Mamiya C220 and Flash

[aki_dick]

hello there.

i just bought an old version of the c220 with a black 2.8/80 lens.

unlike the later c220f the camera does not have a flash shoe, so i

guess i'll have to argue with pc connection for the first time...

my questions and assumptions are the following:

 

1) can i use any type of flash with this camera? for example an canon

299t? (this would be of advantage because i need one for my F1N

anyway)

 

2) i need a pc-cable and an adaptor pc-connection/hotshoe. are there

different ones to get? and will i need one that offers the usual three

connections that these canon flashes have on their shoe?

 

3) i guess the pc-connection will only transmitt the release signal

for the flash, will i therefore have to use manual settings on the

flash all the time?

 

i have looked through all forums and all mentioned mamiya-tlr links in

extenso, but i couldn't find any information.

 

thanks for any suggestions and help.

aki dick

[jim_seaman]

Hello,

 

My C330 has a (cold) shoe but there's no means for triggering it... I'd be surprised if any of them do since the shutter is in the lens and not on the camera body. I've always used the pc cord.

 

1. I'm not familiar with the Cannon 299t (or any Cannon flashes for that matter.), but a dedicated flash for my Nikon (sb-22) or my generic sunpak 383 work fine. If the flash does not have provisions for a pc cable, you can get a 'foot' with one attached. its basically a 'hot shoe' with only the center pin being hot and a pc cable coming from the bottom. You can slide the shoe into your cold shoe, then the flash into it and then hook up the pc cable and you are ready to go.

 

2. I believe only the center connection is the one that will be live... The others are for internal distance calculation and metering for the Cannon.

 

3. Yes, though some manual flashes (like the sunpak 383) have a couple of auto settings for f-stops.

 

To be honest, I don't like the location of the shoe at all on my C330 as it makes the camera hard(er) to hold. I bought a cheap, used flash bracket that screws into the tripod mount and the top of the handle has another cold shoe to slide the flash into. (I think I paid $2 for it at a garage sale.)

 

Hope this is helpful,

 

Jim

[todd frederick]

I just purchased the same camera/lens combo.

 

You will need to get a flash bracket that attaches under the camera in the tripod hole and provides a hand grip on the left side. The flash fits on top of the grip. I use a Stroboframe QuickFlip unit that I used with my 35mm, but I had to build a square platform for the camera to sit on since I prefer a flash that is over the lens. I believe Stroboframe makes a QuickFlip unit for medium format cameras. Mamiya also make it's own flash grip unit for the TLR cameras, but the flash is on the side. You can find these for sale on eBay. Look under Mamiya Grip, or Mamiya flash grip, or Mamiya TLR, and so on. I think I found some listed when I was searching under Mamiya C220. You need to hunt for it on eBay.

 

Even the attached flash shoe on the side of the C220f is not a hot shoe, and, being on the side, it less than useless. The flash is triggered on these cameras at the lens and you will need a PC adapter. You can use any flash as long at it is not in the TTL mode. Most flashes have either full manual or "automatic" capability (where a flash sensor reads the amount of light and controls the output). I use a Vivitar 283 in Auto mode.

[graflite]

Hi....

You might check out www.paramountcords.com

 

They carry a full line of stock cords with all types of tips.

Have a look for what you need for both strobe & shutter connections.

 

If what you need isn't a stock cord, they would likely be able to make a custom cord for you. I have had several cords made by them and they are very well made and reliable.

 

Hope this helps.

[ahaohio]

One thing to remember when using flash with a C220 is to check the setting of the "X - M" switch. (Found on the lens).

 

If this switch by accident is in the "M" position an electronic flash will synchronize properly with the shutter.

[tata_ghosh]

Yes, you need a PC chord. You could get one which has a PC socket on one end and a hot-shoe at the other. That way you can mount any flash, regardless of whether it has a PC socket of its own or not, on the hot-shoe end. The PC connector end of the cable needs to connect to the synch terminal on the lens. The �switch� needs to be on �X�, not �M� (you will find it near the PC synch socket on the lens).

