Reflected Features

At 1st I thought this was for the STC : Girl Disappearing. Definitely mind grabbing moment, her mouth opening, with a almost striking expression, as if seeing something terrible & horrific. Timely capture, Pnina.

Very interesting to read the biographical information you've provided about yourself. It gives me many insights into how you think artistically and helps me understand the general influence painting has on your work. What you've said doesn't really change or affect how I look at this particular photo. I still see what I saw when I first looked and there is so much to see. I like coming back to it.

I did not want to influence your seeing, but let you and others from the CG( if they will show up...) to understand my line of thinking, I think that some details like these are like a "self portrait" of the mind.... ;-))

Alberto, thanks

 

Amal, as usual, very supportive in your wording!

 

Cherlyn, It is a good idea for the STC, I realy did not think of it, until you wrote it... I will find something els.

Pnina, yes, I think it's very important and helpful to provide as much background information as possible so that we get to know each other and can better understand where we are coming from in our photography and our life paths. It was wonderful to hear more of your story.

 

I am sensing that you might not be happy with the responses you've gotten. Frankly, for the most part, I am not finding the depth of discussion on this image that I was hoping for. I think it deserves more consideration. That's why I asked for others' opinions on the trouble I was having putting the ZED into the right context. I was hoping to stimulate more specific dialogue.

 

I wonder if you might have considered saying more in your opening statement that would have stimulated and/or guided more discussion. Perhaps talking about what issues you were working on, what your own hopes for this photo were. Did you, yourself, have any uncertainties about it? Have you done other reflection photos to compare it to? Are reflection photos a direction you have or want to explore? Is it a first? How does it fit into your body of work, etc?

Maybe my mistake was that I did not ask in the begining if the CG see the connection to Munch's work.( I did not ask it as I wanted to know if it will come up by itself, also I don't know if every body of the CG is familiare with Munch work, so I gave the reference..)and here is some more

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edvard_Munch

 

I see the ZED as a fact of life, as something that we have not any control of, as many things in life that we have no comand on. The ZED as an end( also alphabetical) of the scream ? as it has around it a flower shape as a decoration,?is it for beauty or Joy? is it for other purposes that the scream was meant for( like death,sickness, despair?)?, Gordon thought as it is written upside down that it was meant for the people inside, I have no answer for that, that is the mystery, what is it?, For me this work is a life scene that is a ridle Like Munch's "scream" that is a general one, for human suffering...

 

reflections are part of reality that were removed from its natural space to another location and became part of another "reality" combined of two sources. what does it means?. My work touches many aspects of human life, Fred, this one is for me part of human life.A part of my line of thought and creation.

 

 

 

Pnina,I try not to read prior comments because I prefer not to be influenced. I see so much depth to this image, both figuratively and literally, that I find that I have to view it in layers, try to comprehend each layer, then try to put it together (as in Photoshop). The deepest layer is clearly the center of interest, and one can only guess at the out-of-focus woman's expression - astonishment? Surprise? Horror? I'm unsure as to what else is in the deep layer, presumably contents of a room but very poorly seen and only to be guessed at. I see the next layer as the patterns and symbols on the glass, and again guesswork. The main ZED symbol has a mystic quality, and the surrounding snowflake-like objects are vaguely reminiscent of the Star of David (or am I saying that because I think you're Israeli?) The final layer is the reflection of what is behind me - a brick wall, a door I think, and possibly windows. A checkered pattern on the left which looks like a garment, but who knows? And other mysterious things. So, how does this fit together? As many interpretations as my moods. No ready answer, and the kind of image to which I'll have to return many times. Brilliant! Oh, and lovely color, by the way.

This really is quite mysterious. Even knowing it is a reflection and which way you were shooting and where you were, I still can't logically place all of the elements. The signage, the clothes hangers and the people -- they just don't seem to line up logically into a scene I could fully realise. I like that by the way! There is a sense of these people being ghosts or other apparitions because of the ambiguity of their locations.

 

There are so many element of the everyday here: the concrete, the awnings, and, yes, the ZED sign. I like all of these elements including the sign because they add to the feeling that this should be obviously understood and then it isn't and that this extra-ordinary photo/event is occurring amidst the commonplace.

 

The absolute centrality of the figures and the overlay of the sharp signage over the OOF faces is unorthodox. But, I think i like both elements. certainly having the faces less sharp and clear than the sign and having them directly behind the sign only adds to the complexity of the image and even to its sense of mysteriousness.

