'BFF'

Today (or at least one night), well-lubricated, and feeling no pain, these two

young men are 'BFF' [best Friends Forever], and we'll only know tomorrow or

in a few years if that's true or not. Photo taken in the middle of the evening

near a Metro entrance. Your ratings, critiques and observations are invited

and most welcome. If you rate harshly, very critically, or wish to make a

remark, please submit a helpful and constructive comment; please share your

photographic knowledge to help improve my photography. Thanks! Enjoy!

john

You have long ago exhausted these sorts of photos of Kiev (and anywhere), people, Metro etc. This photo is like a dinosaur; "seen one, seen them all" and there is "nothing new under the sun".  You are "stuck in a groove" -like I have been.You have said many times that your photos are timeless and could be taken anywhere. I consider that a negative. Photo.net is mostly for hobbyists and it is fun to post non stop photos, albeit all alike and the problem is if one does not  post something 'new' and groundbreaking one does not post period.  For something serious I think you ought to move on to unbroken ground find a project little explored if you can find it....? Kiev brothels, prostitution on the street, bar room scenes, families in their flats would be changes, Ukraine county side I once suggested. These are difficult, require courage. Really getting into people's lives. Street is the more easy so we do 'street'.  I hardly ever rate but giving this a 3 for the reason: done a million times. I expect you will counter my suggestions as always; nevertheless,  but done in good faith.  I may write more on email where we get along a little better.

I find the 'street' endlessly challenging; if you find them 'reptitious' then so be it.  I don't, but then maybe my viewers do.  They'll be sure to let me know.

This sort of photography suits my ability to get out periodically 'at hoc' when I am feeling good without advance notice and to leave without schedule . . . .

Plus, I am at the epitome of developing my 'people skills'.

Someone recently said to me, on viewing my photos (to my surprise), 'you must have some great charm' to get so close to people, and to my surprise, I realized that in my own (inimitable and irascible) way, I did have some sort of really amazing tricks and ways to establish rapport, and they just now are being developed to their fullest.

It would be a shame now to waste them, plus my Photoshop skills now are just beginning to be rudimentary after a decade of being inadequate.

You have judged this photo based on 'other works' of mine, rather than on its own merit?

I'm surprised.  What about this photo?

The casual rapport between these two young men?  Their camaraderie? How often do you see that, let alone see it captured?  I find it worthwhile to make such captures.  You may find it surplusage; I don't, but I take your critique in good faith and helpful, and you needn't explain further. 

I know you mean well and take your meaning in good faith.

I'd like access to 'brothels' and other places, but I'm 'street trained' and 'bred' . . . . and unlike the great photo taken that won an award for European Press Photo (I think) of Ukrainian police interrogation (mock execution of prisoner), I just don't keep such company, and if I took such a photo, I'd have to high tail it out of the country and not return as taking 'journalism' type of photos can get one in hot water and make one self unwelcome.

I LIKE the Ukrainian people and feel safe among them; most would rather have a US or Western Europe citizenship or residency and respect westerners, even if they don't say so, somewhat unlike Russians, who may envy Westerners but can resent them at the same time or be openly hostile, depending on whose company one keeps.

So, it's a friendly environment, IF ONE DOES NOT ENGAGE IN POLITICALLY disturbing photography . . . . but then my journalism days are over, long over.

I'm a documentarian now of people, and enjoy it thoroughly.

(I also shoot other things you do not see because I do not post, so it may be that you're critique inadvertently is slightly off the mark . . . . . based as it is on 'what I post' rather than the totality of what I take)

;~))

john

John (Crosley)

Thank you so much for your comment.

If the ratings lag on this one, I never expected high ratings due to the lighting conditions; raters seldom discount unusual or difficult lighting.

Also, Meir S. gave this a '3' because it was too "JOHN CROSLEY", which I find interesting, as I consider it pretty good, even if he finds it 'usual'.

I don't.

To me, each 'street' photo I take is 'unusual' or they wouldn't be posted.

Together, they form a 'body of work'.

There are other 'bodies of work' as well, of which Meir is unaware because not posted.  Little does he know.

;~))

john

John (Crosley)

I guess you'd have to have discounted almost all of Brassai's lifetime work after he established a style, on account of he kept repeating himself.  Only the buildings and streets changed; the style and the city did not.

;~))

john

John (Crosley)

Don't guess. His photos touch my heat strings. What more is there?

'Heat Strings?'

Is that a way avoiding saying whether you have a 'heart'?

;~))

Look at my next photo - the old woman.

That touches my 'heart strings', and I do have a heart.

She got to touch it when I hugged her after taking her portrait.

She actually felt it.

