Professional Point and Shoot ?

<p>I fear, you will be disappointed what ever you do. The simple truth is that the small sensors lose about two to three stops in "cleanness". Moreover, they do not compare in handling, neither in terms of speed, nor exactness in exposure and image control.</p>

<p>BUT you could try to go back to analoge. You will find some very good pocketable 36mm compacts. For me, that path is out of question, but it is an alternative to be considered. These days, you get your film scanned for little money.</p>

<p>I am always surprised, what my D70 can do in comparison to any compact.</p><div></div>

<p>I was buying some UV filters in Dubai city centre mal from a shop I been dealing with for years, some times I drive all the way from qatar and after 8 or 10 hours drive to dubai , I go directly to his shop buy what I need and drive back home.<br>

Last April when I asked for those UV filters, he told me that he have a good camera for me and I asked to see it, when he brought it out and I saw it was a small compact type digital one, I went laughing, " why should I need a small camera like this one, he told me in his Indian English tounge, " young man _ when you travel around and when you can not have heaviy stuff with you , this is the camera you can easly manage to take with you"</p>

<p>That was the Canon G10 - 14.7MP and with all of the Pro functions.</p>

<p>Now while on holiday in Thailand, I take this camera with me where ever I go and it has that great outstanding performance, after shooting with Hassl. or the F5 or the D3X, I also take some images with the G10.</p>

<p>But for a film I bought the Minox GT camera from the dealer in Qatar for only 10% of the price as no one else is buying them and he have a lot of them, I am now thinking when I return home to buy them all from him, thats also small and very powerful camera.<br>

If you like to even smaller, then go for one of the Sony slim cameras, I have with me here the T-7 and I do use it also in places where cameras are not welcomed, like go gos, dicos, strip teas and some night kabaris and karokies.<br>

The 3 lady boys images on my speical people folder been taken with the Canon G10, there people thought I am just taking photos for my personnel interest which they did not have any objection to, other wise a camera was not allowed in this place.</p>

 

<p>hi. i am partial to the g10, s90 and the lx3 but can these fit in a pocket as you say. the sd780 is a great landscape camera in the bright outdoors. thks</p>

<p>I think the G10, G11 or LX3, LX4 is the smallest option but if you go up the ladder the next stop must be a Leica M9, this is a really small package. It will fit in the smallest of bags as a part of the content but not in the pocket. For size a Nikon FM2 is very small if you have a scanner then you have a super small camera for a very cheap price.</p>

<p>hi<br>

i will recommend LX3, if you want a decent camera for travel.<br>

its such an allrounder, you'll be surprised at what you can do with it.<br>

you can definitely take professional grade photos with LX3, why not? Technically, you can't compare theresults with a 5D, or even with a EP1 for that matter...but aesthetically, you can trump both of them because you will just carry it with you. That said, at ISO 80, results are comparable with any 10 mp camera.<br>

I have shot all kind of stuff with it (including macro and fine art).<br>

Take a look at my LX3 work here:<br>

http://www.flickr.com/photos/agnihot/sets/72157619540388908/<br>

regards,<br>

<img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2542/4117830422_857e5bb06e_o.jpg" alt="" width="800" height="462" /></p>

 

<p>T S, I love this shot!<br>

I'm trying to decide which to get to replace my Canon G7 ( no raw ) thanks for all the suggestions here.</p>

<p>I had the same <em>problem</em> and went with a Canon G9 a few years ago for my climbing and skiing trips where weight and ease of access are of prime importance. I was very happy with the results, and often shoot pano/composites as has been suggested to get even higher res.</p>

<p>As much as I like the G9 (10-11 similar) though it is still a bit bulky, so I've just ordered an s90 for when I want to go <strong>ultralight</strong>, or actually slip it into a pants pocket or my wife's purse.</p>

<p><em>"Although P&S's are beneath most PNetters, ..."</em></p>

<p>Luis, digital P&S cameras aren't "beneath" me. I own a Fuji Z33WP waterproof, pocketable P&S that I carry with me and use as a sort of notebook. It has a 6.16x4.62mm sensor and can make quite good-looking 5x7 inch prints.</p>

<p>The problem with pocket digital P&S cameras is that I've never found one that can make an 8x10 inch print in which I can't see digital artifact. And, working at a camera store, I've seen images run through every fractal and other up-rezzing program on the market.</p>

<p>Most recently, I've shot the Canon S90 and G11 cameras. They made very nice 6x8 inch prints. Beyond that, not so much.</p>

<p>Obviously, image quality is subjective. John C. says is apparently pleased with 20x30 inch prints he's made from a Canon A650 IS. I wouldn't be.</p>

<p>I would suggest that the poster, or anyone else looking to make 8x10 inch or larger prints, go to a camera store with their own SD card, and take a few images with a few digital P&S cameras. Then, see how large the images can be printed while maintaining image quality acceptable to the potential camera buyer.</p>

<p><em>"Back when photography was different from pornography, FINE ART involved little less than a 4x5 viewcamera."</em></p>

