DEET and Cameras....

[james_tarquin2]

Here's an interesting question...

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Many cameras are made out of plastic these days. As I understand it, DEET (n-diethyl-m-toluamide), which is the most effective insect repellent used today, is highly corrosive of plastics. [DEET products, like "Deep Woods OFF", and "Jungle Juice" have been known to eat through water bottles.]

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Having stated these two comments, has anyone had experience with DEET <i>harming</i> their camera equipment?

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[bob: this seems to me to be a nature question, but I'll move it if it's more appropriate elsewhere]

[vince_farnsworth1]

Yes. Be very carefull with this stuff. According to Lepp, the 20% stuff works as well as the 100% formula, so I'd go for that. Also, you can get it in a roll-on and lotion form so spraying is eliminated. Some also include sunblock. I recently bought some of these variants for an upcomoing trip to Hawaii and will report back on their effectiveness. DEET partially dissolved a plastic lens hood that touched my treated arm. Others have reported similar experiences in related earlier threads. By the way, I recently tried a product called "AfterBite" (I think there are others, also) that works well to relieve the effects of bites. If you get to the bite early, the itching and swelling don't even occur. It evidently works by neutralizing the "venom" before it has a chance to take effect. Highly recommended.

[ted_hendy]

The short answer is don't mix DEET and photography. It is very harmful to plastics. If you are in a situation where you have no alternative solution (such as other repellents or mosquito armor)then I suggest a spray bottle of DEET and then only spray your collar, pants, and hat. Do not get it on your hands or you'll start to feel a slimy, sticky substance on your fingers after you use your camera. I'm not sure of the effect on the leader of the film during loading, but it can't be good for it. I'd be interested in hearing what folks do in Alaska during the summer. I hear it's miserable up there from the bugs. With luck I'll find out someday.

[james_tarquin2]

I'm heading to a mosquito-infested malaria areas in Africa, so I want to use powerful stuff...Don't want malaria!

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I also don't want to ruin my equipment! I wonder if I practice extreme caution and keep it off my hands.

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You raise an interesting point about the film! I bet it destroys film, too.

[kathy_wallace]

Vince, who is AfterBite made by?

 

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I use 100% Deet because I have bad reactions to bites. I usually have a bottle of water and towel handy to rinse the palms of my hands off after I apply the Deet. I only wash off my palms because I get bitten on the backs if I wash off all of my hands. So far (knock on wood), I haven't had any problems.

 

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I did have a pair of Tevas become very slimy in the past, so be sure to watch out for your shoes too!

[bobatkins]

Yes, DEET can dissolve plastics, including camera and lens parts.

I guess the thing you might want to ask yourself is given that

fact, do you really want to smear it all over your body too?

 

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It does seem to work, but so do some of the more "natural"

alternatives (though they probably don't work as well). When

the bugs get really bad, I wear a head net (you can work a camera

with one on, it's not real convenient, but it is possible and with

AF you don't need all that clear a view through the viewfinder).

That plus long pants and a long sleved shirt keep most of them

at bay. A total bug suit would be better, but that's probably a

bit much for most places (maybe not Alaska and the Canadian north

in summer though!).

[bobatkins]

I've used some "afterbite" remedies too. I think the stuff I got was

mostly ammonium hydroxide solution (smelled like it). Perhaps it

neutralizes the acid in insect bites? I can't say it worked really

well, but I think it was better than nothing. Maybe it depends on exactly what is biting you!

[don_baccus]

Regarding how strong a repellent to use, New Scientist reported on some research done about a year or so ago. This appears to confirm some of my own beliefs, i.e. "Skin So Soft" is mildly repellent to mozzies but the effect doesn't last long, citronella-based repellents don't work well, DEET is very effective. In their experiments, which involved spraying their hands and putting them into a box full of a known number of hungry mosquitos for a length of time then counting the bites, 20%-ish DEET was indeed just as effective as 98%+. This may be where Lepp got his figure, actually. I find 98%+ DEET (aka "Jungle Juice" and other brands) to be really vile stuff and stopped using it years ago.

 

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I use DEET in Great Basin marshes all the time, when photographing. I spray my clothes and bare skin (except, of course, my face). Afterwards, I wash my hands thoroughly to avoid getting any DEET on my camera gear. I've done this for many, many years and have never had a problem. Remember that you don't have to drench yourself in this vile chemical, lightly spraying yourself quickly and evenly works just fine. And it's effective for a few hours, though in hot weather I often sweat it off and have to redose.

