maira_sharron

<p>I used to edit photos for a wedding photographer - after a couple years, I felt that after having edited so many weddings and hearing the war stories, I felt I could venture out and do it myself. Of course, I also had background in photography - took b&w classes at a university and learned how to shoot manual everything.</p>

<p>I jumped into wedding photography with both feet. I realized I needed a portfolio, so I did what every pro photographer hates. I placed an ad on Craig's List. I was honest and said I would charge $1.00 per photo (minimum of 150). Craziness. I did 4 weddings like that. I raised my prices to that of a cheap photographer - and some bride on the Knot sang my praises. I never advertised - always worked on referrals. The Knot brides are always looking for the "best for the cheapest." I was that for a couple years. Then I raised my prices to that of an low to mid range photographer. Still got lots of referrals. Still never advertised. Never charged what I really should have charged - because I'm so self critical that I didn't think I deserved it. After 4 years, I was exhausted. I had a full time job and photography became my second full time job. I wanted out. I doubled my prices because I didn't want any more business, but I didn't want my current brides to feel nervous (I had a year's worth of bookings ahead of me). People were still calling me. I was shocked. But I was also braindead. I was beginning to hate it. I turned all of them down and celebrated when I shot my last wedding. </p>

<p>This was two years ago. My daughter just got married this year. I never realized how good I was until I started shopping around for a photographer. People who were clearly unimaginative and pushed poor quality were charging an arm and a leg. I shook my head in disbelief. I'm not patting myself on the back for the work that I did, but I really never gave myself the credit that I should have -- so critical of myself, I failed to realize that I actually had talent in this field. Not only in taking photos but in relating to the brides and grooms. The knowledge wasn't enough to make me want to get back into wedding photography. I even sold my pro equipment because I had so many people asking for freebies (my day job included), that I wanted to get rid of my equipment so they would quit bugging me.<br>

<br />The only camera I have now is my old Canon 40D and an 85 mm 1.8 lens. Oh...and a G12. It has taken me a couple years, but I am just now beginning to feel like picking up the camera again for enjoyment.</p>

<p>The lesson I learned was that if people are talking about "what a great photographer for the price" - then it's time to increase your price. And keep increasing until you reach a point where people leave off "for the price." You never want to be so busy that you can't enjoy other aspects of your life.</p>

<p>I'm dumbfounded by this. The moral of the story - never work without a contract and never hand over all images (cull out the bad ones). </p>

<p><a href="

<p>you said..</p>

<p><em>The B and MOH ( her sister) were fighting, bridesmaids were crying and people kept disappearing (wedding party), but when it was all said and done I think I did pretty good for my first time.</em><br /><em>It was a beautiful day, but the sun was at the worst spot possible after the ceremony. I kept wishing it would disappear behind some <a id="itxthook0" href="../wedding-photography-forum/00aKC0?start=70" rel="nofollow">clouds</a>.</em><br>

<em></em> <br>

<em></em>Welcome to the wonderful world of wedding photography.</p>

<p>I'm glad you listened and paid attention to what the pros advised. One comment though -- don't work toward a larger format camera -- I'm not quite sure what you mean by that anyway - when I hear "large format," I think of the guy standing behind a bellows camera with a sheet over his head. Maybe you meant more pixels - not necessary. What you want is quality pixels. That said -- you've heard it a million times, but it's true -- it's the quality of your knowledge that is the key...not the camera, though some would argue that point. </p>

<p>Now that you have experienced your first wedding, understand the pros and cons of your first wedding. Disappearing bridal party? Ask for a go-to person prior to your next wedding. Someone who is not the bride or groom - maybe a sister, close friend, etc. Someone who knows most of the people -- that can find (or have someone else find) that missing person. The bride and groom (after you explain why you need this) will often say, "oh...Johnny would be perfect for the job..." and Johnny then takes it seriously if the bride and groom make him aware of it before the wedding....and you make sure to acknowledge how important he is to you and how much you appreciate his help, because he can most definitely shorten that formal photo time up and free up time for your creative session.</p>

