simon_wong

Hi Johann,

I believe all the F1 versions have the same optical design. The

coatings will be different pending on the era. This will probably

have greatest bearing on the flare resistence.

I have the E58 version and it is a superb lens in every sense.

Not sure if the version vignettes more with filters than the E60's

but you should know this lens vignettes even without filters....but

then all Noctilux's do :-)

Good luck.

Steve,

I just picked up a loupe today and am very pleased. I find I can see the 50 frames well on my M6.72 finder but struggle to fit in the 35 frames when I have my glasses on. With my contacts these become visible.

The brightness level drops slightly and is most noticeable in the form of dimmer brightlines. Not a problem on my Noctilux, but if I has a 75'lux I think I"d struggle.

The compensation of an almost lifesize view more than makes up for this and indeed makes focusing easier/faster. I notice I can keep both eyes open and my focus is faster again, but the brightlines dim even further. I haven't decided if I'll use this technique.

I shouldn't think the M2/4 would be any different as the eyepiece threads are the same but I'd imagine you will loose the 50 brightlines on the M3. Should be a real treat to use the 90 though.

I like the design of the catcher safety line and the leather pouch. I'm a bit of a gadget freak so the purchase of this baby was a no brainer once I knew I could use it to my advantage with my Noctilux.

Cheers.

Thanks guys. I think I've figured it all out. Everyone's feedback

helped, especially Jack and Lutz's

Cheers.

Thanks Phillip.

I have the M6TTL. I gather then the flash does not sense the lens aperature automatically like it does the ISO setting?

Also, does anyone know if the TTL gives a better or worse result compared to A setting at the 3 preset aperatures?

Hi,

Have a used SF20 with no manual.

Wondering about the LCD display when in TTL mode.

When I change aperature on my lens no corresponding display changes

occurs on the LCD readout. Is something wrong with my flash?

I can change things with the +/- buttons on the flash, but this seems

independent of the lens aperature.

Confused.

Dale,

<p>

I use a strobroframe that is actually meant for my Rolleiflex. It

works as I keep an Abrahamsson Rapidwinder on my M6. This has a

centred mounting hole unlike the regular M baseplate.

<p>

I am curious to what flash cord you have for your SF20?

<p>

Simon

Russell,

<p>

As I understand it, the focus shift only applies when stopped down.

You should have no problems between F1 and F4, but at F5.6 and

smaller the plan of focus shifts. Can't remember the exact reason

though.

<p>

The biggest problem is the limited depth of field wideopen up close

with the Noctilux. Again no problem when you are centering your

subject directly over the focus rectangle, but if you recompose your

image after focus as I often do with my portraits, then the plane of

focus will appear to be closer than your point of intended focus.

<p>

I over come this by focusing on my subjects eyes, recomposing and

then 'tweeking' my focus ring to a point closer than the original

focus corresponding to the depth of field marker distance. It is

almost failsafe for me.

<p>

I love my Noctilux but only because I nail my focus everytime with

this method.

<p>

Haven't noticed the focus shift effect much as I mainly shoot between

F1 and F2.

<p>

Good luck

My 2 cents worth....ditto on everything said. My Nocti was purchased

at the same price as Emile's, albeit without box and a few more signs

of it's 20 odd years of light collecting. I like pristine lenses, but

someone once told me a well used lenses has the benefit of actually

producing images that someone liked enough to keep using it...:-)

<p>

Sharp enough to cut paper, yet soft enough so your subject still

feels flattered. Difficult to focus without practice, but once you've

got the knack, you can nail it everytime. (I focus,recompose-usually

off centre-and tweek the focus the distance of the depth of field

marker,so it's focused a fraction closer to allow for a shift in the

film plan angle)

<p>

Heavy beast with a long throw, but with the Abrahamsson Rapid Winder

and his softie, the perfectly balance light collection machine!

<p>

Has "the look" and produces "the look". Love it.

<p>

(Had the 35Asp'lux but this baby sat around in my bag so much after I

got my Noctilux that I found it a more loving home on my friends M6)

Bob,

<p>

Most of the pro. neg films are good at coping with mixed lighting. I

like the Portra range, specifically 160VC,400NC and 800. The Fuji

equivelants are great too. (NPC or NPS, NPH and NHGII or NPZ)

<p>

These are low contrast films favoured by wedding photogs and are

suited for portraiture and the high contrast situations typical of

indoor photography.

<p>

The press films such as Supra and Fujipress in both the 400 and 800

range are possibliy even better with mixed lighting but are also much

more contrasty in nature as they have a greater exposure latitude and

are suited to push processing.

<p>

Finding a good lab for tradition printing and or photoshop

manipulation is equally important. Some labs work better with Fuji

and others with Kodak film. Actually more labs work better with Fuji

than Kodak.

<p>

There's not a lot I miss with my Noctilux and 400-800 film.

<p>

Burn some film and see what you like. Try out different labs too.

<p>

Cheers.

Luxman,

<p>

I've owned the Wetzlar black chrome version with the clamp on metal

hood. And have a friend with the current model.

<p>

I like the balance of the new model and for me it is much better to

handle and focus with. I found my lense had stiffer focus and the

ridges of the focus ring "cut" a little into my fingers.

