Old City, Kashgar

John, I almost posted your comment from last week about the monocular nature of Marc's image as a valid assessment of this one. That was very well spotted. Best, JJ

Sorry, I forgot to say that people mentioning where the alley goes but not the stream does point to a difference. One image is of a human environment, one isn't. That's why I think there was a difference. Best, JJ

Again, I disagree. A photographer can approach a scene like this any way he wants. Had this been approached like a photo shoot (it was the shooting of a photo, by the way) and done well, it could have been every bit as good a photo.

I also disagree with your pejorative use of "contrived." I "contrive" many of my photos. I often look for contrived situations to balance some sense of artificiality and theatrics in order to portray something genuine. Think of the most contrived stage whisper on a stage. One almost has to see that whisper as contrived in order for it to work, especially in a comedy. Sure, when something is too contrived, or badly contrived, or awkwardly contrived, it might be a bust. But to rule contrivance out is to limit one's palette. Photography/art, to a great extent, is a matter of contrivance. Often, being aware of that will put meu in touch with what I'm actually doing.

I'm not so convinced this was a chance encounter. It wouldn't matter to me much (except as a fellow photographer interested in others' processes). I would still see it the way I see it, which is that there's a tension back and forth between it feeling posed and feeling chance. That's one of the main draws for me.

Having read Cartier Bresson (a bit), I'm sure he would disagree with you on how quick one had to be in such a situation. Maybe the photographer saw the man coming from way down the alleyway, foresaw a good shot and waited for the decisive moment. Patience can be as much a virtue as intuition.

Yes, Stieglitz. Good catch.

John, I agree (re: art vs. reportage). I don't this this categorization has much substance. I brought it up only because it seemed important to someone; maybe Alex will respond. However, there is another issue of categorization (photography vs. digital art) that I still think has merit, but we've pretty much beaten it to death and I really don't want to try mouth-to-mouth on it. I'll just let it lie in a heap and silently shed a tear. [Yes, I'm being overly dramatic here, all in good nature.]

Sorry Fred, but I am not writing about how you do things, but how I see this image--and I didn't say that good results are limited to only one approach. A photographer can approach any subject as he or she pleases but that doesn't mean the approach will be accepted by the subject and my experience with chance encounters--my assumption here--is that they are just different than planned shoots generally--thought that was clear. Contrived can be good if that is the goal, would suck in this image IMO, which was my point.

Right, John. I know. And I am suggestion that there are other ways to see this image than yours. It's a dialogue.

That's a pretty strong statement and leaves out many other approaches. What I'm saying is not that you have to but that you CAN approach this as a photo shoot if you want and get great results. It's been done!

Sorry, this is what I said "In these situations-generally-you can't approach them like a photo shoot"

"generally" is a pretty strong and operative word here--no? Kind of key to have been left out here don't you think?...

Fred, no need for me to say anything much re authenticity, John just said it. It looks as if it supposed to be unstaged but it reads as staged. This is not genuine and therefore, not authentic. Just IMO, of course. JJ

Hi!

First of all, thanks for giving me the oportunity to know what people REALLY thinks about my work. That´s the most important thing of seen my photo as POW: your opinions.
I must say that this one is not the photo that makes me feel proud, but I like it in the context of the serie. However it is giving different and enriching reflections. At least for me.
As Anders perfectly explained the photo is taken in a narrow street of the Old City, in Kashgar. Normally, in places like this, people is tyred of been photographied, so... answering to those that say that the man is posing (it really doesn´t matter in my opinion), it is not a posed photo. The man was there, speaking with two women on the right that we can´t see on this photo. I think that he was not sure if he was appearing on my photo or not, so that´s the reason surely of his indefinable facial expression. I feel it natural... I don´t know if it is the general opinion.

For those who wanted to see it in a bigger size:
http://img849.imageshack.us/img849/9057/oldcityman.jpg
I feel necessary to see it (all the serie of China) with a black or may be a neutral background. That´s one of the things I don´t like here in PN. A neutral background would make our photos work better IMO.

My english is not as good as I would like, so I can´t give my opinion to all your points, I´d love to!! I´ll try my best to understand what you (all of you) have to say about my work (negative critiques too!), and more general reflections. I´m a photographic child, so this is the best way to learn, with sincere and honest comments of my work observers. I specially like the privilege of having the oportunity of trying to understand what I do unconsciously.

All my gratefulness for your involvement.

I will answer any question, if I´m able to understand it!

Best wishes,
iker

A link would be better:
http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/9057/oldcityman.jpg

Capturing the moment in a situation where the composition is also "right" is the essence of shots like this. I feel neither is achieved here, and the image certainly doesn't justify the sustained, laboriously detailed analyses I read from other correspondents trying to pinpoint its qualities. If it worked, it would be obvious. For me this is no better than would be achieved casually snapping a relative on holiday, posed amongst architecture that appealed to me. A nice record of a visit and nothing more.

