marcie m

<p>WW, an immense thank you for your post. I will have to come back to read it again later in order to digest it all. On my first read, you hit the nail on the head for the reasons of my OP:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>Also I like having a Purchasing Timeline, if the purchases are to be staggered, and that timeline has Priority Purchases, based upon need – hence my first answer (suggesting two lenses, a 35 and a 50) addressed only “</em> <em><strong>location</strong> </em> <em> portraits of children and families<strong>”</strong> </em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>I have a priority list of equipment purchases:</p>

<ul>

<li>Camera body, check!</li>

<li>Two high quality lenses for location portraits</li>

<li>Build a new purchase fund and re-evaluate camera bag. Then set new purchase list.</li>

</ul>

<p><strong>Thanks again!</strong> <em><strong><br /> </strong> </em></p>

<p>William W:<br /> > Did you shoot W&P before?<br /> Yes, however my full time job was working for community newspapers and free-lancing for wire services. It was one of those jobs where you needed a second one to "pay" for it, LOL. I did that by shooting mostly PR and evening events.<br /> <br /> > If so, what was your full rig?<br /> Bodies: FM2, N90, N8008. My newspaper didn't give me an equipment stipend so I never bought the F4. But to be honest, I found it rather heavy. Lenses: 50 f/1.8, 28 f/2.8, 35-105 f/3.5-4.5, a 20mm super fast lens on occasional loan to me and a Tamron 70-300mm with some outrageously slow speed but still gave me the zoom I needed for sports. I had a love hate relationship with my 35-105: I loved how I could go around with <em>just</em> that on the camera if I wanted to travel light while I cursed every low light situation I found myself in with it. Flashes: SB-24, SB-28 and a Metz 45 CL.<br /> <br /> > Do you want to replicate that or are you looking to diversify with style and are looking into a lens cache to suit a transformation?<br /> I'm starting fresh and I'm not shooting news anymore. So no, I'm not looking to replicate. I would prefer to start off with high quality lenses and then add on as I reestablish my shooting. I appreciate your questions and thoughts. Thank you.</p>

<p>Yes, I cracked up over the pin hole answer too. Thanks for the laugh. To answer the Nikon question. I was a full time professional 12 years ago, got a desk job and just kept a regular seasonal shooting gig using that company's equipment. My personal equipment was all film based and now <em>very</em> beat up. I'm starting fresh with Canon because I prefer their digital interface over the Nikon. No commentary on which is better, I am simply more comfortable with how Canon laid their controls out.</p>

<p>Thank you all for the suggestions. Do you think these are my fastest options? I found the f/4s to be rather limiting in my Nikon kit.</p>

<p>My sweet dh bought me a 5D for Christmas. However, it did not come with a lens. Initially, I plan on shooting location portraits of children and families and later on weddings. What do you suggest? I was thinking a portrait prime lens and a wide zoom to start out. Perhaps a Canon EF 100mm f/2 or the EF 85mm f/1.8 and the EF 17-55 f 2.8 IS for my wider angle lens? Also, due to funds, I'm not completely against buying off-brand and getting a Tamron.</p>

<p>I agree with Ray. Excellent start but I believe your prices are too low as well. And music is a pet peeve of mine as well, thank you for not using any. Back to your pricing. Your entry level package for $100 as an example, break it down:</p>

<ul>

<li>It takes you a 1/2 hour each way to pack your gear, get to the location, set up, break down, go home = 1 hr.</li>

<li>You shoot or are on site for 2 hrs</li>

<li>Let's say this was an easy peasy shoot with hardly any photo manipulation necessary. You're not doing anything. Just downloading off the camera, editing out blinks and then uploading to your password protected site. 1 hr.</li>

<li>Phone calls, e-mail correspondence, and sales pitches to the client both leading up to and after the shoot. Let's say they were easy customers. 1 hr.</li>

<li>Then your time burning your CD. 1/2 hr.</li>

<li>Your time delivering the CD. Let's just say it means addressing the envelope, packaging with your release and then walking to your mail box. 1/2 hr.</li>

</ul>

<p>That's 6 hours all together. <$17 per hour. Also, I didn't even touch on the costs of the CD, postage, gas, savings for new computer, equipment, car... So actually, you'd be earning less than that. As Bambi Cantrell said in a workshop I attended, "Is that what it takes to get you out of the bed in the morning?" If your answer is, yes. Then your pricing is okay.</p>

