Worth of Rolleiflex Automatic X

[bob_lazzarini]

I have this camera to check out with a few rolls of film, and would

like to know what it is worth on the market. The owner is asking for $300.

 

It�s a Rolleiflex Automatic X with the Zeiss 75mm 3.5 lens. Serial No.

1127xxx.

 

-With the exception of one very small flex (foreign object) in the

taking lens, the glass is beautiful, with no haze, fungus, separation

or scratches.

 

-The shutter appears to work at all speeds, though its highest reading

on the scale is 1/250.

 

-The self timer works.

 

-The diaphragm is smooth and oil free and the focus is smooth.

 

-No dents and the black paint looks great, but for one minor and tiny

chip next to �DRF� in front of the focusing hood. There are some very

tiny �user� scratches near the winder handle.

 

-The leather is in excellent shape but for some bubbling/separation

above and near the winder handle.

 

-The leather ever ready case is near perfect except for wear of the strap.

 

I�m not concerned about the �flex� in the lens.

 

What I�ve read so far, on-line, is that the Automatic X is supposed to

have a higher shutter speed of 1/500. Where did it go? :-0

 

Thanks to everyone in advance for their interest and help.

[john lehman, college alask]

The shutter can only be set to the highest speed when it is uncocked -There is an extra spring which makes it hard to set above 1/250.

 

$300 for a 1949ish X sounds high. I have bought two beaters of that vintage for under $100, and bought and sold very clean Rolleiflexes from about 1960 for around $300

[geoff_mcauliffe]

$300 is too high for an Automat X unless it has just received a complete overhaul from a factory-trained Rollei technician or has a Maxwell focusing screen installed. I bought a mint MX-EVS with case, strap, Rollie hood, instruction book, and 3 piece Rolleinar #1 set for $250 but the shutter was sticky and did need a clean, lube and adjust. I think $200 is plenty unless you get lots of original Rollei accessories thrown in.

[lex_jenkins]

Unless that's a collectible model or an interesting variation of a common model that gives it some collectible status, $300 sounds high. I paid $350 for my Rollei 2.8C with S-K Xenotar in excellent condition with some original accessories - admittedly a very good bargain but a fair indication of relative market value.

[tito sobrinho]

I think the person is asking too much. Offer him $180.00. Rollei made a lot of Xs and it is very difficult to find one in excellent condition as it was extensively used by photojournalists in the 50's - the beginning of the Graflex demise.

[classcamera]

300 is way high,<P>

 

I typically sell good working Automat II, III for around 200. I would look on ebay and print some of the auctions that are for similar cameras, show them to the seller as a bargaining tool.

[harry_zet]

way too much - i got a mint t model with xenar, one of the last

ever made for 350 - and this is 30 years younger. do a search at

e*ay.de - here you can get one cheap

[bob_lazzarini]

Gentlemen,

 

Thank you very much for your input and suggestions.

 

I'm still perplexed with the supposed top shutter speed of 1/500 since the last marking is only 1/250?

 

I'm still wondering where the 1/500 marking went, if it was ever there in the first place.

[nolan woodbury]

I'm inclined to disagree with the majority here. $300 for a good, working Automat X (Automat II, not to be confused with the older pre-and-post war Automatic Rolleiflex or the New Standard, all of which look similar) isn't too much for the camera, considering it can capably function and perform with most of the preceding MX/MX-EVS models which typically sell for that amount or more. It is, in fact, somewhat of a rare model with only 68.000 (for both type 1 and 2) being manufactured from 1949 to 1951. Compare those figures to the next generation of Rolleiflex TLR (MX) which Rollei cranked out roughly 228.000 units (both type 1 and 2) between '51 and '54. Source: Collectors Guide to Rollei Cameras by Arthur Evans.

 

I paid $500 for a early (type 1) Automat X five years ago in collectable condition (with case, caps, box and bill of sale) plus a receipt of service from Harry Fleenor. It is an exceptional camera; I'd stack the performance of its Zeiss-Opton Tessar against -any- Rollei TLR.