 

My only concern about the image is that it does greatly reward patient observation. I wonder if I would have felt as warmly about it if I had encountered it in the same rushed manner as most other images on Photo.net? For better or worse (and it may indeed be a good thing) this image does not 'pop' or really grab attention. I'm not sure you could get it to 'pop' and have the same sense of mystery within it -- maybe you could. Maybe if one was to try many of these one of them would have enough contrast and depth to really captivate instantly but also hold your attention? Maybe not.

 

I hope some of that rambling was helpful. Thank you for sharing a very interesting image.

 

 

This is a very interesting way to evaluate that image, exploring it as layers, which it really has. I wonder if you have read the other comments and found some answers?...

 

Are you familiar with E.Munch the Norwigian artist and his famouse work "The scream"? does my analogy and dialogue with him rings a bell in you? As for me, it was my first impression after I saw the result of this one.The ambiguity of the situation and the open mouth and blured figure connected me very fast to his work. Thank you Roger for an instructive and interesting reading of this one.

First welcome to the CG. I liked reading your wonderful comment about critiqe,really a very well logical presentation.

 

"I wonder if I would have felt as warmly about it if I had encountered it in the same rushed manner as most other images on Photo.net?"

 

A good question. There are images that are catching our attention right in the first sight and are easy to interpret, there are others that something catches our eyes, and as a means to understand , we spend more time exploring it.

 

I'm glad you found it the second way around.

 

The mystery of the window, the mundane and reflection in it, attracted my initial interest, the figure that entered the scene for a fraction of a moment made that image for me, it connected me first to my dialogue with Munch( and reading what you wrote I understude that you have a wide knowledge in the art history) but also what reflectios are doing to reality.

 

The mystery, and ambiguity , which the connection of reflected reality can produce.

 

Thanks for your interpretation Ian.

Pnina, of course I can see the association with "The Scream", but honestly that work is so famous that one almost instinctively makes that connection at first when an image of this type presents itself. However, this woman's expression for me is more ambiguous. I can see astonishment or surprise here (as well as possible angst) and I'm finding that the questions I'm asking are probably different than with Munch (questions like, "What is she reacting to?" rather than "Why is that guy hurting so much?"). And the supporting elements here make the issue even more complex. In a way, I'm sorry that you let us know that you had no control over the reflections, etc. because their possible meaning is a great part of the mystery. Every time I see this I get more out of it.

Thanks, I don't think that anybody can control reflections... but what can be done is to "use" them for your message, which I did.

 

The mystery was haunting, and even it may not be very "original" to think of Munch( "The scream), as I created a dialogue with his work in my painting years

it was natural for me.

 

Anyway, your point is very valid!

I'd like to offer my take on a something you've said (which really has nothing to do with your photo per se as much as a way of seeing or thinking). I think reflections are "reality." There's a good scientific explanation for what a reflection is, what a shadow is, what highlights are. These are things we often use as photographic symbols. They are also things that tend to elicit emotions in us. An interesting discussion would be to talk about why they do so. They are, in some sense, special. Surely the reflection is something different than the woman or building but, to me, it is no less real.

Pnina, I very much like the point that Fred makes above as I am also fascinated by reflections and their unpredictability. I disagree slightly with you in that one can partially control them by changing position,etc. But my real point is that sometimes if the photographer is too forthcoming about how an image is produced (and especially about what is or isn't intentional) some of the mystery can be taken away. For example, I was enjoying the romantic possibility that your model here was posed, and that some of the other elements were deliberately included to make the viewer work.

That is really an interesting point( reflections)Iknow there is a scientific explanation for it, and reflections has more than one definition.I'm not familiar with a physics explanation about reflection Fred,( I can find it probably in the google) I can say only what my experience is in the photographic domain. For me reality that is reflected on another reality, makes a new "reality" composed from both. You have a good point Roger, that if you move you can change that "reality,"( the reflected one) so it is again the photographer's choice in a certain point in time, in a certain point of light, where to crop, where to stand, what is the message, what are the parts that are more important and what is less.Thats why we post process our images, cropping the parts that are not relevant, to what we want to express.

 

Is it logical? Fred and Roger?

 

Great points.

