Strobes versus Hot lights

[joel_collins]

I want to eventually setup and small, somewhat basic, and

definately low cost studio for photographs of people, still life,

etc. Can anyone out there comment on the pros and cons of stobes

(they pop like regular flashes) and "hot lights" (that are on all

the time). Does anyone have experience with the newer "hot

lights" like the Photoflex Starlight?

 

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I recently worked for a day as an assistant to a professional

product photographer based in NYC. I was suprised to see that he

uses hot lights exclusively. He said they are more "refined" and

you get exactly what you see. That got me thinking about hot

lights.

 

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Thanks for any comments or suggestions.

 

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Joel Collins

jwc3@mindspring.com

http://www.mindspring.com/~jwc3

[craig_shearman]

Joel,

There are advantages to both hot lights and strobes.

 

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Hot lights definitely give you more for the money. Even brand new, the most expensive Lowell units are under $200 each at B&H or any major camera store. You can have a main light, fill, background light and hair light for around $750, maybe less. (That doesn't include stands, umbrellas, barn doors or other accessories. But you can buy these piecemeal as you need them.) I highly recommend the Lowell line of equipment. It's extremely extensive, very versatile and very reasonably priced. They're in Brooklyn; call and get their catalog, which explains everything very well and also offers many lighting tips.

 

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With hot lights, it's very easy to see what you're getting. What you see is literally what you get.

 

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The disadvantage of hot lights is that they're hot and constantly bright. If you're photographing people in a small space they can make your subject uncomfortable and some people don't like the glare. They can also wilt flowers or melt plastic used up close.

 

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If you're shooting on location and have to break down the equipment after your shoot, they take maybe 15 minutes to cool off.

 

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Strobes have the advantage of not putting off a lot of heat and not being bright except for the brief instant when the flashtube goes off. The disadvantage is their price, which can run into the thousands. One disadvantage is that less expensive units (like the $150 units sold under names like Studio Pro) have tiny little modeling lights that don't put off enough light to see to focus easily or tell what effect you're getting.

 

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I own two Novatron monolights of 200 watt seconds. (M240S is the model number). These give me f/16 at 10 feet bounced into a 45-inch umbrella on ISO 400 film. I paid about $250 each at B&H. I intend to buy two more so I'll have the full complement of main, fill, background and hair light for portaits. I currently use a Lowell Pro Light hot light as a hair light and improvise with another Lowell or a Vivitar 283 strobe for a background light (which I don't always use). Novatron (based in Dallas, get their catalog) makes both monolights and strobes that use a power pack and heads.

 

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I own Lowell Totas, Omnis and Pro Lights for my video work.

 

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If you do a lot of portraits, buy strobes. People expect strobes from a still photographer, for what it's worth.

 

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Also, I recommend against buying hot lights as a kit. It's cheaper to buy them piecemeal and see what accesories you need. The kits usually gouge you for a case you won't need unless you go on location a lot and accessories you may or may not use. As for strobes, buy monolights piecemeal but if you get a pack and heads and have the money you might go for a kit.

[j._law]

The big disadvantage that I've found is that hot lights are not always 5600K. Tungsten lights are maybe around 2800k, halogens are around 3200k. The only hot lights taht are close to 5600K are the GE/Kodak "blue" hotlights that are rated somewhere near 5200K, but they last about 3-6hrs and are about 6$/bulb at a local store. <p>

 

 

 

With lights that aren't 5600K, this has clear implications -- either shoot with a filter over your lens or over the light (which makes you lose at least 2 or more stops).<p>

 

 

 

With atleast decent hotlights and a photoflood (balanced at 5200K) you still need a 5200->5600K adapter for chrome (and photofloods really change their colour a LOT) and EVEN then from 5 feet away I still need to shoot at say f5.6 or so.<p>

 

 

 

Strobes will pretty easily get you to f11 or f16, and you can pop them several times quickly to get a good fill. <p>

 

 

 

Also, photofloods are HOT. which means no gels close up, and they tend to really make people irritated. *grin*<p>

 

 

 

That's just my perspective. Yes, they are cheaper, but they're also a big hassle, especially when it comes to the colour. <p>

 

 

 

That's just my opinion.<p>

 

 

 

Jon.

[craig_shearman]

A few comments on color temperature and hot lights.