<p>To the extent this statement makes any sense, its not quite correct. Traditionally, landscape photographers, like Ansel Adams and Elliot Porter, worked worked with view cameras 4x5 inches and up. Though, even Ansel Adams used Hasselblads for some work.</p>

<p>However, there were many great fine art photographers who worked in 35mm or 120 formats. These include Diane Arbus, Lee Friedlander, Robert Frank, Garry Winogrand and Henri Cartier-Bresson.</p>

<p>I'd like to briefly echo the sentiment a few others have remarked upon by mentioning my experience with the Canon G10. It's not that it doesn't live up to its billing as a GREAT P&S or anything, it is a great P&S, but I still find myself always looking over my images after a party or family get-together and wish I'd just brought my dSLR. For this reason I'm considering dumping the G10 in favor of a Panasonic GF1 kit (although that's even more bulky than a G10, the image quality is about that of an entry level dSLR), or the SD990 or S90 (which are arguably similar in image quality to the G10 but are actually pocketable).</p>

<p>I'm thinking of selling the G10, so if you want one, let me know. ;)</p>

<p>Jon, I had a look at your photos. You had a couple in there that implied that you like long depths of field; others were short, but I suspect those graffiti-type photos was more of what you were getting at.</p>

<p>It's like this: you've just got to carry <em>a</em> camera. You don't have to carry the whole collection, or a bunch of accessories. At some point, you're going to get the same camera chassis as everyone else, and a 50(35)mm lens. It's not that big; you put it on; you wear it around.</p>

<p>For the prints, it goes about similarly. You refine the print processing to get the best that you can at the final viewing size. In optical printing, there's a point in there where the negative gets enlarged so much it's hard to focus on an easel; in digital printing, it'll be more about imagining how to do the math to make the dots of the right size.</p>

<p>We'll bicker and dicker about what's quality; but, there's a lot more latitude in there than sometimes we'll admit. There's a point in there where the image just cannot get made and be recognizable; and there's a point in there where the image is at its ideal quality. You gotta pick.</p>

<p>There is no all-around winning answer. As soon as a new technology comes out, that'll be "the standard," and everything that was great will be considered sub-par and pedestrian.</p>

<p>Look at our answers. Many will fall into two groups: go for new technology, or go for aesthetic and social aspects of the photograph. The answer's somewhere in the middle.</p>

<p>I suspect that a lot of times people feel like the focus of the world is on them when they have a camera out and in use. If that's what's driving you to miniaturize further, I'd suggest: proceed with confidence. Most people really won't care about you. There's a strong chance that when you feel self-conscious, a lot of times the rest of the people around you just may not notice or care as much as you might feel your own awkwardness.</p>

<p>If you can proceed with confidence, I bet there will be a lot more opportunities to carry that DSLR with one lens.</p>

<p>When you get good, camera model is immaterial. But, regardless of model and technology, part of the problem is that you seem to feel that you are not bringing <em>a</em> camera to the scene. f/8 and be there. You know this already.</p>

<p><strong>* * * * *</strong></p>

<p>Do you need to get another camera, or do you need to get <em>a</em> camera over there to the subject?</p>

<p>The G11 will be a good choice. In the hands of a skilled photographer shooting at ISO 200 or lower the G11 will produce very high quality 16x20 size images. I often use my G11 when I do not want to haul an SLR. With decent light (pixel peepers opinions aside) it is quite good. My yield of good photos is lower than with a 5D, but far better than if I had no camera with me!<br>

I just ordered an RRS L plate for it. With a light tripod, the G11 will be a great camera to use when shooting stationary images even in low light.</p>

<p><b>Moderator: Post deleted. This is the Digital Cameras Forum. Please stay on topic for this forum. This is not a forum for discussion of film cameras.</b></p>

<p>I recently shot a concert with a Canon S90 at iso 800. Noisiest images I have ever taken.</p>

<p>I did that journey for the last 2 years (My main camera these days is 1DS M III). Starting with the Canon G9, which i liked for it's rugged compact form, 100ISO performance and ability to use a larger Canon flash. Then i started hating that i could go over 200ISO without getting nasty grain.<br>

My next stop was the brandnew (2008) Canon XSi which was much better in higher ISO and had a build in flash. I just used it with a 24mm which made for a nice compact package. But after some time i started missing the resolution i have with my Ds, especially frustrating when having a nice photograph from a trip that only enlarges so much, before details start falling appart.<br>

And my final step (2009) is now back to a 5D II, that i carry pretty much daily and when i travel in my personal bag, and it's also a great backup body i case of a total meltdown or lost bags in transit.<br>

So i guess i like photography just too much to deal with the setbacks of the small P&S cameras (But i have to admit, i just got a S90 for my wife, so far so fun, but the distortion at the wide setting and 10Mpx bug me big time, but she only needs to print up to 8x10 and i have high hopes for bad/low light).</p>

<p>I have the same demands as the OP. I´ve narrowed my search to a Panasonic GF1/20mm or a Leica X1. Nikon may launch a 2.5 x crop factor camera, i.e. a sensor 20% smaller than the Panasonic µ4/3. Leica leads with a APS-C size sensor.<br>