 

There are many ways I manipulate reflections. I'm very conscious of where I place mirrors in my house by what they are and will be reflecting, how they will catch the light, etc. If you move when taking any photo, you change it, reflection or not.

 

When I photograph involving mirrors or glass, I am always (if I have time) conscious of where I'm standing, what's in the reflection, what might come along to change the reflection, what appears inside and what appears reflected. Nothing like taking a photo of a window with everything just right and then a bus comes along behind you as you hit the shutter. But that, of course, can occur if you're simply across the street taking the photo and the bus passes in front of you.

 

I will think about this over the weekend so I can be more coherent but I have a feeling the specialness about reflections has less to do with their physical nature or their level of reality and more to do with their symbolic nature. I think we respond to a universal feeling that they are, in fact, less real, somehow mystical and magical, perhaps somehow a deeper view into a (supposed) soul than an unreflected shot. It would be interesting to keep these things in mind when shooting reflections and try to say something about this. Is there something inherent in a reflection that makes it "different" and of a new "reality" or is that all in our minds? (Of course, what's in our minds is also very real.)

 

I've done a fair amount of study about symbolism so it often influences how I think about significant things we respond to. For now, let's just say symbols seem to me to be real but also to "suggest" things beyond themselves.

Pnina, perhaps my interest in reflections partially comes from a background that had to include a lot of Physics. Long ago reflections were called "virtual" images as opposed to "real" images (and this was long before the term was used in relation to computers). The idea is that when you look at your reflection in a mirror, you are not seeing a real flesh and blood person a real distance away from you. Does this make the reflection any less real? One for the metaphysicists. Anyway, a fascinating discussion as far as photography is concerned. Does this address your point?

Fred, Reflections always fascinated me !

 

here

 

they are what it was called "virtual" Roger, I would add the seond word and call it " virtual reality"... or even "changing reality" as light will change its "reality" with the changing hours of day.I like the posibility to "play' with that phenomenon, as it gives so many posibilities of using and manipulating them...

 

Thanks for that interesting exchange of points of view in a subject that has a great place in the photography medium.

Her open mouth - an expression of surprise/dismay/horror, her "veiled" face, adding to the mystery. Superbly emotional piece, dear friend. Beautiful, unsettling and extremely intense!!!!! Regards.

Unusual moment on simple subject to get such an impressive result the success belongs to your keen eye & perfect skill, Pnina!!! Best regards

I have always been fascinated by reflections they catch my eye often and I enjoy playing with them. Compositionally they can be interesting in there ability to move objects within physical space in unlikely ways and recombine them elsewhere. That brick wall across the street can become an element in Pnina's photo from this side of the street. Reflections on glass or water can create even more mysterious juxtaposition since light can pass through as well as reflect off. I am reminded by this photo of M. C. Escher's famous work " Three Worlds " which I have often tried to mimic with a photograph and have so far failed to achieve. This is what I see that Pnina has accomplished here. Not just a reflection but a combination of three worlds. The reflected world, the actual world of the window ( the ZED etc. ) and the transmitted world of the store interior behind the glass.

I agree with Roger that although Munch's the scream can be seen in this women's face, as I mentioned initially it can also flip back and forth for me for the very reason that it is an ambiguous expression, something Munch's scream is not.

Thanks, I'm very familiar with Escher's works the "3 worlds" included, he is such a great artist, that even mention my work with one of his, is a great compliment, that I don't deserve...;-))

 

I understand your point of view about Munch's scream, and I understand the difference you see, I did not think that mine is expressing exactly his general meaning of this work of his, but as I worked (a lot) dialoging with his work, my assocciation took me right to him, not that I wanted to compare this one to his....

 

Thanks for your visit and expressing your thoughts, Gordon.

Don't have the energy to write a long piece on this picture, suffice to say, it's a winner. I like how the hard and soft, the linear and the rounded forms. and the geometric monochrome and the soft colors of the face play off against one another. There is a very strong feeling of dimensionality with this picture.

Thanks a lot for taking the time. you know how I appreciate your comments!( exactly like I appreciate your photography! ;-))

Dear PN ina, I did try to read all the comments, but I did stop, too much words, and I still want to read a real book ;D..... so I am very impressed by this unusual, original and mysterious picture, I could look for it a long time and would not get bored, it is just beautifull, I wish I could tell you a more poetic comment, but this is what you get, with love ofcourse, I BELIEVE IN IT

 

Elsi