50D upgrade 5d2 or 7D

<p>Hi I have a 50D which I'm pretty happy with but and moving forward with my photography and am going to try and make a meagre living from it in 2011. I'm being made redundant from the day job in print so seems an ideal time to "live the dream".<br>

I have the following ....10-22mm/ 50mm 1.4 /60mm2.8 and a 17-85mm so the only one that would fit the 5d2 is the 50mm. So the question is, can i upgrade to the 7D and keep my lenses or do i really need to go full frame? I know for weddings i need some more lenses like a 24-70L but do i really need the 5d2?<br>

I mainly shoot family portraits but intend to move into weddings(slowly) so it needs to work well for both, I have a studio space in mind and have the builders booked to do this so the lions share of money is in this area....<br>

i would love to see what you all think on body and or lenses.<br>

Thanks in advance. Karen </p>

<p>The 7D will work just fine, as would the 50D. Get the 5d2 later if you want or need as an expensive wide-angle or high ISO adapter. There's definitely no need to run out and burn your startup capital on EF lenses right off.</p>

 

<p>Obviously the 7D would be the most painless transition due to your lens collection. It doesn't yield much more rez than your 50D but is cleaner above ISO 800. And if you shoot sports the sure footed AI servo and ripping fast FPS make it like a mini 1D. I especially like the reduced AF area of spot focus for tele and macro work. I mapped it to the DOF so I can use it on the fly in any focus mode. I never have to worry about AF locking on a brighter background object bordering on my subject.</p>

<p>However, for portraits and weddings and 5D2 is the better camera for the silky smooth mural sized printed and easier defocus/shallow DOF effects. The fast frame rate and space-geek AF take a backseat to the IQ you need for those monster prints. Plus, once you look through the huge VF you won't want to touch a 1.6x crop again...</p>

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<p>can i upgrade to the 7D...</p>

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<p>I presume you are keeping the 50D and are expanding to a two body arsenal? If you plan to buy more EF lenses (i.e. "24-70L") then the natural 'slow' progression would be a used 5D II. You can mate the 50/1.4 to it and use it alone for those close portraits for now.</p>

I would invest glass and/or a 5D classic.

I have the 7D while an awesome camera the main advantage over the 50D would be the auto focus system not image quality.

Money would be better spent on glass at this point.. IMO

<p>The 7D is a very fine, professional grade APS-C camera. Many of its features are built around that function. If I were you, I'd get one if I just <strong><em>had</em></strong> to have a new camera now.</p>

<p>However, I'd also suggest just working with your 50D which is still a capable "semi-pro" camera used by many professionals. The biggest problem for new business is under-capitalization (with the resulting "going out of business before you can last long enough to turn a profit" problem). You may need a backup camera, and a used XTi (or perhaps a 20D) or some such would do for the time being.</p>

<p>The lenses that you have can also be upgraded when they need to be and when your earnings justify replacements or extensions. As much as possible, preserve your resources so you can stay around long enough to avoid bankruptcy. If you have special needs, it's often possible to rent (even by 'mail') special lenses for a project, and if things are going well, you can probably charge that back to your client.</p>

<p> </p>

I'm with JDM

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<p>"I would invest glass and/or a 5D classic."</p>

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<p>I agree with Peter. A 7D would not be the best choice for portraits/wedding IMHO. Bokeh can be better and DOF shallower on a FF if framing is the same.<br>

BTW, I own a 5D and 7D and I were shooting portraits or a wedding, the 5D would be my choice.</p>

<p>Karen - I would not suggest shooting weddings with a single body so you will need to add another body. I have both the 7D and 5DII in my collection and of the two the 5DII is the better wedding camera. However, you will spend a considerable sum to move to the 5DII as most of your lenses are EFS. Given your lens collection I would suggest that you either stay with the 50D and add a cheap body (as JDM suggests) or better yet get the 7D. While the 7D does not give the image quality, shallow DOF of the 5DII and is perhaps 2 stop worse in low light performance it is still a fine camera. While I have not used the 50D I believe that it handles in a very similar manner to the 7D (the 7D and 5DII handle almost exactly the same) which is important for paid events like weddings. I am not familiar with your APS-C lenses but I suspect that they will do fine. If you do want to add glass then a better / faster standard lens is probably the way to go. Here you will probably have to stick with an EF-S lens like the 17-55 F2.8 or Tamron / Tokina offering. I own the 24-70 F2.8 and it is a great lens but a little wide on the 7D. I find that I use my 16-35 f2.8II as a standard zoom on the 7D but this is a very expensive lens (the 17-40 is much cheaper but will not give the shallow DOF you may want on APS-C). The other lens you may want to consider is something with a bit more reach - the 85 F1.8 is a great lens and gives you a shallow DOF and 135mm equivalent or you can consider one of Canon's 70-200 zooms. </p>

