No natural light

[rich_turner2]

<p>Hi all,<br>

I haven't posted here before but really wanted some advice / opinions.<br>

I'm not a pro, but I have shot a few weddings now, five as "the photographer" and a few others as a guest. I'm obviously very much in the newbie category, but I get results that both myself and the couples and guests have been pleased with.<br>

I have a really tricky one coming up though, my sisters. Unfortunately (for me) she's getting married in an old cinema. Very cool building but absolutely no natural light! Strobes aren't really an option as the cinema is for the ceremony. I guess all I can really do is go really high on the iso and use a tripod. Not ideal, especially as I'm as 7d user, but without buying a 5diii, which I can't really afford, I don't think I have a lot of options.<br>

The cinema does have lighting of course, but probably not the most flattering.<br>

Anyone got any tips or suggestions (apart from running a mile!) I have warned my sister that it's going to be really tough etc and she has accepted that (she's done photography so she does get it) but obviously I want to do my best.<br>

Thanks,</p>

<p>Rich</p>

<p> </p>

[william-porter]

<p>Rich,</p>

<p>You seem to have a good understanding of the challenge — and I'm afraid I can't think of much more to suggest. The three elements of exposure are all pretty inflexible:</p>

<ul>

<li><strong>You can't open the aperture wider than your widest lens.</strong> Of course it would be good to have an f/1.4 lens here. On the 7D a 50mm would be good, but a 35mm might be better (depending on how wide you need to go and where you'll be located). If all you've got is an f/2.8, well, you're losing 2 stops. Renting an f/1.4 might be worth it. 50 f/1.4 lenses can often be gotten quite cheaply — $200 or not much more than. Worth getting if you don't have one already. (You didn't mention your lenses.)</li>

<li><strong>You can't slow the shutter down much beyond 1/30th sec</strong>, even if the camera's on a tripod, because at some point subject movement becomes a problem, even if camera movement isn't. And 1/30th second is is pushing it, for some subjects. </li>

<li><strong>You don't really want to go too high on the ISO. </strong>I defer here to your knowledge of your camera but would you dare to shoot at ISO 3600? A lot? In my experience shooting at a lower ISO and getting underexposed photos sometimes, with judicious post-processing, produces results that are better than shooting at the "right" high ISO originally and getting a nominally correct image.</li>

</ul>

<p>The ISO is less absolute a limit than aperture and shutter speed but still, pretty firm.</p>

<p>That really leaves only one other option: trying to get more light. Unflattering light is still light. I don't know how unflattering it would be or in what way, so I can't say, but as an abstract proposition I think I'd like more light <em>of any kind</em> to work with. </p>

<p>Can you use flash? </p>

<p>Will</p>

[rick_m.]

<p>You didn't really say why strobes are not an option. Does you sister not want them during the ceremony? You could talk to her about that.</p>

<p> </p>

[Hector Javkin]

<blockquote>

<p>The cinema does have lighting of course, but probably not the most flattering.</p>

</blockquote>

<p><em><strong>Probably?</strong></em> Can't rely on <em>probably</em>. You need to find out what the lighting is, especially if flash is really out of the question.</p>

[Marcus Ian]

<p>Depending on the type of cinema, the lighting may be better than you expect. If it's a movie theatre, then yeah, you are pretty screwed, but if the building was designed with a stage of pretty much any sort, than it has some lighting. I would also bet that it'd be pretty easy to set up two or three spotlights. - diffused, they could give enough ambient to give background, and one for the subjects should give enough light to let everybody see whats going on. <br>

As Hector alludes, this is something you need to proactively manage - now. You need to get into the site, and evaluate and test shoot with <em>whatever</em> the available lighting is, and make a plan based on that. I expect it may not be as bad as you think.</p>

 

[tom_mann1]

<p>If the ceiling is some neutral color, you'd be surprised how much a little fill flash bounced up towards the ceiling will help, and how few people will even notice that a flash went off.</p>

<p>As an example, at a wedding several years ago, for various reasons, I had 10,000 to 15,000 watt-seconds of Prophoto studio strobes pointed up at the ceiling of a large room. Not one single person said anything about it.</p>

<p>Tom M</p>

[green_photog]

<p>Rich, if it was me, I would tell them couple the best way to handle a difficult situation like this is B&W.</p>

[fuccisphotos]

<p>Also you can rent a body like the 5dmkIII which has much better low light performance and the placement of the buttons on the body is VERY similar. </p>

[s_loris]

Ask the cinema - chat to them on the phone, ask if you can do a test shoot. If they want to be a wedding venue, I am sure they would oblige. They might also want to use any good picks for their wedding promotions so it could very much be in their interest to help out.