<p>I have <$2500 to spend and an empty (digital) camera bag. I'm switching to Canon because I prefer the user interface and control set up of the digital Canons. I would prefer to use a full frame sensor camera, have a 10 megapixel or higher image. I will be shooting portraits professionally. I will need at least one but preferably two fast lenses. What are my choices?</p>

<p>Mark Anthony, my reason is funds. I would like to spend <$2200 for one body and one or two lenses. Much as I'd like a 5D Mark II, it would not leave me any money for marketing despite my exceptional guerrilla marketing skills ;-). Also, I'm not sure I'll be able to find a 5D Mark 1. My lighting equipment from my film-era career is still serviceable for now. My plan is to use the fees I get for doing portraits (outdoors or on location) to continue building my camera bag and business while I keep my desk job. My purpose for the thread was to have a group discussion on what could work <em>if I had to</em> use my available <em>free</em> space.<br>

(And for all the Negative Nelly's on the forum, my promise to you is I won't be charging weekender below-market rates. I was a pro before and wish to return.)</p>

<p>From my own personal experience: my daughter was given a Barbie digital camera at age 4. Her biggest thrill was simply snapping the photo and seeing the (blurry) image appear on the view screen. Image quality was not of importance. Two and a half years later, after it's been dropped, thrown and kicked, she still plays with it. It is only recently that she has been asking to output any images. Most of those cameras on that level are under $50.</p>

<p>I used to shoot a lot of events - charity balls, political events, a few weddings. I always had my back up with me. But I would stow the big bag with the extra stuff (batteries, extra lenses, gaffers tape, etc.) under the stage if there was a band. Or with the DJ's gear. If those weren't available, I would stow it under one of the food tables behind the skirting.</p>

<p>Chas wrote:</p>

<blockquote>

<p>Marcie, I would not base a business plan on the space you have. You won't really have room to do much beyone a head and shoulders, if you can manage that. Remember you need space between the subject and the background, and between the subject and the lights. And with a gabled ceiling you won't have much room for the lights.<br>

A classic portrait lighting setup is short lighting, in which you have a main light source off to one side of the subject and the fill light directly over the camera. With a 10ft width, you barely have room for the main light on the side, and with a low ceiling your ability to put a softbox or umbrella over the camera will be severely limited.<br>

A tiny space is OK for learning about studio lighting, but won't really be satisfactory when you want to start charging for your work.<br>

If you want to build a business, don't start with studio portraiture, especially not in a tiny space.</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>Chas, let me assure you I'm not basing my entire business plan on setting up in my attic, LOL! My business plan though should be the subject of a different thread. Basically, my question is what sort of portraits <em>can</em> be done in that space? And with what equipment? In the past, I've done shots with my studio lights in tight spaces such as this. They were seriously baffled so as not to blast my subjects.<br>

David, regarding your mention of the tight quarters. It's actually not as tight. The dimensions I posted is for the area that has the full ceiling. The attic is much larger but the ceiling has a sharp slope outside of that 10x10 area.</p>

<p>This is all a dream scenario for a business plan. I plan on buying a Canon. Most likely a used Canon EOS 1DS. Lighting can be a Metz, miscellaneous speedlights, or a 1100 WS Speedotron set up with three heads that have always served well for headshots. (I was a pj for years before shutting down my free-lance career for an office and a regular paycheck. Since my "retirement" I've been a seasonal shooter for larger outfits using their equipment or renting. My own equipment is Nikon, film-based, and very beat up.). I'm leaning toward the 17-55 f/2.8 as the first lens in my new kit.</p>

<p>I'm setting up a small studio. When I say small, I mean small: 10'x10. There is more space than that but it is an attic space with a gabled roof. The 10x10 is really the only photographic working space. In your opinion, this would limit me to headshots, tight close ups and baby photos correct? What lens would you be comfortable shooting with in this sort of space?</p>

<p>I've done this before. However, the events I shot for promotional purposes were always invite only. Those who attended, <em>wanted</em> to be there to support the candidate. All of the people present were tickled pink to be featured in promotional material. Also, I had it set so that it was up to the client to receive permission. If this was an open event to the public, I would try to work it to get either model releases or their contact information. I'm not sure of the legal ramifications about using people attending an open event, but I would want to contact them out of courtesy. At the very minimum, you may want this information to protect your client from bad PR. Imagine the press with an ultra-conservative pro-military candidate being photographed with a known anti-war, anti-military liberal?</p>

I used to work for a newspaper during the dawn of the digital age. I have hundreds of tearsheets. Most of the

tearsheets are tabloid size - too big for most home scanners to do a single page. I thought about taking them to

a print shop to scan, but the sheer quantity makes the task seem cost prohibitive.

