ron_betcher Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 A question for the ebony owners. I am trying to decide between a Toho and an Ebony(Rw45 and sw45???) Does anybody have opinions ;) I want to be able to pack the camera, even when skiing at high alt/helicopter skiing, but also do some architecture photography since I am an intern architect and my firm and one of my friends firm is interested in giving me a go based on my 35mm work. I am pretty new to LF so any advice on what i need/help/used equipment would help. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce watson Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 I own a Toho FC-45X. It is only moderately suited to architecture work because its bellows is not interchangable. That is, there is no bag bellows available. This of course limites you to lenses that are a bit long for some architecture work, such as interiors. I use the camera for landscape work. I usually pack into location. The Toho absolutely excels at this. Wonderful camera to use in the field, and does great with my 110mm SS XL, which is the shortest lens that I own. Even with the 110mm SS XL, I've experienced some bellows vignetting when using lots of movements (for example, a Japanese garden where I wasn't allowed to get into the position I wanted and tried to compensate with lots of front fall and shift). But again, that's more architecture than landscape. The problem here is that with architecture, you often want to keep the film plane level and plumb to minimize distortions - keep the lines in the building straight. That sort of locks the back of the camera down. That means that all your work to include what you want in the frame (rise/shift), and control your focus plane (tilt/swing), comes from the front standard. This in turn puts a spotlight on your bellows, and is why a bag bellows comes in so handy when doing architecture work. So... the Toho is excellent in the field for landscape work. It is useful for architecture work where extreme movements are not required. That is, better at exteriors than interiors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam_crater Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 I think the sw45 might be your choice between the two Ebony cameras you mentioned. It has the movements you really need for architecture and is great with extreme wide angles. I use the rsw45 (a simplified sw45) in the wilderness and it is very light and compact and extremely easy to set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_kravit Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 Ron, An Ebony is way too good for an intern! ;-) Just kidding of course. I know this is not your question, but I use an Ebony 45SU non folding camera. I shoot architecture and pack it for hiking as well. Take a look at Richard Sexton's article on the Ebony site. He shoots quite a bit of architecture and uses an Ebony 45SU as well. Mike Michael J. Kravit, AIA Architect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_kravit Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 BTW, most of the architectural photographers that shoot my projects (I don't shoot my own work) use Arca Swiss F-Line cameras. Perhaps because they like the precision adjustments that a field camera does not always have. Good luck in selecting your new camera. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emrys Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 I own an Ebony SV45Ti. It's basically the mahogany version of the SV45Te. It weighs 2.1kg (4.6 pounds) and has all the movements that a view camera can offer. Here's a link to the ebony version: http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/ebony.htm#LabelSV45Te I bought it hoping that I wouldn't need to buy another (4x5) field camera. So far I haven't been disappointed. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars ake vinberg Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 I use the smaller SW23. The SW45 should be just about right for your needs. I think that especially for more severe/high altitude conditions the SW series shines - leave the lens in the camera, no fiddly setup using frozen fingertips. Compressed, the camera/lens forms one compact package that packs well and is not very fragile. The Toho is hard to beat in terms of weight for backpacking, but is more awkward to pack and perhaps not as appropriate for extreme wideangles and large shifts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ed_candland1 Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 If you really want to do professional architecture photography then I'd think one of the small monorails like the Arca-Swiss would be more in order. They make a Discovery model that's not too pricey. Down side is they are bigger and heavier than the Ebony. The Ebony SW while light and easy to set up is a very short bellows camera, designed for very wide to normal (150mm) lenses. There is an extention back but if it was me and I wanted to use lenses other than wide angle I'd look at another model. Down side to the RW is they're not great for very wide angles. Good luck. Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cxc Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Do you plan never to fall while skiing with the thing on your back? Personally, that's the way I ski, but then I don't have the nerve to go heli-skiing, where I would assume a fall now and then would be pretty likely, and possibly spectacular. So I would require either a camera that closes up into a bomb-proof box, like the Linhof Technika, or else a sturdy case inside the backpack. If you are considering the Toho, you should also consider the Gowland, which is superlight and packs down to nothing, if you are willing to take the standards off the rail. I use mine with lenses from 65mm to 400T, with the one and only bellows, and real movements. You'll have to put the precision movements of the Sinar out of your mind, however. If I had your requirements, and owned no cameras already, I would buy a Linhof Technikardan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron_betcher Posted August 18, 2003 Author Share Posted August 18, 2003 Yes, I do plan on falling. That is why i'm wondering between a folding and a non-folding. I have been skiing w/a fuji GX 617 and have fallen with noting hurt......so i'm hoping the same may happen with an ebony??? In 35mm I almost always shoot with either a 28mm or a 90mm, so right now I am planning on only having a 90mm,150mm and a 58-72mm ultra wide. I think with those an SW may work?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ed_candland1 Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Ron, If that's the case you might want to look at the Walker Titan Wide 4x5 also. I have't used one, but have heard good things. It's made out of ABS and stainless steel and said to be almost weatherproof. I'd rather fall on this one than a wood camera. The web site is: http://www.walkercameras.com/ Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ed_candland1 Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 To be honest, it really looks like your looking to buy 2 cameras. All LF cameras are compromises and the 2 types of photography your wanting to do both have different needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffrey_scott Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 I second the 45SU. It has a very useful range of bellows extension; I use lenses ranging from a 58mm to a 305mm without having to change bellows and I get a full range of movements with all my lenses. The SW45 is a nice, extremely compact camera but the bellows is lacking in the longer range without resorting to an extension back or tophat lensboards, which just adds to the size, weight and complexity of the setup, not to mention lacking some very useful movements. The 45SU is lacking nothing unless you desire very long lenses (you can use a 500 telephoto lens on this camera). In fact you can go as wide as a 35mm so the range of lenses span 35mm to 500mm, not bad for one bellows with unrestricted movements! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicholas_fiduccia Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Jeffrey, I am curious. Can you weigh your 45SU and tell me the true weight of the camera? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron_betcher Posted August 19, 2003 Author Share Posted August 19, 2003 I think that having an unrestricted budget I would probably get the 45SU, but since the $3,800 is almost double a RW or SW I will have to compromise until someone wants to sell me their used 45SU for ~2000 :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaron_rocky Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 Definitely Shenhao, won't cost you a fortune, less painful if it breaks apart when you fall on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffrey_scott Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 NIcholas, As best as I can tell from the scale I have available, the 45SU weights 5.6 lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul freeman Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 I use the Ebony 45S for both landscape and architectural work, its one of the cheaper Ebony cameras but very flexible and relatively light at a tad over a couple of pounds. I backpack it in a small lowe pro town and country rucksack. Certainly less flexible than a monorail but the portability makes it faster to use. you can look at www.architecturalimages.co.uk for some of the architectural stuff, about 1/2 of the shots were taken with the camera, check out the B&W stuff, that was all done on the 45S. The landscape on photo.paulfreeman.net was all shot with the 45S as well. The images don't translate terribly well to the web though. Now... I'm lusting after one of the 5x7 or 8x10 cameras. Cheers Paul R. W. Freeman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul freeman Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 I use the Ebony 45S for both landscape and architectural work, its one of the cheaper Ebony cameras but very flexible and relatively light at a tad over a couple of kilos (thats a bit more than four pounds in the old money) I backpack it in a small lowe pro town and country rucksack. Certainly less flexible than a monorail but the portability makes it faster to use. you can look at www.architecturalimages.co.uk for some of the architectural stuff, about 1/2 of the shots were taken with the camera, check out the B&W stuff, that was all done on the 45S. The landscape on photo.paulfreeman.net was all shot with the 45S as well. The images don't translate terribly well to the web though. Now... I'm lusting after one of the 5x7 or 8x10 cameras. Cheers Paul R. W. Freeman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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