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<p>While I have not used the 50D I believe that it handles in a very similar manner to the 7D (the 7D and 5DII handle almost exactly the same) which is important for paid events like weddings.</p>

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<p>The 50D and 5D2 interfaces are very similar. The 5 AF modes of the 7D take a few weeks of adjustment even for a seasoned EOS shooter.</p>

<p>Puppy - my main adjustment from the 5DII to the 7D was that the Quick settings had it's own button as opposed to pressing the joystick. Then again I tend to ignore all of the 7D focus patterns and use one of centre (or another manually selected point), Center plus expansion and Spot / Macro. Of these only the Spot / Macro setting is different and with Macro I find that I have lots of time to set the camera up. As Ever I still just use One shot and AI Servo which do not differ from the 5DII. I do not use the AF zones on the 7D as I like to know where the camera is focused and find that with the zones it can chose seemingly random objects to focus on.</p>

<p>Thanks Guys, I do have a second body ...a 30D which will happily sit in the bag just in case. So it seems most of you would stick with what i have and just get on with it then? I will invest in a lens so to spark another debate 24-70 L or 24- 105 L or 17-55</p>

<p>When time does come to upgrade, I'm not sure that a 7d would be the right choice for you anyway, over a 60d (or keeping your 50d which as others have said would be fine too).</p>

<p>Re the lens it depends what you are going to use it for really, and how you feel your current lenses hold you back :) Also whether there is something else that you might need more, like an external flash or two?</p>

<p>If you are going to stay with cropped sensor, unless you need the weather proofing, and you don't want a general zoom to go longer than 55mm, the 17-55 would be a better choice than the 24-70 (comparable image quality, much lighter, and wider, and cheaper (but def not cheap at all)). Your collection is mostly ef-s currently anyway. But if you don't shoot wide very often, want a longer zoom range, and don't need f2.8 the 24-105 would be good. Its not as sharp as the 17-55 though.</p>

30D plus 50D is just fine.

 

Lenses are ok though in the future the 17-55/2.8 would be a great addition.

 

Plus you need a flash. I'd say a 430 would round of the equipment.

 

Now how to start a business and to make it bloom is the hard part…

 

(there are some good pointers on this site)

 

All the best, Matthijs.

<p>Your underlying question is still EF vs. EF-S. I would go with the 85/1.8 since you're still on the fence. The DoF is shallower than the 50/1.4, and maybe more useful than the zooms for your portrait studio. If you're in a hurry to get rid of the EF-S kit lens, I would get the 17-55/2.8 of the three you mention, and let the future bring what it may. If I were starting a portrait studio today with what you already had, I would get the 85/1.8, and two or three mono-lights along with a small bagful of Speedlites. The 17-55 isn't an immediate necessity, and these modest purchases suitable for both your studio and weddings, crop frame or full frame.</p>

<p>If it's a matter of use it or lose it on the camera budget, I would get the 5d2 and 85/1.2. The two primes will suffice for the studio, and future revenues will fill in the lens bag.</p>

 

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<p>"I will invest in a lens so to spark another debate 24-70 L or 24- 105 L or 17-55"</p>

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<p>For now, . . . with the small sensor 30 & 50D's, consider the Tamron 17-50 f/2.8 and have something left over for other new business related items. Of course, any "L" lens holds it's value well on the used market, but the Tamron 17-50 appears to do well used also.<br />The 24-70 or 24-105 will serve well if and when you go full frame, but not very wide on the crop sensor bodies for any group type portraits.<br />Just my .o2 worth!<br />Best wishes on your future endeavors!<br />Jim j.</p>

<p>Of the three zooms I have the 24-70 and used to have the 24-105. The 24-70 is the better lens as it is sharper (although much of the difference is at the edges so you may not get a lot of benefit on an APS-C body) and with F2.8 will give shallower DOF. I have not used the 17-55 F2.8 but if it's quality is close to the 24-70 this may be the one to buy. On my 7D I find that my 24-70 does not get used that much as my 16-35 F2.8 II. The reason for this is that the effective FL range on the 24-70 is 38.4mm to 112mm. I find that I need to be able to go wider than the 60 degree angle of view of this lens - a 17mm lens gives a 75 degree angle. The problem with the 17-55 is that it is an EF-S lens so it cannot be used on full frame (and the construction is not as good as the L series lenses). That said if you do want to go full frame the resale value of the EF-S lens should be good.</p>