My first look at this picture did not show me much interest in it: the color, the tone, the composition and the man standing there. It fails to make me "wonder how it was done or what kind of brilliant, creative mind was behind the camera".
My second look leads to wondering for what reason it is chosen by Photo of the Week. There must be some reason behind it. Then I tried to answer some of the questions:
Does the man say "China" to me?
No. The dress of the man is not a typical Chinese style, especially that white cap, though I have travelled in China quit a few times recently from south to north, east and west.
Does the muted colors say "China" to me?
Maybe. But not for China today, it could say something of old China. In my impression, those old pictures from the last century had this effect: aged and worn out by nature. It could be that I am an outsider: China looks to me it's always busy and crowded everywhere. This could be an exception: one man standing alone in a quiet gloomy lane.
Does the stone textures say something about "China"?
Not sure. The street and wall could remind me anywhere in Asia, Middle East, or Europe, though quite certain, not common in North Amreica. Even the photo is taken in China, it's vague to tell China, at least to me, unlike the Great Wall does.
IMO, it does tell me it is an "Old City" by the its color, but it is not the city that we known of for China. Without the caption "China", nothing relates us to that country.

I disagree that this is in any way "documentary" or "photojournalism" - it is art. "street" can be posed like this one, or candid. the point here is that the subject is comfortable in his skin, and comfortable in his environment. thats why it works.

would I compose it this way? yes and no. I would indeed have him well off center; I would also have him allow for the far background to be framed by him. I would only crop it tighter with a bit less of the far left. prior to that composition I would at least check out a crop that puts him more on the diagonal - then decide between the two.

toning and exposure are spot on. not a fan of borders like this, but that may be decision of photo.net and not the artist. regardless, great job.

I have attached a similar concept but composition "on the diagonal"
jim

This would be art if there were some sort of epiphany came out of this. There is none. What we do have is a glimpse of a world that is unfamiliar to most people.

We get a glimpse of the environment and one of the natives. It is is nicely done. But we do not get anything beyond that. Nor do we have any cause to demand it. This, again is reportage. It is documentary work, in the best sense of the word.

Zorionak, Iker. Oso gutxitan izaten da sari bat hain merezia. Txinan egin dozun lana izugarri ona da. Gustu ona ta oreka oinarri dituen ibilbide baten kulminazioa. Hala ikusten dot nik.

I like the following two photos in the China series better than this POW
http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=13164772
http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=13143674

I like the tone and atmosphere.  But my eye keeps pulling  to the left where the door is.  What am I suppose to see there?  I think the walls pull the eye also to the back where he isn't located.  It would have been better for me if he was more in line of the alley to allow the walls to work.  Also looking out of the picture doesn't work for me.  It just creates this huge amount of empty space on the left serving no purpose.  Alan

I like the tones and atmosphere. But my eye keeps shooting over to the door on the left where there is...??? The walls draw my eye not to him but to the back of the alley where there is...?? I think it would be better if he was over a little to the left where the walls would draw my eye to him. He's the interesting part of this photo. Then I can explore around a little if I want too. He's also looking out of the picture so it seems we have all this wasted space on the left.

The composition is really rather lovely. There is a feeling of timelessness here. This could have been snapped up thirty or forty years ago and everything would have been just the same. The depth of field is a testament to the photographer's understanding of what makes a portrait special.

whether dusk or dawn, the attitude of the photograph strikes me: mysteriously serene. the man in passage, or the passage that surrounds the man.

While I love your photo and find it fascinating, I believe by having it named China limits my personal perception of the photograph.  To me it doesn't scream China, rather many an old city in Europe.  I realize the photograph is in China I tend to have a free flowing mind that can take me places you would never dream your wonderful photograph would.  I intensely dislike music videos for much the same reason, they place a vision, not my own in my head and once there I find it difficult to get out.  Hope this makes sense and has merely to do with the titling of the photograph, not the photograph its self.  I would be proud to produce such an image and that's one reason why I continue to shoot.

Phillip Chancey

This doesn't do anything for me personally, and I don't like these heavily toned and tinted images at all. This actually makes me want to stop looking at it because the treatment so overwhelms the subject and the actual photograph. Create interest with the subject and the light and colors, not in the alteration. I saw many stronger images in his China folder, but the heavy tinting and toning of all of them left me feeling queasy to be honest.

This picture and the others in the gallery scream China. My son is a Chinese (Mandarin) language scholar and has brought home thousands of images from China. This shot is squarely in the wheelhouse. If it were my photo I might change the selective color/sepia selections, but that is a matter of personal taste. The image, as produced, is arresting.

Keith said:

I have to agree. Take away all the heavy Photoshop and present the image naturally and it's a fine but pedestrian image (no pun intended), though to me the composition is very unsettling. There's nowhere to rest and he's essentially leaving the frame. Most of the compo is antagonistic. And yes, this is a critique site but the level of analysis here seems a bit absurd to be honest.