<p>Too sunny and not a cloud in sight at the worst possible time of the day? (haha...I did mention this in my earlier post) -- your job is to scope out some area of shade somewhere. Even if the beautiful scenery is in the sunniest spot -- take some there, but you'll love the shaded photos, no matter where they are...more. Being new to this, you may have overexposed her white dress in the sunlight. Right now anyway...at least until you learn how to make the sunlight work for you in ways you never knew before. There has to be a tree somewhere - a side of a building - a gazebo. It may look like there's not a shady spot in sight, but that's rarely the case. I remember being a guest at a wedding -- the photographer was cutting his teeth on this wedding, and he knew I was a pro. He came up to me and said, "I'm trying to figure out a space where I can shoot, but it's so sunny and I can't find shade." True -- where he was looking, there was no shade, but he forgot that they had their ceremony under the trees, just 100 feet from where he was standing. I told him to go back under the trees -- his photos came out fantastic. He was nervous -- and wasn't of a mind to think of the very obvious. In his mind - the after wedding photos had to be somewhere else.</p>

 

<p>I know I'm late posting my photo -- but it was one of my all time favorites, so I wanted to share.</p><div></div>

<p>Actually she went easy on you. </p>

<p>You have 15 years of experience, however, just one baby shoot, one engagement shoot, one boudoir shoot and one very tiny wedding shoot. The classes and nature photography represent your level of interest in photography, however, this wedding commitment is a business decision that can backfire on you if you are not adequately prepared. Timing (it never goes as planned) and intuition (making the best of a bad situation) is everything - as the ability to know how to manipulate light to your advantage. Is this an indoor wedding? Is the reception in the evening and indoors? What is the maximum aperture on your lenses? Do you know your external flash like the back of your hand so that you can set it up within moments while everyone watches what you're doing (in the church). Do you have an assistant to hold your reflector? Have you done your research on what to expect throughout the day? Are you prepared to be proactive and in charge? </p>

<p>A photographer is a director - keeping things moving along when it comes to the bridal party (who can get unruly), without being bossy; cheerful enough to keep everyone happy; intuitive to the needs of the bride (meaning you don't ask her countless questions throughout the day because you should KNOW -- and you know because you are the photographer - this will make sense to you someday); know when to accommodate (do they look confused when it comes to cutting the cake ? - then guide them) or when to step back (don't crowd the dance floor during the first dance). Do you have a plan for rain? Because it will be you they turn to for a place to go for fabulous plan b shots (at a free location of course). This is all at the top of my head. Are you prepared for the perfectly planned timeline to be shot to h*** pretty much at the get go - so this means the time will be made up during the between wedding & reception shots -- reducing your hour and a half to about 20-30 minutes (though you can't reduce the number of poses they expect), because you cannot, absolutely cannot make them late to their reception. Indecision is your worst enemy. You can't take the time to think things through - like when the sun is beating down from you overhead and there's not a tree in sight, or when your external flash isn't enough light for the formals.</p>

<p>Post processing, album creation, blogging - there's an art to it all. </p>

<p>We all have been where you are now...and we know what you're in for. You may think that after all is said and done, you have a successful first wedding. Until you have shot your 10th wedding and look back at your first. Then you will realize what an amateur you were. Because you are - your 15 years of experiences/classes mean nothing until you've actually lived through it and proven to yourself that you, indeed, can handle the pressure of wedding photography. Not everyone is cut out for it. The last thing you want to do is piss of a photographer who has been through it all by typing frowny faces and thanking the SUPPORTIVE ones with all caps. Toughen up, suck it up and pay more attention to the critical advice, because that's how you will learn. Or don't. </p>

 

