N65 Vs N80

[bdighe]

I am very much beginner in photography. I am planning to buy my first

SLR.

I am bit confused between Nikon N65 and N80. Will it make sense to go

for N80

as I am a complete beginner.

As per my understanding the major difference between N65 and N80 is

spot metering.

Are there any other major enhancements in N80 over N65 ?

Would spot metering be a critical factor when I will learn the

details of photography ?

 

Thanks

-Bharat

[sliu]

"Would spot metering be a critical factor when I will learn the details of photography ?"

 

 

Not necessary. The only two exposure controls are f/stop and shutter speed (with some type of film loaded). Basically you can do anything with combination of these two. Meters in camera are good tools to help you to make the decision on those two factors and sometimes the camera makes the decision for you. A spot meter can help you with the scenes with dramatic lights. But with experience and bracket, you can do it with any meters.

 

Here is an example. There are both matrix metering and spot metering on my coolpix digital camera but I can not set f/stop and shutter speed myself. The only control I have is the exposure compensation. Since I have lot of experience with matrix metering + exposure compensation, I can make almost correct exposure without bracket. The first image is shot with matrix metering and -2 EV exposure compensation.<div></div>

[sliu]

Then I decided to use spot metering (at the Empire State Building) and -1.3 EV. The exposure seems a little bit low if you are interested in the details in the cloud. But if you are only interested in the light on the building, this exposure is better than the previous one. Photography is both science and art, sometime the subjective opinion matters. Personally I like the first one. But this has nothing to do with the meter.<div></div>

[lachaine]

It's hard to answer this without knowing more about you, as opposed to the potential cameras. Would you ever use spotmetering? Hard to say. It's something that can easily be lived without. Would you ever need to set a film ISO speed that is different than the automatic DX setting? How about higher flash sync speed? The F80 is built more solidly, and it is full-featured (not really missing any important features compared to other cameras (it doesn't have mirror pre-lock, but even the F100 doesn't either). In my opinion, the F80 is the least expensive new Nikon that a person can live with as his or her only camera once they become a bit more advanced. You might never use some features, but it's nice to know they are on there if you ever need them. If you really want to learn photography, the more expensive FM3a would be your best best, or you might consider a used FM2. With a couple of good books and a manual camera, you can potentially learn a lot more about focus (depth of field, what to focus on, etc.) and exposure - but only if that's what you want.

[jason michael]

IMHO there are many many differences between the F65 and the F80. I recently

upgraded a friend's F65 to the F80 because the damn thing takes control of it's

controls too often (it reverts to multipe AF focus sensors, it switches the metering

when using continuous shots, the damn AF Assist is not cancelable, and that's just off

the top of my head). If you want to have control of your camera OR if you want to

learn how to truly take photos forget about the F65 and go with the F80. The F65 is

unpleasant to handle, again in my humble opinion...

[dan_andrews]

Bharat, one obvious difference is price, and if you think you want to ivnest in a camera which will last you for several years as you grow into photography, then the N80 is the better choice. But if you want to explore photography a bit because you're not sure it's for you, then go for the N65.

 

The N65 is a good camera, and it lets you shoot a lot without getting caught up in technical matters. This lets you focus on composition, color, shapes, etc. A good friend of mine recently wanted a new camera, and this was the advice I gave him--and he loves the N65.

 

The N80 is a more advanced camera and allows you the chance to use full program (without getting technical) but over time you can begin to use more features on the camera. This camera is highly versatile and offers many photographers everything they need. Another good friend of mine was looking for a new camera, and I advised him to get the N80. He loves it, too.

 

Spot metering is a good example of a feature you may someday use, but you probably wouldn't start off with it. Matrix metering covers 99% of a beginner's needs. But if you get more advanced, you WILL want spot metering at some point.

 

One nice benefit to both cameras is that they will work with a wide variety of Nikon gear (except MF lenses--argh!) and if you learn one camera, you basically know the controls on the other.

 

If you have other questions, feel free to ask--I'll be glad to help.