I used a Contax T2 until it broke, and it WAS pocketable, so I know both of these will be too.<br>

Until now, the Leica has been choice nr. 1, but tests suggest a much slower autofocus than the Pana. As it will be used for street photo as well, I might end up with the Panasonic.</p>

 

<p>A friend of mine had this to say about his choice of P&S, in case it'sof any use:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.leonneal.com/blog/2009/11/03/dont-tell-my-d3-but-im-having-an-affair/">http://www.leonneal.com/blog/2009/11/03/dont-tell-my-d3-but-im-having-an-affair/</a></p>

<p>B</p>

<p>I think you should try before you buy.<br>

The Canon S90 has raw capture capability to give you more latitude in the shot and subsequent print. But its shutter response might make you shudder. That said, it is a small but powerful camera you can slip in your pocket - and teh best camera is the one you have with you when you need it.<br>

The Canon G11 is (new and) larger than the S90, but may be more of what you are looking for in terms of "pro" features.<br>

Again - really you should go to a bricks and mortar store and try these guys out.<br>

Leica digital rangefinders were mentioned above. They are less a pocket camera than things like the G11 (which I think is s stretch in the pocket camera domain). <br>

Keeble and Shuchat in Palo Alto, CA has all these cameras to try out (support your local business). As I'm sure B&H Photo in NYC.</p>

<p>I have the DP1, which has the larger APS-C size foveon sensor and can produce some very high quality pictures. It can be a little slow though, the write times seem to take forever. I use it mainly for landscape images. A good website covering the Dp1 <a href="http://www.rytterfalk.com/2008/03/01/sigma-dp1-first-impressions/">http://www.rytterfalk.com/2008/03/01/sigma-dp1-first-impressions/</a></p>

<p>I have the same problem as you. But I am not a fine art photografer, I just take pictures for fun. I use Leica M8 and some lenses. It is all small and handy and heavy. I am very happy with functionality and the quality I can work with, if I am lucky. But many times I have seen very good images, without having my gear with me. After long consideration I bought a Leica d-lux 4.<br>

The D-lux4 is quite another standard than the M serie. I had hours of disappointment. But now I am quite happy with it. It is small and handy, it has a lense that is fast and not so bad. The computer works very well. Many times i have been surprised, hvad the small camera can do in low light. But, but: it is not always sharp in the corners, it does not always have straight lines in the corners, and it is not as sublime as the M, getting all the details in the sky or in the horizon.<br>

But in contrast to the M8 with all the right lenses, it is always close, when I need it.<br>

Tommy</p>

<p>Another Panasonic GF1 vote.<br>

btw, How do you get to be a fine art photographer? Is there an application form to fill out?<br>

Mr. Lee is on to something here with the People Who Matter suggestion: Al Steiglitz said your work becomes fine art when a rich person buys it.<br>

As far as camera advice goes, I'd listen carefully to Mr. Henderson who really is a fine art photographer, though I'm doubtful he'd declare himself such.</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>I've got 2 of those, I'll second that recommendation - or a Canon g series if digital. But if you want fine art, do more pushups and carry the 5d. Or get bigger pockets. Get you what's called a "field coat" cabelas, carhart etc. However, my application for a concealed camera fine art license was rejected, couldn't pass the background check.</p>

<p>A Pentax K-x with one of the pancake primes (21/3.2, 40/2.8 or 70/2.4) will be not-quite-pocketable but much smaller than your current setup and with the quality that you seek. Buy all three pancakes and you have an ultra-compact travel setup.</p>

<p>What is most impressive to me is the number of responses to the age-old question of the pocketable P&S.</p>

<p>This is better than Canon versus Nikon. By the way, Canon <strong>wins</strong> that battle. ; )</p>

<p>I've owned the G10 and the LX3. Both are good, but I'd take (and do, in fact, <em>take</em> wherever I go) my GRD II.</p>

<p>Others may try and dodge the issue of pocketability but if that is the stated need the GRD II (and I would guess the GRD II) is the best answer, IMHO.</p>

<p>Well there are no "Professional" Point and Shoot cameras, there are some P&S cameras used by professionals. I would even say other than 'Manual' I'm not sure there is even any P&S cameras with professional-level features because this is an artistic medium and all the professionals have various means of getting the image they want, and that seem to even include the lens specifications.</p>

<p>Most of the responses cover the pros and cons of the current top end P&S cameras, but the the GRDII does not come up very often. It really does not excite me personally, but I do like the GRDIII. However; the price, and the price of accessories, does dampen my enthusiasm just a bit.</p>

<p>Mentioned a couple of times is the possibility of putting a small lens on your SLR and finding a little bigger pocket or little pack of some kind. I'm unsure what your looking for in a lens, but this option should not be too quickly dismissed. Once you get use to a camera and it's operation is second nature, it's a bit distracting to switch to another some times if you don't have some time to switch the working area of your brain.</p>

<p>Good Luck!</p>

<p>GRD III</p>