venugopala_rao Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I am new to photography and plan to buy an SLR to begin with. Have used Point and Shoot cameras for some time.Some of my friends suggest I go in for Canon EOS Rebel Ti while others suggest Elan 7e. The lens which I would go in for is 28-105mm USM lens but am undecided about the body.I would be visiting mostly National Parks and museums and historical monuments since I have come to USA for a short period.Can you suggest me which one is better for the above?Also a few reliable (cheap and best) sites where I can purchase it from. ThanksVenu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quicksilver1 Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 <HTML> <body> Venu, If you have American Express BVG(BEST VALUE GUARANTEE), guess what, you can buy it from any site, and price match to the cheapest you find it anywhere in print. Otherwise, I would suggest to get it search on dealtime.com or pricegrabber.com or nextag.com. To help photo.net run this site try think link <b>http://www.photo.net/equipment/where-to-buy </b>. B&H and ADORAMA has a very good reputation in the photographic world. You will get the quality product from them. I guess the lowest you will find ELAN7E is around 350 bucks. Check etronics.com for this. Do not forget the shipping and handling costs though. As for the comparison between ELAN7E and REBEL, it mainly depends on what functions you would prefer in a camera body. ELAN7\7E will certainly allow you to be more creative. I am a begineer just like you. I bought ELAN7E since I never wanted to buy another camera body 1 year down the line. I am happy with ELAN and would switch to digital 2-3 yeards down the line, when the prices will be more affordable for DSLRs. Hope this helps Most Welcome to the SLRRRR world ! Cheers, Raj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arthur_reyes1 Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I'd say go with the Elan7e. The Ti is a great beginner camera. But the 7e has more features that you might like in the future. I'd be afraid that if you got the Ti, soon down the road you will have wished that you got the 7e. (If your going between those two bodies it sounds like the $$ situation isn't that big a factor). So why not go for the camera that you can grow into. As for the 28-105 lens. It is a great lens and will make for a great all-purpose lens for which you can grow into and experiment with photography. Make sure it is the 28-105 f/3.5-4.5, not the f/4.5-5.6. Also, the 50mm 1.8 is a nice cheap, but excellent lens. Consider that in addition to the 28-105. I had these two lenses when I got into photography and I think they make a nice set to start with. Enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doreen_miller Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I would recommend getting the Elan 7 or 7e. I was new to photography a couple of years ago and purchased the Rebel 2000. Although it is a great camera, I found that I soon out grew it and wanted more. I ended up buying the Elan 7e earlier this year and the Rebel is now packed away in the closet. So if you think photography is something you're really going to get into, buy a little above your level and give yourself some room to grow. The Elan 7e is an awesome camera. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asif.qamar Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Elan 7e is much more functionality-rich. Ti is more a starters camera. If you are not thinking of photography as a serious hobby, or want to start conservatively, you can go with Ti. In that case go atleast with "Ti with Date", a minor upgrade on Canon Ti. Elan 7e is great, and so is Elan 7 (without the eye-control). Choose good lenses, if you have the budget... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim_larson1 Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Yeah, go for the Elan. Not sure I would pay a premium for the Eye-Controlled focus of the "E" versus the standard Elan-7. On my 10D (which has a Elan-7 AF system) I have been finding that I tend to "lock" the AF point to one particular sensor (95% of the time I use the center sensor). The Eye controlled function is supposed to help the camera figure out which sensor you really want to use => I have heard mixed reviews of this systems effectiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NK Guy Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I'd suggest having a look at: <P> <A HREF="http://photonotes.org/articles/beginner-faq/">http://photonotes.org/ articles/beginner-faq/</A> <P> Take a good look at the section on the 28-105 lens - there are several variants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alvaro_buitrago Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I suggest the Elan 7e. The only advantage of the Ti is that it is smaller. In everything else (including the extra benefits you get for the additional cost) the Elan7e is a clear winner. The "e" will be useful to quickly change focusing points without having to turn any knobs. If you cannot afford the 7e go for the 7 or get a used body. If you use B&H or Adorama be sure to use the link at this site since those two sponsor this site. The 28-105 lens is just OK. I have it and have found it too soft for my taste, so I also have the 50mm 1.4 prime. I encourage you to buy the less expensive 50mm 1.8 prime because it has much better optics than the zoom and is relatively inexpensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s._fisher Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 If you ever want to use manual modes, the Rebel will stink since it doesn't have the rear command dial. Plus the Elan7 allows more manual & predictable control with exposure & focus modes; Rebels aren't very far above P&S control-wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jespdj Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Hi Venugopala, Someone else just asked this question a few days ago - but with other names: "EOS 300v or EOS 33". These are the non-US names for the Rebel Ti and Elan 7e. Maybe you'd want to look up that post for more info. regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne_yoshida1 Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 I just don't get it. Why do we all blast the Rebel (a cheap, light, small camera that has almost all of the