 

Happy shooting,

[david_h._hartman]

I would not even consider an N65. Im sorry if this is stepping on some peoples toes. Philip Greenspun said, "The Nikon N65 does not merit a full photo.net review because.."<br>

<br>

<a href="http://www.photo.net/nikon/n65"><u>http://www.photo.net/nikon/n65</u></a>

<br>

<br>

I thought this was rather flippant when I first read this but later fully agreed. A friend who repairs these thing has little good to say about the N65. He see a number of them, subcontracted from Ritz, with busted shutter release buttons. Cheap zooms fail and some folks push extra hard on the release trying to make the camera focus. The release switch gets smashed, is not repairable or available separately so a $65.00 module is required. He also see a number of N65(s) with broken latches that require a replacement back cover. He says the covers are always on backorder. I dont think this is a good way to spend your hard earned money. If you do buy a low end camera consider an unlimited replacement warranty.<br>

<br>

I recommend a Nikon FM3a or F100. If you just cant swing it consider an F/N80. The N80 has nearly the same control layout as the F100. I think the FM3a is better for a beginner if you seriously want to learn about photography. I recommand a clean used 50/1.8 AI or early AIS lens or 50/1.4 AIS (late). If you want an easy to use camera and with better lenses get an AF with a AF 50/1.8D or 1.4D. If you get a cheap zoom and use the camera on program you will get results that are indistinguishable from a zoom P&S camera.<br>

<br>

Here is a good article to read before buying your first SLR...<br>

<br>

<a

href="http://www.vothphoto.com/spotlight/articles/forgotten-lens.htm"

target="_new"><u>The Forgotten Lens</u></a><br>

<br>

I favor prime lenses at first, then a few good zooms. There are gems but they are usually expensive and have limited "Zoom Appeal," 2 to 3x range. Am I opinionated? Yes.<br>

<br>

Anyway hope this helps,

[mats_hellman]

Well if you're a complete beginner, my advice would be not to buy a new camera. second hand is the way to go for your wallet.

 

How about a second hand slr with a 50 mm 1.8 or so. shouldn't cost that much. At low cost you can find out if you like photografy, and if you do then you will have more knowledge to base youre decicion on.

 

I have to admit the above is not what I did, but in hindsight this would have maybe been 'wiser'. I turned out to love photografy so eveythings just fine, but well, I do realise that if I bought old stuff to start with I would have been at the same level now.

 

IF you want to choose between these two camera's, the go for the f80, but only if you get some nice glass in the meantime. I found the f65 to be 'just not it'.

 

I do actually use spotmetering a lot. I find I have a lot of control.

 

good luck and remember to spend more money on the glass then on the camera.

[scott_blair1]

Get an FM2, get an F100. Sounds like another N65 vs. N80 thread. Just get something you can afford. Whatever you get, you will want something else in a year or two.

[jwenting]

The F80 is far more than an F65 with spot metering.

I wouldn't trust mr. Greenspun's review of any Nikon gear though, he's heavily biassed against the entire brand...

 

What you get:

<ul>

<li>spotmetering</li>

<li>manual filmspeed setting</li>

<li>custom options</li>

<li>more sturdy construction</li>

<li>depth of field preview button</li>

<li>focus area selector</li>

<li>a camera that just looks better :-)</li>

</ul>

 

And all that for not much more than the price of an F65.

 

Spotmetering isn't essential to learn the ropes, but I wouldn't want a camera without manual filmspeed setting and DOF preview button.

 

Even if you'd be happy with the F65 now you're likely to want to upgrade it to an F80 sooner or later. Better buy the F80 now, it offers far more growth potential.

[ShunCheung]

If you want a film SLR from Nikon, I think the N80 is probably the best camera for beginners today. To get started, just use all manual settings to learn about aperture and shutter speed combinations, but when you need it, matrix metering is also available.

 

Personally, I think the spot meter is very useful for intermediate and advanced photographers, but it is also a great learning tool for those who shoot slides. A spot meter will help you understand how bright the highlights and shadows are from medium tone. I can only wish this feature were available when I learned photography some 30 years ago.