 

Dedicated TTL flashes (primarily designed to be used with certain bodies even in their manual modes) might sometimes have a problem with this setup, because when they detect a hot-shoe they might disable certain modes; but actually this hot-shoe (one end of your PC chord) is not a full-fledged device and can only transmit the release signal. I face this problem with my Sigma EF430 Super and the particular PC chord I got. You will also find threads here which will say that dedicated Nikon flashes such as the SB-28 can get damaged by short-circuit when mounted on certain types of shoes that are not intended for their use (particularly cold-shoes, which are just plain pieces of metal). If you have a normal non-TTL flash such as the Vivitar 283 mentioned above or a Vivitar 285 which I use with the C330, that works best. Otherwise any flash which has an efficient manual mode will do.

 

I would also strongly recommend spending 2 hours understanding the manual setting of your flash using the GN number, film ISO and flash-to-subject distance. It is not cumbersome or complex at all. Really worthwhile just reading through it once in your manual. If you�re accustomed to TTL flash in 35mm, I can bet that you�ll be left unhappy with the �automatic� setting in most flashguns which uses the flash�s own sensor.

[ian_gordon_bilson]

Ake - I'm sure you meant to say that with the lever in the "M"

position, the flash will NOT synchronise with the shutter..

I've used a blob of hot glue to fix mine in the X position..

[ahaohio]

Yes Ian - i forgot the *NOT* The blob of glue is a good idea. I may try that.

 

Have not had any trouble with the flash setting so far though. A far more frequent problem is the "120/220" lever that sometimes by accident gets pushed over to the "220" side which in turn makes the frame spacing go out of whack....

[dave schlick]

for those that do have a cold flash shoe on thier mamiyas tlr , remember your using a square format, turn the flash up with camera on its side and shoot yhour shot looking into the focus screen strait out to the side.. .. comes out great.. also a good method for taking shots of that hard to get individual that avoids cameras.. takes a little figuering to work it on a tripod. dave..

[ricky_cox1]

I've had very good luck with the Vivitar 283 on a C330 and a C3, both of which I beieve have a cold shoe in the same spot (top left side of body) as the 220. I would not try using the 283 in the on-camera shoe because the plastic foot is apparently the achilles heel of an otherwise workhorse flash. I think the weight of the flash hanging off the side combined with the massiveness of the camera would eventually crack the shoe used handheld. Also you'd always get ugly side shadows if you didn't turn the camera on its side as suggested earlier. You'd need a very sturdy tripod for that and I'm sure I couldn't manage it all when handholding the camera. The Mamiya grip with built in trigger is better, but the flash, though now upright, is still off center and still not high enough above the lens to do away with red-eye or hide the shadow behind your subject. I found a Stroboframe holder on e-bay just for square format MF cameras. You don't need a flip-flash (marvelous for 35mm) with the square format.

 

I don't have the model number at hand, but the Stroboframe bracket works great with the C3, 330 and the Vivitar 283 for these reasons: THe flash is centered over the lens, and can be adjusted up and down which helps with shadow/red-eye control, and (easy to overlook if you are accustomed to SLR's))leaves room to get your head over the finder, and to see your subject over the top of viewfinder. Also, the arm that holds the flash is set slightly forward, instead of right above the camera, which also improves access to the viewfinder.

 

The cold shoe has its own lock, which takes some pressure off the flimsy lock in the 283 foot, and it can be tilted to most any angle. It tilts more quickly than you can adjust the angle on the flash itself (0 t 90 degrees) for bouncing off a ceiling perhaps. Adjusting the flash head always feels destructive to me because the movement is very stiff and presents another chance to break off the plastic foot when attempted with the flash on camera.

 

There's also a little fold out leg, so the bracket can act as a cameras stand when (not if) your neck starts to hurt. The whole thing looks really awkward, but is set up so you can hold it in your left hand and trigger witht the right. It's all heavy, but surprisingly well balanced.

 

I use a Paramount coiled cord (very sturdy) wrapped a time or two around the bracket and rubber banded to keep it from in front of the lens.

 

Automatic settings on my 283's tend toward underexposure, so the advice about learning to use manual mode is good. However, shooting on manual all the time will lengthen cycle times, so consider some kind of extra power source if you think you'll be taking rapid sequence flash pictures of people. I found a Vivitar unit on ebay that holds 4 D batteries, a vast improvement over the 4 AA's that fit inside the flash. No doubt there are aftermarked units as well. This unit will fit on a belt or over the shoulder, and is, as you'd guess cumbersome and VERY conspicuous.

 

You will look and feel very strange toting all this mess around, but noone will mistake your intentions. Sorry for being so long winded.