<p>Konstantinos, you want the white highlights, but dodging loses detail. Vail is right - more clarity brings up the detail in the entire veil and what is behind it. It also defines the folds. If the veil is folded on top of another layer of veil, it will appear whiter than a single layer of veil, because it creates a more solid layer of fabric.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.topazlabs.com/adjust/">http://www.topazlabs.com/adjust/</a></p>

<p>In addition to the normal formals, I tried different set up with each wedding party. Knowing that this would be posed, I opted to tell them exactly how they should look...going from couple to couple - I seemed to get better results when I told them what expression and body language to portray - which gave them a role to play. I had the bridesmaids below were emulating the movie poster for "Bridesmaids." I've also had fun in the past with the Twilight movie poster emulations.</p>

<div></div>

<p>I used a 7D and a 24-70 for most of the day. It's not a full frame camera, so perhaps technically, according to the pros, I should have used a different lens, but it served me very well. I used my 70-200 for close ups at the church and reception, as well as my 85mm. Did I do it wrong? It sure felt right to me. I suppose it's what you feel comfortable with using. </p>

<p>Thanks for your comments Vail. The comment that made me laugh was the 80's comment -- not sure how that looks to be an 80's type of photo, care to elaborate? Did they do that in the 80's, did they do it with multiple enlargers, Uelsmann-style? Yes, the couple had the personality to appreciate this photo, otherwise I would not have created it.<br>

Also, I'm not one to insist on precise placement of rings. It all depends on the setting and what I'm working with, and the mood I want to represent. I think some people get too caught up in that, and it may hinder creativity. By the way, the marry me one was my idea -- I brought the sweetheart candies with me to the wedding. It was just something that I wanted to do.</p>

<p>Ring set ups were always something I took a lot of thinking to do. In addition to rings with flowers, I try to come up with something that I think that the couple might have liked based on either their personality or the decorations they chose. I strive for whimsy in some of the shots if I think the couple will like it. Some cake toppers, the candy bar set up, are things I use as well. I always shot the rings during dinner, that way I wasn't afraid of missing something during the reception. Forgive me for posting a collage - since I no longer have anything new to contribute, I'm taking liberties, haha.</p><div></div>

Trying again to upload from my phone

<p>the drawing</p><div></div>

<p>edited -- apparently you can't upload from an iphone. Really too much effort to show you my son's art, but for the sake of completing my post, I'll try again from my desktop. My apologies in advance for those that would get offended that I am making light of the topic. Videographers were the bane of my existence. Not all of them, but some of them.</p>

 

My kids often heard my complaints

regarding videographers planting

themselves in front of the main aisle or

even on the dance floor with the bride

and groom. My son created a one if a

kind birthday card for my last birthday

... It made me laugh out loud. Even

though he's 24 years old, his special art

is proudly displayed on the refrigerator.

I just took a photo of it with my phone

to share it with you.

<p>Of course I skimmed through your original post and then waited a couple hours before replying so what you wrote wasn't fresh in my mind. Let me add - Was there a shot list? Was the groom's family on the shot list? If not - why was the photo taken? I guess that's the real question. If it wasn't something that the bride and groom stated that they wanted, then she had a reason to get a little ticked off and then I'm sure it probably grew from that moment. The other question is -- did you promise her something and then didn't deliver? Like the trees? Why was dinner an hour late -- was it due to the formal photos that had to be taken? I suppose I should have asked those questions first. If, for some reason, the timeline was messed up because you took longer than needed to take photos, then she might have a reason to complain about "her vision." I guess I need to hear more of the story to determine whether or not I would offer an after session "for free." It all depends on if you delivered what you promised -- and if the delays were issues out of or in your control.</p>

<p>I stick by my album design comments, however. It sounds like you do what I do -- there's no reason for a bride to determine every aspect of the design. If she doesn't like your design, she can feel free to create her own with the pictures she received from you. Don't offer a refund -- stick it out to the end and do what your contract states you would do.</p>