functionality of an Elan) but slobber over the 50mm f/1.8 (a cheap, light, small lens that has almost all the functionality of a 50mm f/1.4). I can change shutter speed and aperture in manual mode much faster on the Rebel 2K than the Elan 7E. No, I am not kidding. The point is that it's not comfortable to do so if you have large fingers and thumbs. I don't, but some people do. Everybody talks about the "extra features" of the Elan 7. Practically, what are they? For me, the main ones are: midroll rewind, mirror lockup, second curtain flash, slightly more accurate meter, ability to separate metering mode from exposure, eye control focus (7E). These are all super, but I don't believe that the lack of any of these would have caused, say, Galen Rowell to give up and go home in frustration. Date imprinting cameras: sigh. I would pay extra NOT to have the date function, if it accidentally activated then it would pretty much ruin a bunch of shots. Call me paranoid. Well, Venu, it's your call. As expected, the Elan has more features but most of those features are non-basic ones, they won't make you pictures magically sharper or more colorful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yakim_peled1 Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 <P>Any Elan (a used one will serve you equally well) + 50/1.8. While the <a href="http://photonotes.org/articles/beginner-faq/lenses.html#28105">28-105/3.5-4.5 USM </a> is a good consumer lens, the 50/1.8 will be much better. It will also be cheaper. In the money saved you can have the BP-300, the recommended grip. </P> <P> The biggest problem of zooms - for novices - is their convenience. It is so easy to zoom that you tend to use them as cropping tools and not as "a bag of primes in one". This way you are not able to appreciate the difference of every focal length. The proper use of a zoom is to set it to a desired focal length and then, to move around with your feet, just as if you were using a prime. </P> <P> Happy shooting , <br> Yakim. </P> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chip l. Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Wayne, You have a point. I guess the Elan 7 gets the nods for the same reason that SUV's are big in the US. Bigger and better is best. And the idea that "I might just need to go off road" or "I might need the mirror lock-up". When in truth most people never do either. What I got from the original post is that Venu wants to move us in quality from his point and shoot. Price is not an over riding factor between the two. What Venu should also be looking at is what camera feels best in his hands. The Ti is smaller, but has an "ergonomic" design. The Elan 7 is larger and heavier. Unless Venu needs the additional features of the Elan 7, then looking at the Ti makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chip l. Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 The advantage for the Rebel Ti date is the IR remote. It would allow someone to get into the picture without the "10 sec. dash". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s._fisher Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Wayne- yes I have big hands. The Rebel's body is designed so poorly that my right fingers literally hurt after a couple hours and I would do anything to avoid manual mode & exposure compensation. Not something that one should look for in a body. Since EOS lenses don't have aperture rings, the rear dial is required for most people (who don't use 'creative' modes). The Rebels also don't allow you to explicitly state which metering and focus modes to use, and I'm a nut for predictability. These types of things make me feel the Rebel isn't much more than a P&S with interchangable lenses. I agree a lot of the other stuff you get aren't much more than gizmos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim_larson1 Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Well, erogonomics are actually vital for a camera body. If you don't like having it in your hand. . . .you won't use it. For me, the Elan just has a better feel than most Rebels (have not tried the Ti). Others think the Elan's extra features are valuble, hence it performs better. As for the 50/1.8: The issue is simple. You can't really beat the performance. Period. The 50/1.4 has a bit better bokeh. . .that's basically all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe_isler Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Wayne I agree with you, everyone is always blasting the Rebels. The Elan 7, is a great camera with more features, but do people really need mirror lockup (I do bulb shots, and have never had a problem with my Ti), mid roll rewind with leader out (I rewind my film all the time mid roll, I have a tool that takes me 5 sec. to pull the leader out, rear dial?, I have found no need for that. The Elan 7 does have some nice features that the Ti doesn't (eye-control, your choice of metering, that is one of the features that I wished the Ti had. Ti is a great camera too. What does everyone say, "Good glass really makes the camera great", oh yea, and the operator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s._fisher Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Constructive criticism is not blasting. Some of you take comments towards Rebels a little too personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe_isler Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 S Fisher, I don't mind constructive criticism, what I do mind is people that say you cannot be a serious photographer using a Rebel, and there is no way that you can produce great photos with a Rebel. Recently a person that has posted a reply to Venugopala's question here, made this statement to another question about Rebels, "I think that no Rebel is suitable for the Enthusiastic Photographer." Most people that own cameras that are better than the Rebels almost always put down the Rebels. And I have found out there are many people on this website that (including me) use Rebels and produce beautiful pictures. What I mean is constructive criticism is fine, but putting down the Rebels just because you own something bigger or better is not right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett_bainbridge Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Anyone audacious enough to claim you can't do serious photography with a Rebel is flat-out