<p>

I also prefer the closer focus distance of the newer lense. The

shorter throw of the focus ring also seemed to decrease focus time.

<p>

The advantages of my Wetzlar model? The hood is much more effective,

and the lenses are usually half the price of the newer versions.

<p>

Cheers.

Paul,

<p>

I have owned both the Noctilux and the 35Asp'lux. Very different

lenses. As an all rounder the 35 is pretty hard to beat. Much lighter

and easier to use ergonomically and in composition. Definitely a

better lens optically. Much sharper across the board and no hint of

vignetting.

<p>

Yet I still sold the 35 when a very insistent friend offered to make

use of it more regulary than I seemed to be.

<p>

I like the look that the Noctilux gives me. Couldn't say the same

with my Asp. lense. I like the focal length. I find now that I have a

Abrahmsson rapidwinder the balance of the 3units is perfect for me.

Plus I have figured out the trick of nailing near distance focus wide

open with my baby. This applies mainly to offcentre subjects of

course. I focus on my subject's eyes(most of my imagery is of people)

recompose usually placing my subjects head toward the midthird points

within the frame and the tweek my focus to a slightly closer focus

distance- corresponding to the depth of field marker distance on the

lens barrel. I very rarely miss focus, even under 1.5m

<p>

Actually I can see why everyone complains about missing focus with

this lense. I get almost every shot now with my tweeking trick, so if

I didn't use my technique I guess I'd miss nearly every shot. Bit of

a worry for those outside the "loop". Learnt if off a very early

posting on this list.

<p>

Anyway I think I've sidetracked. Get both if you can afford it. I

could, but still sold off the 35 as I'm really a 50's man and I like

the look of the Noctilux. Knowing what I do now if I needed a 35 as

well I'd get a Summicron. Vice versa if I favoured the 35 over the 50.

<p>

Good luck.

Patrick,

<p>

I really prefer the Kodak Portra range myself. 160VC, 400NC and the

800 are all superb. However I do not like the 160NC and the 400VC

films. The only downside is lab/operator dependency.

<p>

I use to shoot Fuji NPH and NHGII but switched after I found a lab

that worked well with the Kodak. Fuji films are generally less of a

problem for labs technicians it seems.

<p>

I have heard good reports on Fuji's NPZ800 film. Supposed to be

excellent grainwise.

<p>

If you want to go a little lighter on the hip pocket then try out the

Agfa Vista range. I like the 200 and the 800.

<p>

Happy snaps.

Vikram,

<p>

I have owned the Asp35'lux, 50'lux and Noctilux. The speed of the

lenses is very important with lowlight photography, but the modern

highspeed films available today make slower lenses very competative

too.

<p>

I sold both of my 1.4's and shoot mostly with my Nocitlux now. As far

as image sharpness and contrast go, the 35 wins hands down. It is

better ergonomically and probably is a more practical focal length.

<p>

It probably is the best lowlight lens too, given the focal length to

aperature ratio.

<p>

My reasons for my choices? Purely emotional. I don't like the bokeh

of the Asp 35 and love the look of the Noctilux.

<p>

It's image is soft, there is vignetting, it's big and heavy and slow

it use. But when I look at the prints.....nothing else comes close.

<p>

The 50'lux is very similar and infact has more contrast and almost no

noticable vignetting and is much smaller than the Noctilux. However,

the bokeh is still not the same, even at the same aperature

settings. ;-)

<p>

Do I miss these lenses. Sometimes. I think not having a 35 can be a

pain, but I had an emotional distance to my 35'lux which was bought

used and my dealings with the seller soured my feelings. Plus I sold

to a friend who will benefit from it's use.

<p>

I am now eyeing off a 35'cron that is much more compact and much

lower in price than the 'luxes.

<p>

Vikram, nothing about Leicas is rational. Emotion rules in this

particular field of interest. If we were truely right brained about

our photography we'd all be shooting with something else....

<p>

Now to come off my tangental ramblings.....the 35Asp'lux has very

similar performance to the 35Asp'cron. A little sharper in the centre

and a little softer at the edges. The benefit of the 'lux is one

extra stop-and a high contrast useable stop at that. The benefit of

the 'cron is greater edge to edge eveness in performance and a

flatter field image. Plus it's smaller and it's cheaper.

<p>

Simon

Hello Jay,

<p>

My 1st gen. Noctilux (58mm thread) has a rigid plastic sprung clip on

lenshood. A big hat for a big beast...:-)

<p>

Cheers.

I like mine a lot.

<p>

I feel I gain a stop in minimizing camera shake and it "funkifies" my

M visually :-)

<p>

The downsides are I loose a shot occasionally to the inside of my

camera bag as the shutter is very easily triggered and battery drain

can be a problem if my meter is not switched off.

<p>

My friends who have non TTL cameras have commented that they

occasionally trigger the shutter with the softie in place when they

change the shutterspeed dial. I have not noticed a problem here with

my M6TTL, but then the dial is much larger and protrudes further away

from the shutter.

<p>

Simon

Chris,

<p>

M Leica's excel in lowlight documentary type photographic situations.