<p>When she met with you, she should have seen your style in your prints and your albums. Had she brought up at that time that she wanted to be fully participatory in the album design, that's one thing. To say it after the fact is another. I also don't agree with changing your shooting style to accommodate your client, if it wasn't discussed before the contract was signed. If the reason she hired you wasn't your shooting style or the quality of your album design - what was it? My guess is price? Then she wanted you to emulate a photographer that she could not afford (I'm guessing of course). </p>

<p>I agree that the customer should be dealt with kid gloves, but not at the cost of compromising my work style. And I have said this to them. With regard to copying other photographers style - I had a bride that wanted to show me photos of what she wanted that she saw at her friend's wedding, including the way to process it. This was a couple days before the wedding. I said no. Not that bluntly, of course. It's not that I didn't want to please her -- just wanted to give her a reality check. If she wanted another photographer, she should have hired that other photographer. People hired me based on the work that I have done. I'm fully okay with them hiring someone else if they want to be immersed in how the photos are taken. It takes the pressure of trying to be what I'm not off of me.</p>

<p>As far as the album design -- what I told my brides was that I create the design of the album and choose the photos that I feel best tell their story. Once I complete the design, I send it to them in a page flipping web format. At that time, if they would rather replace certain photos with other photos, they have one opportunity to tell me their changes, and I gladly make them and create the final version. No more changes after that. And no changes to the design at all.</p>

<p>I'm not hardened to the needs of the bride and groom. I have offered a free after session to one bride and groom when a tornado ripped through their city on their wedding day. I often offered free engagement sessions to couples when I thought an area was in gorgeous bloom, or I wanted to try out a series of photos that weren't typical. However, I do draw the line at being told that I would need to give them a free session because the trees weren't the color they wanted, or if they didn't plan their day well enough to incorporate all the photos they wanted. By the way -- a preconsult a few days before the wedding, looking at their timeline (which I would have requested), might have given you a heads up on issues you may have to face. Roll with the punches on the day of the wedding - timelines never stick anyway. Do your best on the wedding day - be professional and polite, which I'm sure you were. However, I will not bend over backwards after the fact to ensure they still liked me. I would feel no qualms about saying that I would be happy to accommodate their wish for another session at a stated fee. But no freebies. And heaven forbid - don't get her involved in designing the album, otherwise it will take you three times as long.</p>

<p>Many will disagree with me, I'm sure. </p>

<p>Agree with Marc. My favorite shots are the landscape shots. People pick locations for various reasons, one being the scenic value, and it's not a mistake (in my opinion) to minimize the bride and groom in order to capture all that is around them. Sometimes they want a photo on the wall that memorializes the day, and them, surrounded by the beauty around them. I'm quite sure several close ups were also taken. I do prefer the panoramic created by John. That said, I also like Dieter's shot. Lower ISO and higher f stop would be better. With this shot, you could create a creamier, painterly effect by using a noise reduction action, and maybe an action that incorporates a little Gaussian blur throughout the trees. I have actions at home (I'm currently at work) - maybe I'll play with the image and post later.</p>

<p>Canon 7D - 24-70L</p><div></div>

<p>Sorry - file too large - here we go again.</p>

<p> </p><div></div>

<p>I also don't use a recipe. I do use Topaz software to help me with detail and contrast.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>I shot my last wedding this past weekend - I'm now no longer a photographer-for-pay. Every bride loves this "rock" -- I'm often requested to take a shot here, even if it's only *this* shot. What surprises me is that I don't see many other photographers using this structure for bridal shoots. For this recent wedding, the bride chose another location for their location shoot, but really wanted just five minutes for this photo. The problem was that their limo was a gift and time wouldn't allow for us to take the extra travel time to get this shot. So....we made the transfer at a gas station. The limo driver took the rest of the bridal party back to the reception hall. I carted the bride and groom in my van to this location and then back to the hall. I've always wondered what a long veil would do with the Lake Erie breeze. No critique necessary - just wanted to share.</p>