 

IMO, having matrix metering and the spot meter makes the N80 a much better learning tool than any FM2 or FM3a. It has most of the features in the more advanced F100 at a fraction of the price and can last a few years as your photography skills improve.

[david_h._hartman]

<em>"Sounds like another N65 vs. N80 thread. Just get

something you can afford." --Scott Blair <br>

</em><br>

This sums it up perfectly: If you are serious buy an N80 and in a

couple of years you will want an F100, perhaps even an FM3a. If

not buy an N65 and in a couple of years you will want something

more convenient and will want a pocketable P&S. <br>

<br>

Im going to reverse my recommendation regarding a full

replacement warrantee because IMXO if you break either you will

have the excuse to buy what you really should have bought in the

first place. <br>

<br>

If you buy an N65 get it will a cheap kit zoom. If you buy an N80

get it with an AF 50/1.8 or 1.4.<br>

<br>

Opinionatedly your,

[Guest]

<B>Jeroen,</b><P>What's wrong with the depth-of-field preview on the F65?<P>It has selectable focus area too, though a bit more fiddly. Surely the big drawback to the "growth potential" of the F80 is its inability to meter with manual-focus lenses. And as I pointed out in a previous thread, its viewfinder is hardly a huge improvement on the F65.<P>And as for a camera that looks better, pull the other one! Unless you're talking about an F4 or a black F Photomic Tn...<P><B>David,<P></b>Why should Bharat get the zoom with the F65 and the prime with the F80? Are F80-users so much better photographers?<P>I use an F65 and a 50mm. It's my first SLR, and I got the combo because it was cheap, versatile and wasn't too much of an investment to lose once I'd decided what I needed from a camera.<P>Why bother with a new F80? Get a used F4: 100% viewfinder, mirror lock-up, bright viewfinder for easy manual focusing, full metering (including matrix) with MF lenses, and <i>far, far</I> better-looking and more durable than this <B>F80, the wannabe F100!</B><P><B>Bharat,</B><P>The F65 fills its niche in the market: for ignorant people out there who think a better camera will make them a better photographer and aren't rich enough to buy an F80 or Leica M7 or Hasselblad or whatever to achieve the same thing <I>and</I> for people like me and a few others on this forum, who want a camera that offers enough options for a new photographer <I>on a budget</I>.<P>It's not ideal. With hindsight I <I>might</I> have started with a different camera. But I have no idea which. As with anything, look at the differences between the cameras, look at what this might mean (as you are doing) and what you might want to do in the future.<P>Trouble is, you need to have been photographing a while before you appreciate what you do and don't need.<P>As for spotmetering, yes, I regretted that I didn't have it before I got the camera. But none of the Nikon MF cameras has a spotmeter.<P>In short, I chose the F65 over the F80 because in the UK the F80 is a serious amount of money more than the F65, and I could see that the F80 fell a long way short of being <I>my</I> ideal camera, so it wasn't worth it. But <I>you</I>, and others here, may decide differently.

[Guest]

<B>Jason,</B><p><I>if you want to learn how to truly take photos forget about the F65 and go with the F80</I><P>What do you mean by that?

[Guest]

<B>David,</B><P>Glad you're linking to the forgotten lens. Gary Voth took it off his site during a recent redesign. I emailed him about it, and he felt flattered enough that someone cared about it that he put it back up again. It's a delightful article and one I always go back to whenever I think 50mm isn't enough.

[cate]

Dear Jason,

 

N65 can also cancel the AF assist.

 

Dear Bharat,

 

You can compare the diffrence between some nikon camera (include N80 and N65, which is F80 and F65 in this web site) in bellow web site.

 

http://www.nikon.com.sg/PRODUCT/slrcamera/SLR_compare.pdf

[david_h._hartman]

<em>"Why should Bharat get the zoom with the F65 and the

prime with the F80? Are F80-users so much better photographers?"