 

Finally Bob, I believe you must cock the shutter before advancing the shutter speed to 1/500. It'll feel a bit tight (using a very stiff spring to trip that quickly) but if it resists don't force it- Many Rollei TLR shooters never used the setting. If your description of the camera is accurate $300 + the cost of a normal CLA isn't a prohibitive price to pay for the camera. You could easily pass that figure trying to restore a heavily worn beater. In many cases, the more-expensive camera is the cheapest to own and use. Choose wisely.

[bob_lazzarini]

Nolan,

 

Thank you very much for your input.

 

The shutter markings go up to 1/250, and, as far as I can see, go no further regardless if the shutter is cocked or not. It has me a tad perplexed. Though it may be of no major consequence, it's something I'd like to have access to.

[classcamera]

Bob,

<P>

Does the shutter say Compur Rapid on it? If so, then it goes to 1/500 in a post war camera with a 1/250 on the shutter; a pre war Compur Rapid would have a 200 and 400 setting. You cannot set the shutter to the 1/500 setting if the shutter is cocked, it is interlocked to prevent this from happening since the added force necessary may bend some of the shutters delicate parts. <P>

 

What is more than likely the problem, making the shutter difficult to move to the 1/500 setting, is stiff grease in the shutter; it probably needs a good CLA. <P>

Nolan, I have owned, in the past 5 years, over a dozen 3.5 Tessar Rolleiflex cameras, they take great pictures when shot above f:8; below that number they are not sharp. My 3.5 Model E, with Xenotar lens is sharp down to 5.6, and makes a reasonable print at 3.5. I like the tessar cameras and sell them to student on a regular basis, they are however not as good as the Planar/Xenotar, nor do they fetch the same price. 300 bucks would be a good price for an Automat X, if it had the lens cap, case, box and manual, hood, some filters, and had been recently CLAed. Even using my bargain basement CLA, Bob would be hard pressed to recoupe his investment, down the road should he sell the camera.

<P>

All of these people are not wrong, the market is way down right now, do not pay peak market prices for a common user camera.

[bob_lazzarini]

Mark,

 

It is a Compur Rapid. Hopefully when I run some film through it this weekend, I'll have no problems.

If it does require a CLA, what would be a reasonable cost?

Thanks.

 

Gentlemen,

 

I greatly appreciate your input. Rollei's are entirely new for me.

[nolan woodbury]

Mark,

 

First of all, I appreciate your input here in this forum. Having a knowledgeable camera tech posting information certainly adds to the depth and quality of any discussion.

 

That said, I simply can't agree that the Planar/Xenotar equipped cameras offer enough -if any- difference or improvement in image quality to justify the prices. Other features, like metering and removable finders, better stock screens or the fact the E's and F's are just simply newer could certainly make a difference to the would- be shooter. I'll admit to keeping every fixed lens TLR I shoot with (regardless of lens) to a minimum of F8/11, but it has been my finding in many years of professional motorcycle photography and composing that I'm more inclined to shoot smaller apertures (f16 or f22) than wider ones. I just haven't seen much need to shrink the DOF that much. In this case (or in my situation) shooting with a 3.5F or 2.8 over a MX-EVS renders no advantage. I know of many veteran shooters who have reached the same findings. Please don't get me wrong; I'm not against the newer bodies and lenses, I just -in all honestly- feel they are over-hyped.

 

As for market depression in the classic camera world, you're probably right; nearly every serious money sapping hobby activity is down these days. Still, it seems to me that I drop a minimum of $500 into any TLR I'm preparing for serious shooting, be it a Rolleiflex, Kalloflex, or Minolta Autocord. Finally, I still find it difficult to believe that $300 for a quality Rollei is over priced when compared to newer MF SLR systems and lenses...but I like a deal as much as the next fellow...

 

Again, I appreciate your input and I'm not the only one-