<p> </p><div></div>

<p>Ah the first wedding. My back up camera for my first wedding was a film camera and about 10 rolls of film which i prayed I would never have to use, but gave me comfort in knowing that if something happened, I would at least have something that could use.</p>

<p>Everyone photographer has a first wedding. Good for you in that you were lucky - as you recognized. It's a scary thing not to have the right back up equipment, or proper lenses -- but I understand how up and coming wedding photographers don't have the cash up front to get it. I would recommend renting...which wasn't something I checked into when I first started out, but would have had greater peace of mind had I done that.</p>

<p>Don't get all full of yourself yet, though, haha. If you get into wedding photography, you'll look at your first wedding (after having shot several more) and realize how naive you were. For example -- no offense -- but I find nothing attractive about the photo you posted. This doesn't mean you will not go on and become great at it -- but you got some ways to go, and understandably so, since you've not done this before. Someday you will have your own survival stories to tell and you'll understand why the seasoned photographers (because you'll be one) are not so forgiving of those who aren't properly prepared for weddings.</p>

<p>Then again, maybe the wedding industry is changing. The bar isn't set so high anymore as price drives many consumers these days. Average and satisfactory are very acceptable to many brides and grooms who don't place a value on photography. Many people are willing to accept what friends can give if it means they get to save a couple, three thousand bucks. Then it becomes a cycle -- because the friend thinks they are really good because their photos didn't suck (too badly)....all of a sudden, they think they can do it again. And they will. They will find a couple that doesn't want to pay a lot of money and aren't educated about good versus bad photography....and so on and so on.</p>

<p>Vail -- thank you for your kind comments...</p>

<p>Mike -- Ah, you're a poet at heart ;-) </p>

<p>I don't say those things to the bride. I talk to them about angles and lines. I will tell the bride to arch her back - elongate her neck - or whatever needs to be done to create a pretty line. Of course, I'll preface it by saying -- you have such a gorgeous neck - I want you to be aware of that - stretch it a little as you tilt your head. I'll provide an example of me tilting my head normally and then tilting it by elongating it a bit. or...you have such beautiful feminine curves -- or you have stunning eyes,. and give examples of ways that I want them to stand with some exagerration in the lines, which may not feel natural to them, but as I'm shooting, I'm telling them how beautiful it looks and how gorgeous she is, and I'll show her a sample. They see that it works and then become all America's next top model on me (smile)</p>

<p>This is why it's not really "of" them but "for" them. During the closeups, I put one or the other in charge of that portion of the shoot. I'll say to the groom, "okay, you're the boss in this segment -- I'm going to shoot for about 60 seconds and i want you to nuzzle up to your bride, express your love by caressing her face, tilting her head toward you, kissing her nose -- whatever you want it to be" Some people are better at it than others, but more often than not, these are better than the shots where I say, "now put your lips against her temple" because there is some movement that is but isn't directed by me.</p>

<p>I would have to say that in 95 percent of the scenic, on location, shots -- are "for" them. It's not possible (for me) to capture an intimate moment or an open soul during this portion. It's only possible (for me) to make it look like one. I would have better luck capturing an intimate moment or a soul baring expression during either the getting ready or reception shots.</p>

<p>Are they paying for the e-session? If so, and they seem like a decent couple, and/or you're hard up for cash, then go for it. If you have a funny feeling in your stomach that this is a precursor to a zilla-type wedding, then turn them down. It will feel good. :-) </p>

<p>I don't get this whole "test drive" thing. Seriously. If they've met with you -- seen your albums -- seen your prior wedding galleries -- what makes them think that you can't do for them what they have seen in the work you've done to date and during your client meeting? I have an ego when it comes to my work. I won't be test driven.</p>

<p>Granted - my thinking is rather jaded since I have only one more wedding left before I'm done with the business of photography (not the art/love/passion of it). </p>