backup

[gary_sempler]

HI guys. I just landed a school district team and individual sports contract that will have 1200 students. I have a

sb-900.It overheats way to often,It overheated after just 45 shots yesterday and I was not shooting rapid fire by

any means. Should I get a sb 400,700 or sb-910 for backup. I will need some light stands and soft boxes or

defusers also for off camare stuff out side and in. Their should be enough money to work with after fall sports.

Also do you know any web sites on creative lighting for sports shots like high contrast and cross lighting. Thanks

Gary.

[Matt Laur]

<p>How are you using your single SB-900 now? Meaning, are you out in sunlight and using it to fill shadows? Are you in the shade, and using it as a key light? Is your ISO so low or your lens stopped down to the point where you must use the flash at full power, and frequently (more than once a minute)? Need a little more to go on, here.<br /><br />Regardless, you're doing commercial work. You <em>must</em> have backup equipment no matter what else you might do to mitigate such issues.<br /><br />Are you working near power? If you're stationary, and have AC available, consider getting something simple like a B800 from Alien Bees. It's going to be far more powerful and able to go all day, as long as you have the juice. If you're workong on arranged groups of people or individual subjects that are all in the same place, just plug in and use something with real horsepower.<br /><br />Mind you, I have an SB-900 (and an 800), and have managed to trip the 900's thermal protection just once. But I also avoid constantly firing it at full power. If would be good to hear more about the exposure situation in which you find yourself.</p>

[craig_shearman1]

<p>I've had the same problem with the SB-900 and have simply turned off the thermal cutoff feature. It's more important to me that the flash fire when it's supposed to than to worry about overheating. The issue has been discussed on here before. The consensus seems to be that the SB-900 is not significantly more likely to overheat that any previous Nikon flash, but that Nikon added this feature to reduce the number of units they might have to replace under warranty. Previous models didn't have the feature and worked just fine without it. A flash that does reach the point of overheating on a regular basis might eventually die sooner than one that never overheats. But no one seems to report flashes bursting into flames or starting to smoke.</p>

[gary_sempler]

Thanks Matt. I will be outside 1\2 and 1\2 in. Outside I will be in the sun with subjects facing me while i'm facing the sun as to really make the shot pop as my backgrounds are mostly burnt grass or dirt. Have you ever heard of shooting team and idividuals all inside the school aditorium to create dramatic lighting. I'm new to this. Thanks. Any team & individual photography websites On learning work flow for this kind of job. I have 30 years experience, just not just doing this kind of work. Thanks again.

[michael_madio]

<p>"I will be in the sun with subjects facing me while i'm facing the sun as to really make the shot pop" ... for high volume shooting you're out of speedlight territory and into studio lights (rent a generator or get battery operated units if there's no AC power available). A single ~60Ws flash will be working very hard to compete with the sun. From a budget perspective, consider that you can get a 640Ws unit + accessories (e.g. AlienBees B1600) for less than the SB-910 and it will go all day without over-heating.</p>

[Matt Laur]

<p>Agreed on the B1600 (or better yet, an Einstein). And check out a Vagabond Mini or two. Hundreds of shots per charge, so no need to rely on grid power.</p>

[sheldonnalos]

<p>+1</p>

<p>A speedlight is not the right tool for this job. A decent monolight with a softbox or umbrella is not going to cost much more than a SB910 and will give you MUCH more power and fewer headaches. </p>

[gary_sempler]

I will only be shooting one or two teams a day if that makes a differnce. What about 2 vivitar 285s with my sb-900 and baby a sb-400. I know I need stands that hold my flashes. I'm thinking I need at least three I like to put a back lite on the hair when posible. Shooting into the sun I would shoot open flash to have enough power, right ? mabe. I also need to know what to get to fire the flashes. Just a idea to keep it cheep to start with.

[michael_madio]

<p>"I will only be shooting one or two teams a day if that makes a differnce" ... not really. Speaking as a parent with kids on sports teams, we don't like to wait for photos so flash recycle is a big concern. I would also be weary of complicated setups that take more time ... go for simple, fast, and safe.<br>

<br>

"What about 2 vivitar 285s" ... these take ~5 seconds to recover from a full power flash and they can over-heat to the point of literally melting themselves down (don't ask me how I know!). As mentioned before, you're in studio light territory which doesn't necessarily mean expensive ... AlienBees are quite "budget" but you can go a step lower still by looking at the Adorama Flashpoint II units (a friend has a few and they work very well). Also consider that the studio lights have an integral stand mount where you would have to buy one for a hot-shoe flash (e.g. <a href="http://www.adorama.com/BG2905.html">http://www.adorama.com/BG2905.html</a>).</p>

<p>"Shooting into the sun I would shoot open flash to have enough power, right?" ... pretty much. This will make for long recycle times and will over-heat the flashes. Depending on the distance (groups?) and modifiers, you most likely will not have enough power.<br>

<br>

"I also need to know what to get to fire the flashes" ... you can use sync cables, optical, or radio remotes. Studio lights use generic 1/4" audio jacks while hot-shoe flashes may or may not have PC sync connectors, in which case you need adapters (more cost). Studio lights also have integral optical slaves so all you need is a sync cable (typically included) to your closest light and the others will trigger optically. As for budget radio triggers, I recommend either Paul Buff CyberSyncs or for even less, Cactus V5 triggers.<br>

<br>

</p>

[gary_sempler]

Thanks. Everyone has had a peice of my puzzle so far. What Size genorater should I look for, for the lights we have talked about.Umbrellas are out do to wind, still shoot open with three lights for the team shots and the individual shots,rember the hair light

[michael_madio]

<p>"What Size genorater should I look for, for the lights we have talked about" ... it depends on the lights you're getting. Look at the generator + light specs to determine what is appropriate for you.</p>

[Matt Laur]

<p>I'd skip the generator (for all sorts of reasons), and just go with the <a href="http://www.paulcbuff.com/vagabond.php"><strong>Vagabond Mini</strong></a> to power up your monolights. So much easier than a generator and across-the-ground cables when you're out around kids. Safety first, ease of use second. The VM's cover both.</p>

[craig_shearman1]

<p>"What about 2 vivitar 285s" ... these take ~5 seconds to recover from a full power flash and they can over-heat to the point of literally melting themselves down (don't ask me how I know!). <br /><br />A Vivitar 285 connected to a Quantum Turbo recycles in less than a second on a full pop. And I've been using them for close to 30 years and have never seen one overheat or melt down.<br /><br />I think you are way overthinking all of this. I've done a couple of team shoots myself and watched many others when my kids were in little league/soccer. I wouldn't shoot straight into sun (you'll get flare), but you definitely want the kids facing away from the sun to keep them from squinting. Just about any camera body and just about any lens in the 24-70 range, even a kit lens, will do. Speedlight on the camera with a Quantum Turbo or equivalent so you don't wait for recycling. You line up the team two or three rows deep and do several frames of the group shot from maybe 10-15 feet away. Then you do headshots from mabye 5-10 feet away. I note the distances because it's not a big deal for even a speedlite to handle that close. No light stands. No umbrellas. Maybe a flash bracket. Definitely no hair light (the sun will handle that for you if they are not wearing hats, and it's not necessary if they are wearing hats.) This is meatball photography, not anything fancy. It has to be in focus, the exposure has to be right and the kids have to have their eyes open. Anything beyond that is icing on the cake.</p>