--ian brunton<br>

</em><br>

<strong>Gratuitous Sarcasm?</strong><br>

<br>

<em>"Why bother with a new F80? Get a used F4: 100%

viewfinder, mirror lock-up, " --ian brunton<br>

</em><br>

You probably cant drive nails with an F4(s) but its a

robust camera. If one has both battery packs you have a choice of

camera weights. The metering is a little weird for macro with

tubes but all in all its a fine camera.<br>

<br>

I started with a Nikkormat FTn then sold it to my father and got

a used Nikon F with 135/2.8 and traded that lens for a 105/2.5.

For a while I used a Gossen Pilot or Super Pilot then switched to

a LunPro. I cant argue against an F4 but then perhaps Im

lunatic. <br>

<br>

My cousins son has an Nikon FE more of less on permanent

loan from his grandfather. Hes got a 24/2.8, 35/2.0, 55/2.8

Micro, 75~150/3.5, 105/2.5 and 200/4.0, add another body and Id

call that a system. He wants a digital camera. He would just as

soon sell that fine collection of glass for a DSLR and one zoom.

I suggested adding a Nikon D100 and a hand held light meter. The

idea of using an external light meter appeared to horrify him. I

dont know, the power of advertising?

[jason michael]

Ian,

 

The F65 is deceitful as it often changes more than one setting when you, the

photographer, change one. But hey if you own an F65 and are willing to work with it

then more power to you.

 

Psychologically speaking, when humans make decisions the

first unconscious (and sometimes conscious) motivation is "How will this effect

me"...Ian we may be discussing the camera you own but ultimately we are assisting

someone who has not bought a camera yet. Furthermore, once we commit to a

decision we will feel stronger that it is the correct one (thus if I owned an F65 I would

defend it too).

 

P.S. any camera with pictures of little heads, mountains, flowers, a guy playing tennis,

or a moon does NOT get my respect.

[jason michael]

Kung,

 

Does the F65 allow you to cancel the auto focus assist illuminator as the defaut or do

you have to do it with every shot? On the F80 you just select custom setting 18 and

voila it's off (or heaven forbid on) as default.

[cate]

Yes, you need to do it in every shoot. You need to hold down the focus area selection button while you depress the shutter. It means you need to press two button at one time!

[Guest]

Jason,<P>I take your point, but we're discussing the camera I'm going to <I>get rid of </I>quite soon. I have <I>no </I>particular brief to defend it, but it irritates me when people say you can't take proper photos on the F65 because it hasn't got this and that. You <I>still </i>haven't explained why you can't truly learn to take photos on an F65. It might not be as conducive to learning the hard way as taking an FM and working it all out, but most people learn to take photos without spot metering or ISO speed changing or both.<P>I work with it in manual focus and aperture priority most of the time. I never use the landscape modes etc., or flash, and autofocus only in bright daylight at small apertures. So maybe I don't find it any more limiting than the N80.<P>I'm afraid the N90(s) will have to lose your respect, too. Maybe the twee little pictures you despise are on the back of the camera rather than the dial, but they're still there.<P>And while we're dissing cameras, even before I bought the F65 I had come to the conclusion that any camera with a <I>built-in flash </I>loses my respect. So yah boo sucks! And I think chrome Leica M6TTLs look amateurish. Your FM3a had better be black!<P>I thought I had made the point that I considered the F65 an adequate camera at its price point. I do not doubt that the F80 has more things to play around with on it.

[Guest]

Poor Bharat! He must be quite frustrated by all our childish bickering!<P>Bharat, pick something you feel comfortable with and don't squander the rent on it. And to confuse things, I'd bear in mind the F75 - all depends on what you're prepared to pay and what you'd have to pay for them where you are, and what you want...

[Guest]

You might want to look at <a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=0056sN&unified_p=1">this thread</a>.

[jason michael]

Actually Ian, I painted my FM3A yellow!

[Guest]

That figures...has to match your new Hasselblad, I suppose? 8^)