I don't do that almost ever, but she deserved it; it's never the same with me -- no formula.

Whether my photos are 'usual' in your mind, there's something different in almost every one for me that makes most of them special.

And in a few cases where I just don't care so much about a photo I've posted, somehow viewers have latched onto that photo and 'made it their own' rewarding that photo with high rates and/or high views - in ways that sometimes make a mockery of my own personal judgment.

That's why I keep posting things that you may see as being 'usual' or 'not so different'.

Remember my photo of the man's sandals and the woman's spangly shoes and my posted question, 'what did viewers see in the photo' that made the photo my highest viewed in this folder with over 10,000 views (now approaching 11,000 views)?

That photo's 'success' (if that is 'success) still surprises me, as I consider it 'different' but not all that wonderful to be a portfolio view leader.

I posted a photo here early on in my career of students at UC Berekley sitting in on the UC Chanceller's lawn, some holding balloons framed by a National Guardsman with gas mask and rifle with fixed bayonet and on this service was rewarded with a HUGE number of views -- over 100,000 'views' under the old and new system, but the same photo on FLICKR barely draws a yawn. 

Go figure.

At the same time, one of my very, very best 'street' photos posted there (FLICKR.COM) leads the pack in serious views attesting to the serious taste of those few who have come for a look (pony being led up subway steps framed by woman's crooked arm, outstretched feeling for rain.)

(Other photos there got higher views, but they were 'portal photos' which were used by search engines to give others entrance to my FLICKR.com photos, so 'views' for those photos are meaningless, I think.)

If I do exhibit, which I hope some day I can afford and can find a gallery/museum venue that is agreeable, PN and FLICKR.com are my giant testing grounds where I have been able to determine what is viewworthy among those somewhat interested and somewhat trained in the craft (and art) of photography.

That doesn't mean anything of course in terms of sales; that's made by enthusiastic gallery owners and the CEOS and hedge fund managers who buy them.

Kyiv has a wonderful gallery, the Pinchuk gallery, privately owned, but open to the public that features all kinds of art, and the owner (billionaire or former billionaire Pinchuk) is heavily invested in the art of Damien Hirst, which means he could care less about the street photos of John Crosley -- too bad for them.

In some ways, I think maybe the whole museum thing is a way to promote the proprietor's Hirst monetary aspirations -- there are megamilllions involved, plus 'standing' in the Kyiv community, with crowds in front of the museum every day.

Pinchuk once was one of Ukraine's richest men, and may still be, but his wealth took a huge hit not so long ago.  He recently was estimated to be worth 3.83 billion USD and was involved in a London Court suit about assets he claimed were held in an 'oral trust' for him that others he claimed breached, according to an Internet search.  I did not follow up.

Too Byzantine for me; the wealthy have their money; I have my photos and my own interests.

They have their control of coal and metals, and I have my shutter to release and the people of Ukraine are all around with their little dramas unfolding minute by minute, just waiting for me to capture them and their fleeting expressions.

Which I happily do, not just in Kyiv, but also now in Seattle, LA and anywhere else.

It's my raison d'etre.

john

John (Crosley)

yes "heat not "heat"

Do you want to rethink that?

;~))

john

John (Crosley)

Excellent image, John - incredible how you caught that essence of their mood and emotions - a bit drunk and having fun, that "russian little secret". And it perfectly communicates the story - goes to my favorites!

yes heart not heat. bad eyes.

'That Russian Little Secret' you remarked on is interesting to me.

All my other captures were too blurry or had such bad and mixed light they were unusable, but this one 'shone' though and was 'good enough' to convey the essence of their relationship.

In one, the man, left, kissed his friend, the man from St. Petersburg, right.

I wonder how Mr. Putin would have viewed that relationship -- mere friendship, or an attack on traditional Russian cultural values.

While Ukrainians are strongly anti-Gay for the most part, I have run across groups of young people who tell me quite openly that this friend is 'gay' and think little of it.  It's the old Easter/Russian mentality vs. the Western and modern mentality that is taking hold, and for the enlightened ones, there is some hope.

I am not sure either is gay, or they are just good friends; as the kiss did not seem totally reciprocated, or all that lovey-dovey. 

But in Putin's Russia, the['d probably end up in somewhere in a gulag, perhaps?

Who knows for sure.  I don't judge, except do they make good photo material, and are they good guys for the while I'm around them, (and they were).

You hit on it with the words 'Russian secret'.  How interesting.

Did you know of see something, or was it just another, different use of the term that you did not expect?

Thanks for a helpful comment.

john

John (Crosley)

Interesting double portrait!

When the evening gets along on a weekend night and the alcohol is consumed, young people come out when it's not too cold and get together.