The ability to shoot indoors with available lighting and retain good

quality images is only possible with large aperatures, accurate focus

and low shutter vibration.

<p>

Limited DOF is a natural consequence of wideopen aperatures. The fact

that many Leica lenses, particularly the non Asp. lenses, have a

smooth transaction between out of focus and in focus zones is a

wonderful added bonus. This of course is just a tool that can be

utilized in the final "artistic" visualization of your photograph.

<p>

Will your images be sharper with flash and at F5.6/8 with your glass?

Yes. Is even more true is you mount your camera on a tripod? Yes.

Does this provide a different feel to an image taken handheld at F1

in available lighting? Yes.

<p>

Play with your equipment and try variations to see what resulting

images appeal best to you. I used to be F8 and be there...with flash.

But since I have aquired an M6 and a Noctilux 50F1 my preferences

have changed....even if my images are now not quite as sharp as they

once were.

<p>

I guess I've seen the light...:-)

<p>

Simon

James,

<p>

Given similar conditions, ie properly serviced and working, they are

all fine examples of first rate cameras. The earlier cameras tend to

feel smoother in operation as they are hand built, but the later

models are a little more accurate shutter speedwise at the faster

speeds. This is especially true in colder weather.

<p>

Which to choose? Let your budget, requirement for meter, and

preferred viewfinder magnification-ie lens requirements decide for

you.

<p>

Today you have options of .58 through to .91 magnifications and with

the new 1.25x magnifier slightly greater than lifesize. Pick your

lenses and the bodies will come....:-)

<p>

Cheers.

Simon

Red,

<p>

As you already have 2 50mm lenses there is no need to explain the

pros and cons of this focal length. The Noctilux's advantage is of

course speed and a distinct freedom from flare.

<p>

You mentioned you were not satisfied with the sharpness or "true as I

would like" regards your Nikkor50F1.4. Unfortunately the Noctilux

image is not particularly sharp. Certainly you will notice a distinct

drop of image sharpness when compared to your other Leica glass. On

the other hand you cannot really discribe the image as soft either.

It's hard to explain.

<p>

The images are contrasty with a very 3D appearance, but as the DOF is

so shallow you will notice a very unique narrow focus point of view.

Everything outside of a few cm's of your point of focus begins to

blur. It is not very good at rendering environments to the eye at a

glance. Colour saturation is marked with this lens. This provides an

almost surreal, dreamlike quality to the images.

<p>

Your ability to capture lowlight images is indeed enhanced with this

lens. Both as it is a true F1 lens and equally because of the weight

of the lens increased stability is noticed in the handholdablity.

<p>

I tend to use my Noctilux for portraiture in indoor available light

settings. If there is enough light for you to focus, you can shoot

with a Noctilux. The most difficult skill is actually to get the

focuspoint where you want it. Not always easy.

<p>

The Canada vs German question is not an issue if you intend to buy

new. It's not really and issue even if you buy preloved, other than

from a collectors point of view.

<p>

Simon

For Sale.

<p>

50 Summilux #2345372. Mint with hood and caps. Hood has minimal signs of wear but lens is bleamish free. US$800

<p>

35 Summilux M Asph. #3705173 (2nd gen.) Marked but outstanding user. Minor dings around filter ring and a light mark on the barrel at the depth of field ring. Glass looks free of problems. Comes with hood, caps and leather pouch. US$1350

<p>

Contact me off list.

<p>

Simon

Melbourne, Australia

I have one and boy is it sharp. It's well balanced and well machined.

Very easy to use and it's application is probably the broadest of any

lens in the M range.

<p>

Downside? Price. Size relative to the 'crons, but no bigger than the

50's. The bokeh is weird and not anyway as pleasant as the non Asp

lenses.

The M is a 2 handed camera. And it does have it's quirks. It will

grow on you and become an extension of your eye....or it won't. It is

a very specialised camera. Very limited in application actually. The

R's have a much wider range of practicality.

<p>

Fiddle, play, shoot a whole lot of film...(if you can figure out how

to load it...). If you like it, it will become an addiction. If you

don't, sell it. You won't loose much of it's value if you keep it

clean.

The newest version has the ergonomic edge. The balance is better and

the closefocus ability is very useful. The coating is better and

harder too.

<p>

On the other hand older pristine versions can be had for less than

half the cost with very little image differentiation. The earliest

chrome versions have the edge on build quality, but can be subject to

the fogging issues that seem to plague the Leica lenses of the

earlier era.

I have a chrome rapidwinder for my chrome TTL. Not quite a perfect

cosmetic match but a brilliant mechanical match. I find the balance

to be excellent as is the fit and finish. The operation of the unit

is smooth and very natural.

<p>

The added benefit is the recentering of the tripod socket. I find I

can mount my M/RW combination onto my strobroframe flash bracket and

use my flash setup too, even with my various finders attached!

<p>

Mine was the last one Tom made before his hospital visit, but he's

back on line again and that's great news indeed.

<p>

I use his soft release as well and both these products enhance my

enjoyment of my M camera. All his products are extremely good value

for money and well worth your investment of 4 hundred odd dollars.

<p>

Simon