wrong, granted. But those features available in higher-end cameras are certainly very useful to the serious photographer, and some more so than others. The feature curve from the rebels up to the Elans and then to the EOS bodies is pretty good at bundling the most-often used features sooner into the cameras than the more esoteric features. Accordingly, some people will never use more features than the most basic Rebel will offer, but the features in an Elan can be extremely useful to an interested student of photography far sooner than you might imagine. Given the small price difference between the Rebels and the Elans, it's a relatively small hurdle to get over in justifying the "next step up" body. Certainly a person can be perfectly happy their whole life with a Rebel. I would contend however that someone specifically looking to learn more about photography would be better-served by a more complete body, without going to the extremes of buying an EOS3 or EOS1V. The differences between the Rebel Ti and the Elan7 are relatively minimal - the Ti is the best improvement of the Rebel line in years - but those differences are relatively major ones for a relatively small price differential. That is why most people will recommend an Elan over a Rebel - unless cost or weight is your primary motivator there's not a lot of reason to choose a Rebel when you could have an Elan almost as cheaply. That doesn't make the Rebel a bad buy, just one you should think about a little and decide what's best for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chip l. Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 What some failed to see is Venu's newness to SLR's. While the features of the Elan are pretty sweet; yet most will never really use them. What we should be asking Venu is, what kind of use do you see for this new camera? What deos he hope to gain by going to an SLR verses the point and shoot that he is using now? If he doesn't need the features of the Elan 7, then he needs to see which camera feels best to him. The point of those of us that mentioned the Rebel Ti, was that it is a very capable camera. And may very well suit Venu's need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul rest Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 From someone who has been using the Ti for about a year now: when I bought the Ti I was thinking about the Elan 7 or 7e, but just couldn't afford it. While I have a certain amount of regret that I hadn't gone with a used Elan 7, at the same time when I do get a better body I'll have a small, light, cheap body I can throw the 50mm f/1.8 lens on and not worry about it getting stolen or broken. I have small hands, so the Ti fits my hands almost perfectly, but I can see someone with larger hands having problems. What it really comes down to though, is that the Ti is pretty impressive for someone who has only used P&S cameras. I got into photography not knowing whether I would take off, or merely end up with a decent camera that I could take snapshots of friends with. I take most of my shots in P mode, but do use Av and Tv (that doesn't look right) quite a bit as well, and full manual when I know the situation is beyond the meter's understanding. I do wish the camera had two control wheels, and independently selectable metering modes, but for the purposes of someone looking to get their feet wet (and whose hands aren't too big), the Ti is a good way to go. While I am a long way off from being anything beyond a rank amateur, I have acquired enough interest to do my own developing (not yet, but soon I'll have access to a fully equipped darkroom), and have certainly gotten some shots that have impressed the hell out of me and those around me (alas, no professional photographers in that circle). I would say go with the Elan 7 if you can afford it, but don't knock the Ti. Additionally, the Ti makes a better potential second body when you upgrade, being smaller and cheaper. And of course ulimately the Ti serves the same purpose as even the mighty 1v, a light box with a bunch of electronics and a place to put the much more important lens. Just my thoughts. Succulent shooting. -Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c_m_o Posted August 1, 2003 Share Posted August 1, 2003 I had trouble opening the back of the Rebel Ti camera to change the film. The latch is on the back of the Ti and I had trouble getting any leverage to push it down. I was surprised this would be a problem. I have experience with older Canon SLRs and the Sure Shot Z135 [Point and Shoot]. These cameras have the opening latch on the side of the camera body. I looked at the wireless remote control. I wasn�t impressed. It seemed fragile and cheaply made. I suggest you look at the wireless remote before deciding on a Rebel camera body since the wireless remote works only with the Rebel Ti with date function. The Rebel Ti does not have the sensor to pick up the infrared signal. Any model of the Elan 7 can use the wireless remote control. It�s priced under $25.00. I thought the light weight of the Rebel Ti would make it the perfect camera for me. When I tried a couple of zoom lens on it, it felt front or lens heavy. It wasn�t balanced. It was more noticable to me when I put the strap on and tried to wear it around my neck. I would suggest you try the two cameras with the lens you plan to buy. Put on the strap and walk around awhile with both cameras. Try loading film etc. The price difference between the Rebel Ti/date and Elan 7 was around $100 so I got the Elan 7. Good luck and let us know what you decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quicksilver1 Posted August 1, 2003 Share Posted August 1, 2003 The main idea behind the forum is just to have this kind of constructive criticism. I was the first one in this thread to vote for Elan7. That's just cuz I was in Venu's shoes not too long back. After all there is difference between workarounds and the features avaliable. Ofcourse, the perception shall differ from person to person. I am sure by now Venu has good idea which camera to go for. Too bad no comments from him. Raj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chip l. Posted August 1, 2003 Share Posted August 1, 2003 LOL, maybe he had better thoughts about getting in the middle.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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