90mm APO-M Summicron

I have been offered a 90mm APO-Summicron at a good price. I currently

have the E55 90mm Summicron which I like. But APO is APO and I have

been impressed with the APO Leica lenses I do have (135mm APO-Telyt

and 180 APO). I use the 90mm for quite a few shots at infinity wide

open - this is when I would expect the APO to shine. However, some

people have implied that the APO 90mm has poor bokeh. I'm not a bokeh

fiend exactly, but I would be interested to see any shots people have

taken with the lens at wider apertures. Any thoughts as how it is a

"portrait" lens? Is the bokeh too harsh for this? Anyone used old and

new APO Summicrons? Can anyone post anything that I might find

helpful? The price is too good to miss should I actually want it.

Thanks.

Robin, the look of the APO-Summicron is almost exactly like a current Elmarit at any distance, which is almost exactly like your Summicron from f/2.8 from about 2m and farther. Imagine the same look you get with your Summicron from f/2.8 at 2m+, but also at f/2 and even close-up, instead of the soft, low-contrast look the pre-APO Summicron has at f/2.

Rob, building on what Jay expertly mentioned..... I've had the opportunity to shoot the 90'cron against the 90AA'cron and the difference is subtle but noticable, especially so when at f/2.0 where the difference is quite easy to spot. I didn't get a chance to test A/B for bokeh when I borrowed the 90'cron (prev model), aince I didn't have the 90AA yet. However I think in general terms that people are right if they say the bokeh of the 90AA is not as good as the previous model 90'cron. When stopped to about f/5.6 or so, the new 90AA doesn't seem as creamy to me - but again, I wasn't able to A/B compare them. I would not call the bokeh poor, just not as good, not as smooth. Put in perspective... I really like the bokeh from the 50'cron, and although the 35A'cron is ok...even good...its not AS good as either the older 35'cron, or the 50'cron. The 90AA is like the 35A'cron... a bit crisper, nore modern flavored in Leica terms.

 

I DID, however, get the opportunity to shoot wide open at the same scene (night harbor/city lights) with both lens at different times - with just about the same clear shooting conditions. Its painfully obvious that the new 90AA is far better when shot wide open and there are pinpoints of light in the scene. The older 90'cron got sort of fuzz-ball results at the far left and righ, whereas the new 90AA is just about perfect across the frame.

 

I think someplace Erwin said that the 90AA didn't get much better stopped down.... I can't verify this. I also think from your post, that the 90AA might be better for you - with your style of shooting. I've done a few portraits with the 90AA but never wide open (I like eyes and nose in focus at f/4 or so). But, I dont think there'd be a problem with the bokeh benig too harsh there at all.

"I have been offered a 90mm APO-Summicron at a good price."

 

It's another no-brainer. Buy it, use it, don't like it? Get your money back. Just don't scratch or drop it, and you'll be fine.

 

Steve

First, sorry for the scan, dusty and all, but my scanner is dead (piece of junk @*) and that's I have handy.

 

I'm not a bokeh 'expert'. I call what is out of focus simply the out of focus area (oof). A pic is better than speech. The scan you can see (eventually, fingers crossed) has been taken with a 90 APO 'cron on Fuji 400 probably very open (maybe 2.0, but I'm not sure). The oof doesn't seem very harsh to me, but it's hard to tell with only one shot. Once again, I'm not an expert on this, but it seems to me that strange and unpleasant oof seem to happen when you have some bright areas (light small lights, ...), which is lacking on this (mediocre) pic. I've never noticed really unpleasant oof/bokeh with this lens.

 

I heard a few times several people complaining the 90 APO was too harsh for portraits: It show all the blemishes, blah blah. If you like soft focus portraits style (like in 'old' fashioned but pleasant studio photo), the 90 APO is probably not what you want. Better get a Thambar - if you can find one.

 

I use my 90 mostly for landscape. I can tell you in this kind of pictures, its quality is incredible: Small details barely visible or invisible to the naked eye perfectly sharp and defined. IMHO, it's the best Leica lens I own. Too bad I don't use it more often, but that's my problem...<div></div>

I have one. It's a wonderful lens. The pictures it gives do not have the same "feel" as the elmarit for the M or the 5 element elmarit for the R: it is sharper, more modern, less dreamy: more like the other aspherical lenses. The bokeh is fine, though, and has never been a problem for me. (It is not nearly as smooth as the 75's but is nothing like a nikkor 35-70 2.8 I used to own, and I would guess is better than that of my 35 asph.) I'm sure you'd enjoy the pictures it gives (even if, judging by the colours of projected slides, the 135 apo is the best lens in the whole M line-up.)

if you decide to purchase the APO and sell the e55 let me know, I would be interested in purchasing it.

<i><b>but I would be interested to see any shots people have taken with the lens at wider apertures. </b> </i><p>

<center><img src="http://www.offstone.com/photo/attachment.php?s=&postid=63049"><P></center>

Thanks everyone. This is most helpful. I will be talking to the APO-offerer later today!

'Cron 90 Apo Asph wide open? Yeah!

Alain

Excuse me; I hope the picture will pass:

Alain

For anyone who cares, I decided to pass on the APO. It is just more money and I am happy with the pre-APO - it is a nice portrait lens and I don't use it much where ultra high resolution is required (I would use the R for that) so I kept what I know I like.