marcsaint

I think one thing to consider is the degree of difference. Most people could tell the difference between a Monte Zucker album and Cousin Larry's iPhone album. But what if they were comparing a high level amateur with a beginning professional? Maybe that comparison would be closer.

This whole thing cracks me up....

This may be a bit off topic, but I remember a (possibly apocryphal) story of a local wedding photographer who would show the proofs while wearing white gloves. He would show the bride and groom one of the proofs and ask them if they wanted to buy it. If they said no, he would tear the print up and throw it in the trash, then pick up the next print.

 

"Do you want this one?"

 

Don't know how this sales method worked for him.....

<p>Athena, It is a kind and thoughtful gesture to offer to take pictures for someone who otherwise wouldn't be able to afford it. However, not all kind and thoughtful gestures are returned as such. What happens if:<br /> <br />-- ten minutes into the wedding your camera or strobe stops working? <br />-- Grandma trips over your camera bag, falls, and breaks her wrist ? <br />-- your pictures, while perfectly adequate in YOUR eyes, do not meet the bride's (or groom's) mother's expectations? And she is MAD AS HECK. <br />-- your camera bag is stolen at the reception?<br /><br /> All these things have happened (though hopefully not at the same wedding!) to professional photographers who were prepared for these and many other eventualities by way of planning, training, and insurance. This is a mark of professionalism. <br /><br />Question One: were you invited to these weddings BEFORE you offered to shoot them? <br />Question Two: If you were to pull out of shooting these weddings, would you be dis-invited? <br />Question Three: if you were to pull out of shooting these weddings would the bridal couple find a professional photographer and pay him/her to shoot their wedding? <br />Question Four: Would you shoot their wedding as a guest? <br /><br />Honest answers to these questions might be of help deciding how to handle this situation.</p>

I know that by the end of a season, I've just about had it with weddings. I use Winter to recharge my creative battery (and forget...forget...:-)). By the time Spring and Summer come around, I'm ready to face the wedding music again.

With the bridal party coming down the aisle prior to the bride you might have some time to fine tune the exposure on them.

<p>Any of the cameras you mention will take photos good enough for even the most discriminating bride. What I find important is how the camera feels in my hands, how its controls respond, whether I can make it an integral part of my hand/arm/eyes/brain. That means handling each of the ones you are targeting and finding out which one feels best in your hands. A camera that "feels wrong" will just inhibit your creativity and the smoothness of your shooting workflow. No one can tell you which one feels better, you have to try them yourself.<br>

<br />I would also try a couple of other brands to see if the expression of their design philosophy feels better in your hands. For me, the Nikons always felt better better everyone's hands are different.</p>

 

<p>There seems to be a lot of books out about becoming a professional photographer (I know this because I've read a bunch of them, fat lot of good it does me...:-)) and a lot of them will say something like this:<br>

"There are many very talented photographers who go hungry or fail because they lack business sense. And there are a lot of mediocre photographers who enjoy success because they have good business sense."<br>

I think what we're seeing is people with some business sense, who could be selling shoes or refrigerators or real estate, deciding to become wedding photographers because it's glamorous/fun/"easy".</p>

<p>Personally, I like using a DSLR (with bracket, strobe, and battery) because not only does it give me a lot of options to make good shots but the rig separates me from the guests and lets me interact with them on a different level. If I showed up with a camera little or no different than the other guests, it would diminish my authority to pose and direct people (when necessary). Probably just a power trip on my part :-).</p>

<p>If your thing is to use smaller cameras in a discreet manner and you get great shots, more power to you.</p>

<p>The answer is no, a DSLR is not mandatory. Nothing is mandatory to shoot a wedding nowadays. You can use a 110 disposable with Tri-X. You can use an 8x10 Sinar.<br>

All you HAVE to do is not annoy the bride and groom (or their guests) on their wedding day and produce pictures that the bride and groom (or whoever else is paying the bill) will love and not want their money back or hate you forever.</p>

<p>THAT is mandatory.</p>

<p>Thank you very much for all your responses -- you folks are the greatest!<br>

I'm going to re-evaluate my lighting needs for big groups/big rooms and decide how I will handle those situations -- lights on stands, reflectors, etc. I really prefer to travel light and the thought of setting up lightstands with big strobes gives me the willies (people tripping on them, children knocking them over, troubleshooting problems instead of shooting pix, etc). I know some of you do this all the time, and I've done it on occasion, but I really enjoy running and gunning more than setup and teardown.<br>

In the short term I'm going to invest in a battery pack to reduce recycle time and get the maximum power with the strobe I'm using. I'm also going to stop using the i-TTL for formals and switch to MAN flash exposure and either using a flashmeter or chimping the histogram. I'll see how this works out and go from there.<br>

<br />Once again, thank you all for your insightful suggestions.</p>

 

