Critique: Paris Hookers

[charles_stobbs2]

...you'd better not go in the woods today.....

[jean_.]

Tim,

 

excellent work. The fist two are best IMHO. The less abstract last photos are not very interesting. BTW, without reading the caption, it's obvious to me that it's neither a hallowen party nor wedding candids, I disagree with that critique.

 

The other criticism, that there is no "interaction" with the subject seems to me like if there was a strict rule to be followed, assumes that there was no interaction, and dictates how interaction should manifest in a photo. Again, I disagree. The photos make me feel uncomfortable, with no real point to hold on to, to reassure me. It's like a horror movie, or the perspective of a serial killer or something, very disturbing. Like having a look into an other world, that is always ignored, but that exists nonetheless, and is threatening our perfect world of rules and commodities. Reminds me of David Lynch.

[jorn ake]

Seems like those photos which combine absolute darkness with a blast of white body part or figure leaping into the frame (not literally but in terms of white to black contrast) are the most interesting. In focus blurriness is better than just blurriness, if that makes any sense. That deer in the headlights sort of thing - like scenes from David Lynch's Lost Highway.

 

My suggestion is to take a lot of these in order to offset the compositional problems that come from the randomness inherent in your process. I mean, if you have a 2 - 5% success rate (not bad for hip shooting or shooting fast without wanting to get up close and personal and burgled) and you shoot 100 shots, you have 2 - 5 shots worth showing. Maybe. So you shoot 500 shots and end up with 10 - 25 shots worth showing. Maybe. Or you change your process, work towards more direct interaction with the subjects, shoot more slowly, get a higher success rate with the photos and have more to work with later.

 

The flip side of these photographs might be Philip Lorca di Corcia who paid people between 20 and 50 $US to meet him in a hotel room and let him make their portrait. Very different effect obviously.

 

Or Mary Alpern who staked out a bathroom or something in a men's club from across the alley and took lots and lots of photographs of what went on in there. Dirty Windows I think the book is called.

 

That people have sex isn't typically astounding or all that interesting. The lengths that some people will go to in order to have sex in a particular way or with a particular type of partner just gets curiouser and curiouser, said the cat.

[mark_rutledge]

hmmmm.....I still don't understand why, because of they're line of work, people

get up in arms that Tim doesn't try to get to know these subjects. Do all

photographers need to interact/study with their subjects for the images to

have any value? I don't beleive Tim's intention is nor did he say he was doing

a study or in-depth examination into all aspects of these prostitutes lives. All

the countless hip/street shots on this forum never seem to draw this type of

critique. These images by far are much more powerful and interesting than

those of similar genre posted here. I never see anyone criticize the typical

"pedestrian on the sidewalk" grab shot as being shallow because the

photographer doesn't get to know the subjects? Am I missing something?

[jay_holovacs1]

Several comments referrenced the emotional distance (not 'getting to know' the subjects.

 

This perhaps adds to the authenticity. The costume, the stance, the attitude is certainly not one of close personal knowledge, it's a momentary impression that she is attempting to project to a potential customer. What was photographed is that projected image.

[steve deer]

tim, great work... seen some of them already on zonezero.com!

 

steve

[__jon__]

Great shots Tim!

 

>I dont want to get to know them or do any in-depth studies; I'm just trying for a glimpse of what you see when you venture into the subculure.

 

I think I understand your point. It might be more interesting if you got to know these people--but you may be right in keeping a distance to give a 'voyeuristic' view.

 

I love this stuff!

[________1]

The images speak volumes about the photographer, not much about the subject.

[tom h.]

Like 'em. I see plenty of interaction, and what they say to me

about the photographer is that he's prepared to wander the Bois

du Boulogne (in dubious company) after dark in search of a

photograph. Easy to criticize from the warm surroundings of a

keyboard.

 

Tom

[art waldschmidt]

Gee! ..... (or should it be gosh!?) I hadn't considered the sinister influence of those warm surroundings on the evaluation process.

[sandler]

I think they work very well. My favorites are the more environmental shots (the first two you posted as well as the one where just the legs are lit by the streetlight). I cast my vote for more like these with relatively fewer of the closer portrait-type shots sprinkled in.

 

The grain and blur don't bother me at all for this series...very appropriate.

 

Good work!

[________1]

�Easy to criticize from the warm surroundings of a keyboard.�

 

Right Tom, but in this case wrong. I interact with prostitutes every day of the week and have done so for the last eleven years. To me Tim�s photos point to his provincialism. He finds transsexuals weird, strange, perhaps a little frightening. So he takes a series of strange looking photos to confirm that notion. What does that tell us? In fact, prostitutes are primarily from the underclass, often drug addicted; alienated from their families and most have been sexually abused. Now, some people may find this Felliniesq, I find it sad and pathetic beyond belief. Having said that, I don�t think Tim should now go photograph prostitues with a mind to how I feel about them. :-)

[henricus]

Did anyone else notice that the one with the leopard coat is actually a male?

