dennis_keizer

Well I checked out P.net for the first time in eight months. Had a look at the POW and saw the same old juvenile antics by the same

people. Looks like nothing has changed. I'll keep watching this thread but I won't hold my breath. There are a lot of good ideas buried

and forgotten in this thread. See you all in another few months. DK.

Well it appears that someone really did not like my suggestions in this thread. They went through the trouble of creating names to rate all my photos with 9's and 10's and immediatly posting comments accusing me of rating my own photos. You can view it here. http://www.photo.net/photo/286635 . Maybe the Top-Member Page is not such a great idea after all. I think my suggestions would have eliminated this problem. I don't need to contribute my own photos for any kind of compitition. I shared them to learn how to improve them. I will no longer rate or critique any photos here and I have deleted all my photos except the POW and I won't upload any more as long as this stupid rating system is in place. To the friends I have made here over the past few months It was a pleasure to help and learn from each other. Good-bye all and keep shooting.

The misuse of the rating system is the ONLY problem. The misuse by very little few abusers is the only problem we have here prople. KEEP THE TOP MEMBER PAGE THE WAY IT IS. You cant put a carrot up there and not expect unscrupulous individuals to abuse it. Top Member page is not a problem so lets keep it. I won't ever get up there anyway but legitimate users do like it, use it, and don't abuse it. Let's just solve that one problem without taking anything away from the site and by ENCOURAGING participation and not DISCOURAGING participation by charging for subs. I would like to add that I think an email verification before allowing members to just create multiple new names at will, is a good idea also. This cost nothing and hurts no one as well. We legitimate members don't have to give up ANYTHING to solve this problem. Please read this carefully!!! It will only effect the ratings abuse without in any way penalizing legitimate comtributing members. READ READ READ. This IS the answer.

 

Reposted from another thread.

 

Hello all. I started a thread on this subject last week. Though it had many responses, I think it was too political to make the permanent archives. Some of the individuals mentioned above have rated some of my photos as well. Some of them quite favorably, some not. The problem: It is too easy for people to make multiple names. The 1/1 raters and the people who create multiple names to rate their own photos 10/10 as well as having friends and family members rating their photos are what is destroying the integrity if the ratings system. Among some possible solutions that were suggested was to charge for a subscription. This might work but would discourage participation. I thought my suggestion was better. Here it is again. IN ORDER TO RATE PHOTOS ON THIS SITE THE MEMBER MUST FIRST HAVE A MINIMUM OF FIVE (5) UPLOADS OF HIS OWN AND THREE (3) OF THEM MUST HAVE BEEN RATED BY MORE THEN TEN (10) MEMBERS

If members don't meet this criteria they would still be able to comment on all the photos they want, and use all the other features in the rest of the site. This also encourages two-way participation as well as making it more difficult to create bogus names. It would not be difficult to incorporate this simple code into the server. For the people that are legitimate contributing members that "choose" not to upload their own photos, this will in no way exclude you from participating as that is not my intent. I believe that most of these people (the legitimate CONTRIBUTING members who don't have any uploads), not the phoneys, are NOT interested in ratings anyway, but more interested in sharing constuctive critique. Am I right? If they feel they have to rate photos as well as critique them then let them upload some of their own work. TWO WAY PARTICIPATION! This is really the way by which we all improve, by sharing thoughts and photos, not by trying to climb some meaningless ladder. I hope photo.net is listening and considers my suggestion. The alternative is to scrap ratings all together. I would bet that my suggestion as well as the email verification will solve the problem and stop 99.9% of the nonsense. Email verification by itself is not going to work. The real screwballs can create as many hotmail accounts as they like. The verification only slows the process down a little for them. I have has the same hotmail account for seven years but there is nothing to stop people from using multiple personalities is they so desire.

 

-- Dennis Keizer, August 04, 2001; 02:38 P.M. Eastern

 

 

 

 

Ok flame away, but I think this is the best answer and suggestion given to date toward solving the problem without giving up any of the wonderful features of this site that makes it the best of it's kind on the net. That is all for now. Whew. sorry no time for spellcheck.

"I don't understand your comment about your mother. If she can write a good critique, she can write a good critique. My mother is a wilful dunce when it comes to photography, but she has a fine sense of composition, and on that I take her advice seriously. That's not a trivial point. Any comment worth caring about will contain within itself the clues you need to judge its relevance and significance"

 

 

There is an old saying; Those that can do. Those that can't teach. :)

 

Sorry if you can't understand my pount as I explainrd earlier. I don't know how to make it any more clear. Nothing personal, but my point is simply two way participation. Cheers.

Struan Gray wrote:

"I too have no images on photo.net. I don't have a scanner (or a budget) which gives me a digitised quality that I feel represents my photography as My Photography. I do insert images into threads where I feel they illustrate a point, and I do participate in other forums where people are more willing to make allowances for cheap scans.

 

Even if all that were not true, I prefer to keep my images on my server.

 

 

Those of you who want critiques only from a narrow subset of the world are in danger of shooting yourself in the foot."

 

Straun, Your comments sound a bit elitist to me. Having those who wish to rate other's work be required to have some of their own posted makes perfect sense. Every person that leaves a comment on one of my photos gets an email response and a "thank you" from me. It's common courtesy for one thing. Also in order for me to better understand their comments it is usefull for me to have a look at their folders to see what thier "style" is. This helps lend creedence to their point of view. Photo.net is a two-way street. Your way is like playing a baseball game where you are always at bat and never have to take the field. You also say that..."Writing a good photographic critique is an art all of its own, and is an entirely seperate skill from taking photographs." True. My mother could write a good critique but if she cant take a decent photograph herself then what is it worth? Don't get me wrong, I encourage comments and ratings on all my photos from everyone wheather they have posted their own or not. I just consider comments from those who have taken the time to "share" their own work more seriously. I hope you share some of your photos with us someday.

 

regards,

Reposted from another thread.

 

 

Hello all. I started a thread on this subject last week. Though it had many responses, I think it was too political to make the permanent archives. Some of the individuals mentioned above have rated some of my photos as well. Some of them quite favorably, some not. The problem: It is too easy for people to make multiple names. The 1/1 raters and the people who create multiple names to rate their own photos 10/10 as well as having friends and family members rating their photos are what is destroying the integrity if the ratings system. Among some possible solutions that were suggested was to charge for a subscription. This might work but would discourage participation. I thought my suggestion was better. Here it is again.

 

In order to rate photos, one must have at least 5 (five) uploads AND at least 3 (three) of them rated by more then ten members.

 

If they don't meet this criteria they would still be able to comment and use the rest of the site. This also encourages two -way participation as well as making it more difficult to create bogus names.

It would not be difficult to incorporate this simple code in the server.

I hope photo.net is listening and considers my suggestion. The alternative is to scrap ratings all together because as it is now, they are meaningless. There is too much abuse.