 

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Quartz and tungsten lights designed for photographic use are 3200 degrees Kelvin. Photoflood bulbs are usually 3400 degrees and can be bought in "blue" versions around 5500 degrees. Household light bulbs are around 2800 degrees.

 

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For black and white, color temperature within these ranges is not an issue.

 

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For color you have the following options:

 

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--Shoot tungsten/3200 degree balanced film. Several transperancy films and a limited number of negative films are available.

--Use a filter over the camera lens and lose a stop or two

--Use a CTB gel over the lights and lose a stop or two.

--Have the lab adjust color balance when printing from the negative. My lab, CPQ Colorchrome in Cleveland, TN, has done this for me with excellent results.

 

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I do not recommend photoflood bulbs. They are just as hot as quartz/tungsten but put out far less light. They are cheaper ($6 a bulb vs. $20) but last only a few hours.

 

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Craig Shearman/Baltimore

[michael_canter]

I note you recently assited at a pro shoot. I think thats a very good idea. I suggest you try to do a lot of that, especially with different photogs. You will get experience with a lot of different gear & techniques. This will help you to evolve your own style & make better informed equipment purchases. You have a big advantage by being in/near NYC, one of the most active pro markets in the world. If you are sharp you can gain a great education (and get paid while learning).

 

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The closest continuous light to daylight are HMI lights. They are incredible, both in performance and price. Most people can't justify buying them but you should be able to rent them easily.

 

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BTW, the "blue" photo floods are officially rated @ 4800K. They work ok for prints (if the lab fiddles a bit) but are not close enough to true daylight for chromes (depending on your quality standards).

[henry_stanley]

For small setups shooting very shiny objects -- lots of highlights & reflections -- I use 3400 degree K. photofloods with an 80B filter (filter factor 1X -- open one stop). Works great for chromes and color negs. I've even screwed up and used 3200 K bulbs and 80B filter (200K off) with color neg film and the printer made the corrections automatically, no sweat.

 

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If you shoot a lot of Polaroids with strobes for the shiny stuff, all is good, but the floods make highlight and glint control so much easier. Also build tents with white full weight muslin, with the lights outside.

 

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Putting all the hot lights on one foot switch so you can turn them off and on with no hassle keeps temps and tempers down.

[philip_dixon]

of course, if you're shooting black and white, the color temperature doesn't make a bit of difference, and hot lights are definitely a better value. even quartz-halogen.

[guy_van_den_bril___]

>of course, if you're shooting black and white, the color temperature

>doesn't make a bit of difference, and hot lights are definitely a

>better value. even quartz-halogen.

 

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I'm sorry but I have to disagree with this statement.

Of course the color temperature of the lights is important. It has the same effect as using coloured filters for B/W images. Using a 3200K source instead of the daylight temp of flash is like having an orange filter on the lens.

Also remember that ISO rating of B/W film depends on color temperature. A lower color temp means a lower ISO rating to obtain the same shadow detail and development has to be compensated for this.

 

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Personally I like the comfort of the cool flash strobes. Since I also prefer the image I get with low color temp lights (tungsten) I used to filter all strobes with a LEE 204 Full C.T. Orange filter. Gives me the skin tones I prefer!

 

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Guy Van den Bril,

e realisatie vzw - Belgium

[joel_collins]

I'm the original poster. Just wanted to report back and let everyone know what I finally did. I finally decided on strobes rather than hot lights. I bought a used Speedotron 1202 power pack with 4 heads. I kinda went crazy, but I shouldn't need to upgrade for a long time. I have a few stands and umbrellas, too. I've been using this setup for a month or so to do portraits, and I am getting excellent results. I'm shooting with my Pentax 67 and 135mm lens. Most exposures are at f22 or f32 with a bounce umbrella, so I have plenty of light. I'll be photographing my new kitchen soon, and should have enough power for the whole room, too.

 

I strongly recommend strobes for portraits. My models have noticed a little heat from the strobes, so I can't imagine how bad the hot lights would be. Besides, who wants to take shots of people squinting from the bright hot lights?

 

Thanks for all the posts.

 

Joel Collins | jwc3@mindspring.com | http://www.mindspring.com/~jwc3

[steve_hovland]

Strobes are also nice because they cancel out the vibrations from mirror slap and shutter movement, so you can get maximum image quality out of your film.