<p>1) Since you are beginning to lust after full frame: Don't buy any more EF-S lenses.</p>

<p>2) The body you have now is fine. Unless you plan to shoot video; I suspect a 60D is not a forward step. All the 7D brings to the table is AF capability. . which are not needed for weddings and portraits.</p>

<p>3) You need to upgrade the flash arsenel. Seriously. A single 430EX is fine for some reception shots. . .but you really need to think about how to take the Wedding portraits.</p>

<p>4) Glass: The 50/1.4 qualifies as portrait glass. You should get the 85/1.8 to supplement. The 17-85 would leave a bit to be desired. I would supplement with the 24-105/4L. The 24-70/2.8 is a good "all round" piece of glass; but the primes <em>combined</em> with the 4L-IS is more versitile.</p>

<p>1) Since you are beginning to lust after full frame: Don't buy any more EF-S lenses.</p>

<p>2) The body you have now is fine. Unless you plan to shoot video; I suspect a 60D is not a forward step. All the 7D brings to the table is AF capability. . which are not needed for weddings and portraits.</p>

<p>3) You need to upgrade the flash arsenel. Seriously. A single 430EX is fine for some reception shots. . .but you really need to think about how to take the Wedding portraits.</p>

<p>4) Glass: The 50/1.4 qualifies as portrait glass. You should get the 85/1.8 to supplement. The 17-85 would leave a bit to be desired. I would supplement with the 24-105/4L. The 24-70/2.8 is a good "all round" piece of glass; but the primes <em>combined</em> with the 4L-IS is more versitile.</p>

<p>Sorry Guys once again i forgot to mention a few things, I have 2 x 400w heads and a Lastolite Hilite which is serving as my portable studio set up, Business is booming hence the move to full time. My main focus is on the family market but I think eventually I will need to venture into the Wedding arena. I also inherited a speedlight 550ex but have yet to really get to grips with it.I dont have any way of triggering it remotely off camera, is that something i would need for weddings?<br>

Thanks always rely on Photonet for sound advise. </p>

<p>karen - you should start with the bodies you have. If your 50 f/1.4 is Canon's I would recommend trading up to the Sigma 50 f/1.4 which is sharp from wide open and which offers incredible bokeh. It is an awesome low light / portrait lens. (It's not that the Canon version is bad, but the Sigma is better and it's not that much of an upgrade cost.) I would also add the Canon 85 f/1.8, and trade the 17-85 for a 17-55 f/2.8.</p>

<p>If/when you do get a new body, a 7D or 60D will give you noticeably better high ISO. If you can swing it the 7D is naturally the better body. But you don't need that right away. Glass is more important.</p>

<p>I wouldn't lust after or worry about FF, nor spend a ton of money to try and switch.</p>

<p><em>However, for portraits and weddings and 5D2 is the better camera for the silky smooth mural sized printed and easier defocus/shallow DOF effects. The fast frame rate and space-geek AF take a backseat to the IQ you need for those monster prints.</em></p>

<p>Sorry, but this is wrong advice no matter how many people repeat it. At ISO 800 and below there is no appreciable difference in maximum print sizes between the 7D and 5D mkII. For portraits I would say that actually extends to ISO 1600 with a bit of PS work. This has been tested and debated to death, with at least one magazine coming to the same conclusion, and I have yet to see those who claim otherwise even pick between 100% crops on screen when the labels are gone, much less pick between prints.</p>

<p>As for shallow DoF, it's hard to imagine needing less DoF than you get in a head shot with a 50 f/1.4 or 85 f/1.8 on APS-C. If you want both eyes in focus you will already have to be very careful or stop down. More than one person? You're stopping down, period, or one will be blurred. And one thing I can say for certain after photographing my relative's children over Christmas: the 7D's AF is fast and sure, and spot AF will let you put focus right on the eye of even a moving subject while shooting wide open with those portrait lenses. I've never seen a more usable and reliable AF system when shooting wide open.</p>

<p>The main advantage of a 5D mkII at a wedding is the high ISO quality. But then again high ISO reception shots are not typically enlarged beyond 11x14, and you can pull that off with a 7D at 6400. (IMHO high ISO would be the main advantage to a 7D over a 50D for weddings. But I still think karen should start with glass and then worry about bodies, depending on income/profit.)</p>

5dIII coming soon

<p>Upgrade? Nikon D700 or D3S</p>

 

<p>For flash your 550EX will trigger the 430 (At least mine can trigger my 580 so I assume the 430 will be the same). Thus you can use the 550 on camera and the 430 as fill in. A 7D can trigger the 550 from it's built in flash or the ST-E2 does the best job. My 550 EX works fine on my 5DII or my 7D</p>