 

They're all in copy boxes right now. I welcome your thoughts, perspectives and ideas. I would really like to

reclaim some storage space.

I came across this headline today. I hope this doesn't spread to other cities. I

can't afford insurance like that.

 

Rules pressure shutterbugs in New York City:

http://www.newsday.com/news/local/newyork/ny-nypix315314273jul31,0,4071395.story?coll=ny-nynews-print

I'm coming in a little late on this thread but wanted to offer another possibility. If the bride saw it on another website, could it be that she saw it on one of those wedding planning websites which keeps their banner and advertising on the page but will open your web site inside a frame?

 

Personally, I would be surfing all day and night until I found what the bride was talking about. It would drive me crazy if there was the possibility that someone ripped my photo for their own wedding business.

I love my Lowepro Orion AW. I usually keep the fanny pack with me and use the back pack section to keep a sweater or some other non-necessary item. I usually just use the fanny pack part and keep the backpack in the car trunk. It accommodates the same amount as my Domke shoulder bag.

Doesn't membership in the PPA take care of it? I'm not a member, yet, so I don't know.

I used to use a Metz 45-CL4 instead of the dedicated flash. I was shooting Nikons though. It gave a real wide coverage for when your group morphed from 4 people to group shot of 20. It worked perfectly for deer in headlights photos with near zero available light.

 

Use your 580EX but maybe spend your accessory money on a LumiQuest PocketBouncer and a flash bracket. Or just make a PocketBouncer with some white cardboard and a rubber band. Then, shoot TTL.

 

I must be StoFen impaired because I could never get it to give me the results I wanted.

I'm going through the same thought process myself. I have my old photo business name that I can use but am not sure if I want to switch it to my own name. Also, my dh and I incorporated ourselves under a fun name a few years ago to cover our various small business activities. That being said, you could incorporate Missippi Made Productions.

 

Then with your photo business you can be Mississippi Made Productions d/b/a Melissa Bell Photography (I like your name). You advertise as Melissa Bell Photography and put everything as Melissa Bell Photography. The only time clients will see Mississippi Made Productions is in your contract: Mississippi Made Productions d/b/a Melissa Bell Photography.

 

Not only will you have the benefit of having an incorporated business, you can also make your corporation encompass your other profit-making activities.

There is money to be made. You know the sooner customers can see it the higher the sales. Being able to deliver prints at the event really catches the impulse buyer.

 

We've never printed at the event because I was such a stickler for quality. However I haven't looked into doing it recently. Anyways, you need to consider the cost of having an assistant or two handle printing in addition to the cost of consummables.

You all bring up some excellent points. Thank you! Anne, I've already done that with a few photogs in the area. However, despite feeling really stoked about selling myself at a show or print ad, I'm rather reluctant about trying to do more of that.

 

Amanda, your suggestion about taking a friend out and dressing her up was a real lightbulb moment. D'uh! I can at least get a small "best shot" portfolio doing that.

 

I agree about needing a thick skin. What was a real challenge when I was in business was dealing with prospective wedding clients because they were first time photo buyers. I loved my corporate and editorial clients because they new exactly what they wanted and didn't blink twice when I would ask them to sign a contract, give a deposit, pay an invoice, the whole transaction was easier.

I'm looking to bring my photo business out of cold storage after spending a

while in a non-photo related career and starting a family. I won't have much

money to spend on start up costs since I need to spend most of it on getting a

basic camera set up. What I really need is to know where I can best spend my

advertising dollars? On print/web advertising or by having a booth/table at a

bridal show?

 

For those of you who have done both, what do you think gives the best ROI

(return on investment)?

 

A little background about myself: I was a press photographer for several years

then got a non-photo related job in order to settle and have a family. I've only

shot one wedding (with rented equipment) in the last few years. I'm looking to

convince my clients I'm a competent photographer by using my press and event

photography portfolio.