 

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If the bugs aren't bad I just let them bite. After tens of thousands of mosquito bites over the decades, it just doesn't seem right not to have a few bites when your outdoors! But some areas, like the Great Basin marshes I love so much, are absolutely intolerable without repellent for much of June and early July.

 

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Even worse are the horseflies, named for their size which approaches Pegasus, I believe :) DEET works on them, too, and it's a good thing, because these guys HURT. The ones at Malheur NWR are about 3/4" long with big, nasty mouths and can fly faster than I can run.

[kathy_wallace]

I was very interested to hear about the studies comparing 20% with 100%. I'm going to try that instead of the 100% I've been using. Thanks for the info!

[james_tarquin2]

Don, Kathy, Bob,

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It sounds like you folks have dealt with the problem. In practice, do you find it difficult to keep the stuff off of your camera equipment? In theory, if you are careful, you can be pretty sure that it never touches your equipment...but stuff happens. You never know.

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Also, does anyone have a horror story (i.e. "I ruined my Nikon N90 with DEET")?

[ted___]

In a recent medical journal an article on insect repellants stated

that the military that used to use 100% DEET now only use 50%

and the recommended strengths for civilians is 35% for adults

and 10% for children. DEET is absorbed through the skin and

there are documented reports of severe neurotoxicity.

 

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The article goes on to mention that in addition to DEET the use

of pyrethrum spray on clothing (to the point of the clothing being

just damp) every two weeks produces about 98% effectiveness

in eliminating insect bites. Ted.

[jim_bridges]

I shoot in a swampy/marsh woodlands area in Southeast Texas, and the insects will carry you away, if you don't have some kind of repellent on. I had been using Deep Woods Off, and it's worked fine, but for the past few months I have been taking Vitamin B1 (100 mg each day). I will not say that it works 100% against inscets bites, because I still get a few, but I can tell the difference. These days I do not spray Off anywhere but the tops of my boots, socks, and pant legs up to my knee, and this is for chiggers. I'm not sure B1 will work on redbugs (it DON'T work for fireant's), and I'm NOT taking any chances! All I wear is long pants, t-shirt, and a bird hunting vest that I carry some photo stuff in. B1 seems to work real well on gnats, deerflies... the smaller cousin to the horsefly, but the bite is just as painful, and mosquitoes. Most of the insects will land on me, but not bite, it's like they are looking for a place to stick, and just can't find it, and fly off. I usually end up with two, or three mosquito bites, and this is from millions, and millions of them. I have been carrying the Off with me just in case I run into a deadly blood suckin' swarm, but so far I have not needed to use it as a backup.

 

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I got the information about Vitamim B1 on this forum "mosquito repellents while shooting" last September from Rose-Marie Burke's post, and decided to give it a try in May of this year (Skeeter season). It sure seems to work for me. Like I stated, it's not 100%, but it sure seems to helps.

[ShunCheung]

I didn't exactly ruin my N90 with Deet (I don't even have an N90 :-) ), but there are some finger-print markings on my N8008 body because I held it after using Deet in Florida. There were so many mosquitos that I had to use repellent.

 

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Speaking of trips to Africa, I was in Kenya during the dry season last year (August/September). At least when I was there, there were very few mosquitos. Morever, as far as I know, those mosquitos that transmit malaria are mainly active at night. I didn't use any repellent during my trip but most people in our group took Lariam for malaria prevention, and a few of us developed some reaction to Lariam. It would be a different story during the rainy season. Of course, I am not a medical doctor. For those who are traveling to Africa, check with your physician.

[chelsea]

I occasionally use some repellents with DEET when I'm in swampy areas that are really bad for mosquitoes...and also have a modified backpack for the camera gear that came with a water bottle included. After I use the spray, I use a small towel and a bit of water to wash off my hands. I had read earlier posts mentioning the possibility of etching your finger prints into your camera, I'm not willing to test the theory.

 

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I'm still using the vitamin B1. It worked very well on the blackflies that we have here in Ontario in springtime, but only slows down the mosquitoes and deerflies.

