't have the Canon logo on the prism housing.</p>

<p>Prior to this thread, I had never seen a picture of a black non-QL Pellix. My first reaction to the one in the link provided by James was that it was a fake for the reasons already mentioned: the detail differences when compared to genuine black FXs and Pellix QLs, and what appears to be chrome plating where the paint has worn away. However, I reserved my judgment because the box included in the auction seems to support the claim that this particular camera was delivered with a black finish. It's only wild speculation on my part, but my current thought is that this may be a genuine black bodied non-QL Pellix that has been repainted and "restored" with parts from a chrome Pellix. It's hard for me to believe that this camera would have left the factory trimmed as it appears in this auction. It'll take the discovery of another, verified black non-QL Pellix to confirm or contradict the stylistic features of this rarity.</p>

<p>Found the following picture of another black non-QL Pellix that leads me to believe that the one in the auction is the real deal:</p>

<p><a href="http://collectiblend.com/Cameras/Canon/Pellix-black.html">http://collectiblend.com/Cameras/Canon/Pellix-black.html</a></p>

<p>I had already posted that picture, Gordon - look back a page in this thread - but thank you. It seems extraordinarily difficult to find indisputable pictures of the non-QL black Pellix. Even <a href="http://www.songofsnow.com/v/vspfiles/articles/Dechert/INITIAL%20POSTINGS/CSLRmon.pdf">Dechert</a> does not refer to it, let alone describe or include a photograph of it.</p>

<p>There are two questionable aspects of the eBay model IMHO: the film advance lever (chrome) and the baseplate (not brassy). There is a useful article <a href="http://www.sky.sannet.ne.jp/seven-ss/camera/pellix.htm">here</a> exploring the differences between the non-QL and QL models, using two chrome bodies. That answers some questions (the styling around the rewind crank and the screws) - although of course one would need the camera in the hand to confirm size difference - but it cannot answer the two I have identified.</p>

<p>The article I have linked to includes the following text (as mangled by Google translate) ("Bae helix" = "Pellix"):</p>

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<p>　I want to keep the difference between black specification Bae Bae and QL helix helix story of the black body was just released. <br />　I'm sorry because it could not provide a picture, but I would like you understand. <br />　Black Specifications Bae helix <strong>is a reverse panda specifications</strong> commonly called remains chrome finish lever buttons and dial of the operation unit in black only body.<br />　In contrast, Bae helix QL is all black chrome finish only lock lever strap ring and shutter button, battery cover, and self-timer lever.</p>

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<p>Here's a link with pictures of black non-QL Pellixes (second and seventh items from the top):</p>

<p><a href="http://www.ta-ka-ra.com/yahoo_camera/best50111/camera_1gan_manual_canon_pellix_k_1.htm">http://www.ta-ka-ra.com/yahoo_camera/best50111/camera_1gan_manual_canon_pellix_k_1.htm</a></p>

<p>The auction links are no longer valid so the small photos are all we have. Still, the finishes on the cameras pictured do seem to match the one recently sold. I'm pretty sure now that the one on eBay is a genuine unmodified black non-QL Pellix. It does appear to have been serviced at one point as indicated by the loss of paint on the screws flanking the viewfinder. On this one and the one pictured at collectiblend.com, there are four black accents on the top cover that differ from the chrome version: the shutter speed dial insert, the inside of the eyepiece shutter blind control under the rewind knob, the inside of the accessory shoe and the battery cover.</p>

<p>To speculate even further, my guess is that: (1) Canon deliberately styled the black version of the non-QL Pellix to be different than their earlier black bodies, or, more likely, (2) it was a very low production, spur of the moment decision which limited the extent to which black finished parts could be produced. The small, subtle black accents on the topside controls would be consistent with the latter theory. Another curious observation is that the box that accompanied the eBay item seems to indicate that the camera was sold without a lens.</p>

<p>I have both models of the chrome Pelllix (QL and non-QL) so I'm familiar with the differences between them. I also have the Pellix QL, FT QL, FTb and FTbN in black so I'm familiar with the subtle differences between the finishes on these as well.</p>

<p>I think we will need to see another black non-QL Pellix to get to the bottom of this one.<br>

Jim, that FX looks like there is silver under the chipped black paint. Are you sure its not a repaint? According to the Canon museum both the FP and FX were available in black, but I've never seen either.<br>

As to the body sizes, the FX, FP and Pellix (non-QL) all had the same body size. The Pellix QL and FT QL (and FTb both types) were about 2-3 mm wider. I think this was to accommodate the QL mechanism. TX (and probably TL & TLb) were the same size as the FTs and Pellix QLs.<br>

Base-plates between the FX and Pellix were interchangeable (I think), but not the FP which had a different release. Or maybe it is the FX and FP that are interchangeable making the non-QL Pellix very one off, in body particulars.<br>

Base-plates for the Pellix QL, all FTs and TLs would interchange with each other but not with the later FD mount cameras because the back release moved to the top. </p>

 

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<p>According to the Canon museum both the FP and FX were available in black</p>

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<p>Where do you find that on their site? I can't. (Not that that says anything: I can't find mention of the black Pellix QL either.)<br>

There is a line in the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canon_FX">Wikipedia entry for the FX</a> (unreferenced, of course) that there are only two black FXs in existence. That seems improbable, but who knows?</p>

<p>The Canon Camera Museum is known to contain errors (as well as omissions), but the footnote in the outline tab for the Canon FP states "Both the FX and FP also had black versions." I've seen enough evidence of their existence to accept this without doubt. I'm also coming around to the belief that genuine black non-QL Pellixes exist, and that they left the factory with the chrome parts in question.</p>

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<p>I'm also coming around to the belief that genuine black non-QL Pellixes exist, and that they left the factory with the chrome parts in question.</p>

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<p>I'm still a skeptic (too many things don't make sense) but will keep an open mind. I look forward to somebody finding another black Pellix one of these days.</p>

<p>But I'll say one thing, the panda Pellix was butt-ugly. If there was a factory-produced panda Pellix, no wonder they changed to all-black in the QL version. </p>

<p>I know a collector who has several hundred FXs. I'm sure many of those are black. Of course that doesn't help us with black Pellix non-QLs.</p>

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<p>I know a collector who has several hundred FXs</p>

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<p>Jeez! What for? Is that <em>all</em> s/he collects?</p>

<p>Canon FL lenses as well. Several hundred of those as well. If you want a Black FX, I'll write him about it.</p>

<p>I'm sure we'd *all* like one! But for the purposes of this thread, some pictures would be good: I can only find two pictures of black FXs on the web. (No Pellixes of any kind in this diverse collection of his, I take it?)</p>

<p>Found another couple of photos:</p>

<center><img src="http://collectiblend.com/Cameras/images/Canon-Canon-Pellix.jpg" alt="" width="400" height="374" /></center>

 

<center><a title="Black Non-QL Pellix on Flickr" href="http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8221/8336860529_60c7f6c958_o.jpg" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><img src="http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8221/8336860529_fb802f9b22_z.jpg" alt="" width="640" height="429" /></a></center><center></center>

<p>The self-timer lever on the first one looks odd: I can only think that the black part must have come off at some point. Otherwise they both look pretty consistently like the Westlicht and eBay models.</p>

<p>There's others on Flickr <a href=" and <a href=" but they are not as clear.</p>

<p>I am in possesion of a black Canon Pellix in very good condition. I am not a collecter so if any one has an interest in it please contact me. It comes with 4 extra lenses that looks as they were never used.<br>

staff@cobrabid.com</p>

<p> Confucius he say "If you've got black Pellix you aught to see a doctor".</p>