If I'm in Ukraine at the time (sometimes I'm in the US for extended periods), and happen to be available, I'm game; I'll be drawn easily into their camaraderie, which since you know me and how I look, and I'm considerably older than you, should be almost astonishing.

Alone, they'd probably shun me, but with a camera and on seeing just one capture and judging my skills, they're primed for more, and tell everyone around the same (or those around see the attention such people give me and make a reasonable assumption about the worth of what it is I'm doing and don't sleight me from there on out, so I get 'respect' or in the US vernacular (street cred) [street credibility].

Good 'street cred' is invaluable in getting captures like this, and when there's a half century (almost) age differential, and I have no prior knowledge of such folks and expect never to see them again, that I can gain almost instant 'street cred'' amazes me even now, yet as the days go by, it gets easier and easier, as I josh, banter, joke, insult sometimes and enter into verbal sparring with the folks on the street just as though I belong, and soon enough I DO BELONG.

They can't help it.

Then I sometimes take my best photos.

At the very least I have opportunities that do not occur to most photographers who are not of the same or similar age cohort -- somehow I'm 'accepted', a skill I work (or play) hard at.

Thanks for the kind remark, Svetlana; I was just browsing some of your recent (stunning) work.  

Well done.

john

John (Crosley)

They speak English? I'm surprised.

But there are a few expressions that are universal, like F*** your sister, or mother, or some such, that most youths who watch movies will get, and when said appropriately, they can have enormous shock value with certain youths who are least expecting it from a guy like me, as well as certain finger gestures, just as I'm trying to get a certain expression for their likeness, and they're holding back.

They look at the lens, and don't expect they'll see from this old far a finger gesture that ordinarily is considered the rudest, but also can mean great fun among friends or friendlies, and it often breaks them up.  It's a great ice breaker and says to many (choose your audience well) 'he's one of us', as many youths use these finger gestures among themselves, just as blacks call themselves among themselves 'Niggers', but forbid the slightest use of the word by a white person, especially not one from the 'Hood' who didn't grow up with them and share the 'Hood' experience just as a ghetto guy.

I can shock, and the shock value is just part of my grab bag of little tricks and devices; it's a small part, but it can loosen things up.  It's not for everyone and not necessarily used for these guys (I don't recall), but not so long ago (relatively speaking) a guy called my name from half a city block away and got a rude finger gesture in return and was all smiles!

It was camaraderie.

Male camaraderie on a very simple lever, and his acceptance of that gesture (even his calling me by my first name (few know my last), was already acceptance, plus he said it with a smile.  The rude finger gesture was made with a scowl that rapidly turned to a big grin!

But that's a very small part, and describes just one little teensy part of the complex interplay that goes on -- each person being chosen for special treatment.  What one person revels in, another would take as fighting gestures or words.

One has to 'size up' one's recipient's behavior.

Sometimes one has to be courtly, or at first at least, and in a few minutes they can be 'old chums' if they're accepting.  Sometimes, I'm given the finger, and shunned.

It goes with the territory, and I take little offense at it.  What I do is intrusive, and people have the right to take offense, IF they choose to; though I keep working to minimize that number and gain the number of acceptable photos, and I'm making excellent headway.

As you've been seeing, I've been culling through some 12-24 mm close-up portraits taken of strangers that required I get extremely close to perfect strangers I met moments before -- sometimes within a few inches of their eyeballs or at most minimum focusing distance (and regretting that there is a minimum focusing distance, and worse, at night the minimum focusing distance does not adjust for stop down distance from having a smaller aperture when the light is strong (causing a smaller aperture and I think causing the minimum focusing distance to shorten).  (I have to test that out, but I'm not too interested in 'lab tests' as i'm a 'real life' shooter, and not so interested in what works in theory but what works when I get close to a subject and/or try to frame a photo then see if the camera will fire (this particular camera won't fire if minimum focusing distance is less than the actual distance). 

 As you can see, this is both a big challenge and a big delight.

Hopefullly, not only for me, but for my subjects.

And I hope it shows in their faces.

For that's the goal.

To bring out their true expressions -- the ones they do not bring out for ordinary photographers.

I feed on the 'interesting expressions' and make it known, and it gives my subjects license to be 'interesting'.

That allows them to be themselves and a little looney if they're so inclined and maybe sometimes (as here) a little 'lubricated'.

It's fun out on the street when such things merge into a happy capture.

I took about five or six captures, and all but one were so bad with bad lighting and bad focus they were not acceptable; but this one just made the cut, and I like it, technical problems included.

It's a keeper, just barely so, but a keeper.

Just for the expression alone -- the casualness of the pair captured (for all time).

john

John (Crosley)