[alex_bruce]

<p>Hi Rich,</p>

<p>I'm with Vail...RENT! Not sure if you're in a metropolitan area where you can stop into someplace like Calumet and talk to the rental guy but if not you can still rent online. I've never done it but I hear it's relatively cheap and easy. You could rent a body like the 5DmkIII as well as some really fast glass and you very well might be OK.</p>

<p>I would suggest renting some very fast glass way ahead of time and going down to the venue with the rented glass on your 7D for a little test to see what kind of results you get. You might find that the 7D and rented lenses will work fine which would save you the expense of renting the body.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

[stephen_mcpherson]

<p>Rich, while I agree that strobes - even the so called portable ones - aren't always a good solution; have you given any thought to using a speed light or two? You can mount the remote ones just about anywhere with tripods or clamps.<br>

Personally, I've always had good results using a speed light on a bracket like a stroboframe. Keeps the speed light above the camera when shooting in landscape or portrait mode, and really helps with reducing shadows, etc.</p>

[rich_turner2]

<p>Hi all,<br>

Really sorry for the lack of response. I'm sure I ticked the "receive email updates" box but I didn't get any emails through. I just assumed I had had no replies so haven't been back until now.<br>

There's been some really helpful replies, much appreciated. For the record, I currently have a 7D, 17-55 f2.8, 70-200 2.8L, 430EX and 580E ii. I'm very tempted to buy either a 5Dii or 5DIII or possibly even a 6D, just trying to work out budget. I'd also trade the 17-55 for a 24-70 2.8l. I quite like the 7D, but I've always felt a little let down by the images and I'm tempted with full frame. If I'm going to upgrade, doing it before the wedding would make sense. In fact I have my other sister's wedding in April (busy year) so I have two good excuses for upgrading :)<br>

Anyway, that aside, I am going to be visiting at some point in the near future and they're fine about test shots. The cinema is the the oldest in the UK in Birmingham: http://www.theelectric.co.uk. There's a few shots on line from other weddings and I was going to try and contact some of the photographers that have shot there to see if they have any tips<br>

I'd rather not use flash mid ceremony as I think it's distracting. Obviously I want to take decent shots, but I want to be as invisible as possible. There will be opportunities do some some flash work, but I don't want to use flash throughout. I guess we could do some posed shots after the ceremony but it's not quite the same.<br>

I've never used brollies or anything with flash guns, any reconsideration? I hadn't thought of asking if they can diffuse the existing lighting, worth a shot.<br>

I also hadn't thought of hiring a really fast lens, that could be an option. Do you get enough DOF? I guess so long as you shoot straight on and get the eyes it works.<br>

Will keep doing the research and let you know if I find anything. The budget isn't huge (this isn't my job after all) but I can always buy second hand a re-sell afterwards. I do this a lot on eBay and mostly break even, sometimes I even profit!<br>

Thanks for the tips, any other would be much appreciated.</p>

<p>Rich</p>

<p>.</p>

<p> </p>

[ellery_chua___singapore]

<p>If you think you have problems doing a decent job be kind to your sister(s) have them get a professional for the job as main photographer. You can dabble for fun just do not get in the way of the main shooter. <br>

You can shoot at high iso - with a newish body shooting at 3200 or 6400 should be do able provided you get the exposure right. Noise can be handled if you know how. If you plan to shoot at maximum 400asa then best turn down the task it will be a total disaster for an existing light shoot. Even with high iso, you should use a flash to make the lighting work for you. People normally do not notice a flash or two but if you are shooting motor drive with a flash then that would be distracting. Note that shooting a 2.8/1.4 is not for every shot. <br>

There is nothing holy about existing light - light is just a tool we use. Where it comes from is not material what is how we craft it to do what we want. </p>