[mark_rutledge]

"He finds transsexuals weird, strange, perhaps a little frightening"....where did

you get that? Is that your inference? Seems like these images are bringing out

personal biases and beliefs that are then imposed on Tim's images, Tim's

intentions and ultimately the photographer himself. I guess the one good thing

about that sort of reaction is it does show that these images are striking a

chord and elliciting strong responses.....sometimes the only goal of a

photographer...not necessarily Tim's though.

[al_kaplan1]

If they're transexuals then yes, they would be biological males!

[octavio bustard]

Thanks for the input. It's hard to be objective about one's own work.

 

As for the Q someone asked about me thinking they work - I do. I wanted to portray precisely what a number of you mentioned - a voyueristic feel, the same thing some john would experience, a mix of excitement and disquiet. The remarks indicating that they were ugly or uncomfortable to look at are precisely what I'm intending.

 

Maybe I am a provincial, but I don't want to get to know them anymore than a john would. I certainly dont want to go home with them. When I first started last Summer I tried to talk to them and get some personal interaction, but it was useless. Their pimps are usually lurking in the shadows and that certainly doesnt help. After awhile, in my eyes at least, the strongest images were the ones which reflected the sort of dehumanized atmosphere that pervades the place.

 

Its a pretty dangerous place to be with a $4000 camera around your neck at 3 in the morning, so I typically dress up in my thug outfit - knit yankee cap (works great in France; all frenchmen think you're from NYC and thus surely packing heat), black hooded sweatshirt etc, and then of course you act like you own the place - and this doesnt help with the social interaction either. I guess I could blow a few thousand bucks "getting to know" some of them but 1) I dont want to catch any social diseases and 2) transvestites just dont do it for me.

 

Jamie J- you indicated that you have interacted with this subculture for some time. Have you taken pics? I'd be very interested to see them if you have. I'm always looking to steal peoples ideas!

 

Thanks again.

[________1]

�where did you get that? Is that your inference?�

 

Mark, yes it is. Do you think people drive around snapping photos out of car windows because they feel comfortable with their subjects?

[Spearhead]

<i>If they're transexuals then yes, they would be biological males!</i><p>

 

Usually transexuals refers to people who have become the opposite sex biologically. Transvestites don't change their biology, just their appearance.

[crackers_.]

An exhibit is your rendition of your comprehension of a subject yet you don't want to get involved with it. You'll use the likeness of a struggling bum, taken from a car window at 50 kliks, to enhance your standing in the Communitie d'Artistes. You da pimp.

[________1]

Tim, no I haven�t photographed the working women here. I manage a social housing complex that�s actually on a prostitute stroll. Life would get very complicated, very quickly if I started forming relationships that would allow me some access to their private lives. Maybe sometime down the road. I see the Mission across the street has a "makeover" evening for street women, that might make for some interesting shots.

[tom h.]

Of the fourteen pictures shown, seven of them appear to be

taken at a distance of 3-6 feet. This is hardly 50 kliks. You da

myopic.

 

Tom

[mark_rutledge]

<p>Crackers wrote: "An exhibit is your rendition of your comprehension of a

subject ....". Do you actually see much photography or art for that matter? I

think it's a little diificult to classify the exhibiton of any piece of art so neatly

and compactly. Artists have different intentions and their work doesn't

necessarily simply exhibit their "comprehension of a subject".</p>

 

<p>Jamie J: "Do you think people drive around snapping photos out of car

windows because they feel comfortable with their subjects?" First of all why

do photographers have to feel comfortable with their subjects? Maybe Tim is

comfortable but wants to make the viewer uncomfortable, maybe he wants to

potray his discomfort to the viewer. Sometimes photography and art are

uncomfortable...that can make it all the more powerful. Anyway I guess it's

pretty amazing you can read so much into someone's personality by their

technique.</p>

 

.

[bhk]

Beautiful work. I particularly like the ones where you see some of the ground or

environment. Takes me back to turn-of-the-century Paris. Haunting.

 

I think you mentioned Fevre in another thread -- is he printing the series for you? I

was wondering also, for some reason I thought he was with Picto but I recall you

mentioned a different Paris lab that I'm not familiar with.

 

Best,

 

Babar

[________1]

"Anyway I guess it's pretty amazing you can read so much into someone's personality by their technique."

 

Thanks! ;-)

[ralph_barker]

Interesting and compelling work, Tim. I think your results are consistent with your stated objectives, perspective-wise. That perspective, in my opinion, is just as valid as any other, but perhaps more widely held than some. My personal reaction is that I especially liked the images in which a bit more of the environment was included in the shot. For the benefit of those, like myself, unfamiliar with the area, you might consider augmenting these with images of the area itself - perhaps even a few transition images taking the viewer on a trip from the better-mannered area of the city into this darker realm, ending who knows where.