 

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There's a plant in the geranium family that you can get at some nurseries called "mosquito plant", I have a few of them, and sometimes hang a sprig or two either in my hair or on the pack, and swipe it over my clothes. Mosquitoes don't like it. When we hang a leaf or two over the bed in the trailer, any stray mosquitoes that get in there with us leave us alone. There are also some repellants that are supposed to have more "organic" ingredients, like citronella. I find that they are as effective as those containing DEET; however, I still cautious about getting them on the cameras.

[patrick_chase]

Hi James;

 

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If you're travelling to a part of the world where malaria is a real possiblity, then you may want to think about preventative medication if you haven't done so already. For the CDC's current publications on the topic, check out:

 

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http://aepo-xdv-www.epo.cdc.gov/wonder/prevguid/p0000409/p0000409.htm

 

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FWIW, the CDC suggests repellents with 20-35% DEET for mosquito-bite prevention.

 

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-- Patrick

[dan_miller]

I'd like to add that there are also some newer products that contain DEET that are time-released. The DEET is microencapsulated, which, supposedly, not only makes it last longer between applications, but also reduces aborption through the skin. Although I can't vouch for these claims, the stuff worked well for me on a canoe trip last month in Canada.

[don_baccus]

There's been a mention of pyrethrum spray. I believe (but am not certain) that this is the one proven very effective repellent against chiggers. Spraying on clothes, only, is essential with this stuff which is known to cause problems (unlike DEET, which is considered to potentially cause problems). You shouldn't use it on bare skin, which makes it less useful as a general mozzie repellent. You could always dose clothes with pyrethrum and skin with DEET, but since concern over pyrethrum is so much higher than with DEET, this seems a dubious choice unless you're in chigger country...

 

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As others have mentioned, certainly if you are going to malaria country, don't depend on repellent alone. See your Doc and take the proper prophylactic meds. Lariam has been gaining a reputation for causing problems, as has been mentioned, so make sure your Doc knows whether or not your destination area harbors malaria resistant to more traditional prophylactics.

[jesse_gutierrez]

I hear having more spices, onions, garlic, etc. in your diet helps repel mosquitos. Don't know how effective this would be on mosquitos but if it works on vampires...

[alex_aycrigg]

I've heard there is a new product invented by an independent entrepreneur that repels mosquitoes by masking the carbon dioxide we exude from our mouths and skin. It is supposed to be non-toxic and comes in the form of a bracelet instead of a fluid or lotion. If these things work, it should solve most problems for us all and our cameras.

[lloyd_nakatani]

After wiping on DEET lotion on all exposed skin including my face, I wipe my palms, fingers, and nose with a moist towellete. They come in convenient packets that I keep in my bag. I haven't had problems with DEET eating my cameras even though I got the lotion all over my hands when applying it.

[d._a._skip_higgins___]

I also 'react' to insect bites but continue to take photographs from my sea kayak...water & tiny flying vampires everywhere! So I use the B-1 thing and take antihistamine tablets to cut down on the inevitable reactions - no DEET!

 

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A product called "Green Ban" seems far better and is made with Citronella, Calendula, Cajuput and a serious bunch of other assorted stuff. It is produced by "Mulgum Hollow Farm", P.O. Box 225, Brookvale NSW 2100 Australia, but I buy it from an outfitter's store & catalog store called "Boundary Waters" in Eli, Minn. The stuff is great, sooths bites too and will not hurt the camera (unless ya dump the stuff inside it - an then, that's only a guess).

[marc_fraioli]

So have there been any studies of the health effects of DEET on humans? I mean, if it dissolves plastic....

[james_tarquin2]

Yes, there have been studies done. Apparantly, in higher concentrations, DEET is very harmful to children. However, it is supposed to be "safe" for adults in high concentrations. From what I've read, though, the toxins build up in your skin, the longer you use it. So you could gain a reaction over time.

[don_titus]

While on the topic of Deet and Bugs has anyone used the the net jackets and Pants (like a head net for your entire body)? A complete outfit is selling for about $65 and I was wondering if you can get by with Shorts and a short sleeve shirt under this or do the skeeters just bite right thru the mesh if it is against your skin?

[bill_speaks]

As another poster mentioned, mosquitos are drawn to the carbon dioxide we respire. I have found wearing light colored/cool clothing to be very helpful. I made the mistake of wearing a dark blue shirt in a humid mosquito infested area once and severely regretted it.