<p>"1. What f stop do you normally use?"<br>

Indoors, f/4.5-5.6 (i.e.nearly wide open); outdoors f/8-f/11 (FWIW)<br>

"2. Are you only using on camera bounced flash? NO off camera flashes?"<br>

90% of the time I use on-camera flash, preferably bounced off ceiling or wall. High ceilings are tough -- recently shot wedding with high ceiling, black walls, black tablecloths, black shirts on groomsmen, and colored spotlights for lighting. Aaaargh! <br>

"3. If you are using off camera flashes, what are they?"<br>

About 10% of the time I'll set up my two SB800s on lightstands and use my on-camera flash to trigger them. Have had mixed results. I work alone so I often have to wait for subjects to position themselves rather than move the lights to get the best effect.</p>

 

<p>Sorry, I should have been more specific....<br>

This is for shooting weddings almost exclusively (hence the posting in this forum). It would be mounted on a bracket and I would be shooting no higher than ISO 800. Thanks again.</p>

<p>I need a more powerful strobe. I'm currently using Nikon SB-800's and I'm just not getting the power/recycle time I want. I'm shooting with a D300 and I'm not ready to get a better camera with higher ISO capabilities -- it works just fine in daylight but interiors with high ceilings are killing me. I would appreciate any suggestions on what strobes you use/like/recommend for more power + faster recycle time than than the SB-800. Thanks!</p>

<p>Shooting engagement session, exposure too light -- corrected -- next exposure too dark -- corrected -- WAY too light -- corrected -- WAY too dark -- What the @##%^?? Had auto-bracketing turned on. DOH!</p>

<p>I've used Lustrecolor and Capri album and been very happy with both.</p>

<p>My main lens is an oldish Nikon 18-70 f/3.5 kit lens that works well, though it did bind up once and had to be fixed. Surprisingly sharp for a kit lens and I suppose I should join the f/2.8 crowd but I just can't come up with the $$$.</p>

<p>Check out <a href="http://www.amazon.com/How-Onsite-Event-Photography-ebook/dp/B004M8S7EC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1320888989&sr=8-2">How To Do Onsite Event Photography</a> by David Whitson. It's got some decent suggestions and the price is right as a Nook or Kindle book but I wouldn't pay the full price for a hard copy.<br /></p>

<p>Albums Inc. is out of business. Other suggestions?</p>

<p>Does anyone have a good source for print folders? Specifically I'm looking for a simple (read "inexpensive") but elegant (read "not cheap-looking") white style that will hold a 4"x6" print for handing out at a Christmas party. Thanks!</p>

<p>So is it the job of the pro photographer to provide the client with what they want ("I only need images on my cellphone to show my friends at work so go ahead and shoot our wedding with your iPhone") or is it to show them something wonderful that makes them want it ("I must have that 20"x24" print -- how much do you want?"). With today's current low standards, the former is much easier but it just serves to help the industry on its way down the death spiral. The latter is harder because you have to create something wonderful, something to get the client's juices flowing, to get them to lust after your product.<br>

I have to say, this has been one of the best discussions I've seen yet on this forum. And nobody has compared anybody to Hitler......yet.....:-)</p>

<p>If the type, quality, or level of camera doesn't matter then why don't we all just start shooting weddings with $5 disposables? Or $69 5 MP p&s cameras from CVS? It does matter because pro photographers need to have consistent control over specific variables (exposure, focus, shutter speed, etc) in order to effectively express feelings and emotions through their photographs. If a photographer wants to limit them self to an iPhone camera's capabilities for the sake of expediency and being a cool tech geek, then that's fine. But nothing beats the image of a bride and groom through a 70-200 f/2.8 shot wide open with beautiful background bokeh. Or a glorious church interior shot with a superwide.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Let the race to the bottom begin.....<br>

Just how little can we give our clients and still charge a reasonable amount to put food on the table?</p>

<p>I think that most (but not all) professional photographers love being able to operate a piece of equipment -- a DSLR -- that can capture a super-high-quality image that could be used on a Facebook page or a billboard. But needs and tastes change. Maybe people are happy with the tiny low resolution image on their cellphone and the pictures they see on Facebook, but I'm not. It is partially a failure of the professional photographic community to educate our clientele about the enjoyment to be found in high quality images. It is also partially a triumph of technology that a cellphone camera can be sufficiently capable of producing a salable wedding product -- albums, small prints, and digital files.<br>

One question I would have is if a client wants wedding pictures just for Facebook -- say, 400x600 ppi -- and wanted all the picture files, if you gave them 400x600 ppi files would they be happy? After all, it's what they wanted....</p>

<p>I have to echo Cliff in that when I come home feeling my pictures are going to be awful and boy, are they going to be mad at me, the pictures end up looking just fine. The opposite can also be true, feeling like you shot the best wedding of your life only to find the pictures average or worse. Maybe shooting film -- and having to wait a week before you saw the pictures -- had some advantages......</p>